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dirt claud
Sport climber
san diego,ca
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Aug 30, 2010 - 06:33pm PT
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Matt,
It's not a ploy. And your right, I don't expect you to change my biases as you say, but if your going to chime in and call me ignorant at least tell me why I'm ignorant about this issue and back it up with some proof. Otherwise, don't insult me unless your willing to do it in person.
I may not agree with what many on here have to say, but I don't insult them. I mean sh#t, you don't even know me. Apparently because I'm questioning what other forms of Islam are out there and that I don't see one I must be ignorant. Well hell at least I'm admitting I may be wrong and If I am, I'm willing to own up to it.
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Norton
Social climber
the Wastelands
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Aug 30, 2010 - 06:46pm PT
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I like this Dirt Cloud in that he appears solidly honest, wants to learn,
and is willing to say he is wrong, is and when proved otherwise.
What am I missing?
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Skeptimistic
Mountain climber
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Aug 30, 2010 - 07:12pm PT
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Show me an article or internet link denouncing violent Islam by a Muslim
Ok, I'll bite. It took an incredibly long 0.17 seconds using a cable modem searching Google to come up with this link: Muslims for peace
Now I'll be the first to admit that the search results only turned up a paltry 16.2 million hits, so really there is so little evidence available to support the notion of peace-loving Muslims that you are perfectly justified in keeping your "Koran=hate" viewpoint.
Next!...
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HighDesertDJ
Trad climber
Swimming in LEB tears.
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Aug 30, 2010 - 07:17pm PT
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dirtclaud-
So you've indignantly posted twice on this page that you want examples of how your characterization of the Christian Bible as preaching "goodness" and the Koran preaching "evil" is ignorant. It makes a nice sandwich for the huge post I made between them where I cite a sampling of Biblical verses saying many of the same things that you've said the Koran says. Are you going to bother responding to it or does it suit you better to simply keep on poking the coals?
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Matt
Trad climber
primordial soup
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Aug 30, 2010 - 07:53pm PT
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blew-
well yeah, no doubt those cats are pissed about the mosque debacle and all the intolerant posters on ST!
and how about the Israeli Rabi praying for the deaths of Palestinians?
or don't you read that news?
dc-
i am not insulting you, but-
you ARE ignorant.
what was all that about one kind of Muslim?
do you have any idea how many Muslims there are?
where have you ever been?
it's not a matter of me calling you something as an insult, it's a matter of you being ignorant. feel free to educate yourself and it may become less and less the case(?).
hey, at least i didn't say you are an ugly mofo, that's a bit harder to fix...
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, CA
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Aug 30, 2010 - 07:57pm PT
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It ain't radical Muslims who occupy Afghanistan, Iraq, the West Bank and East Jerusalem, bleuDawg.
No, not anymore...
Matt, yeah, I heard that. He was calling for people who want to do Israel harm, cursed. So what?
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Matt
Trad climber
primordial soup
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Aug 30, 2010 - 08:05pm PT
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what he said, as quoted by bbc online:
Rabbi Yosef expressed the wish that "all the nasty people who hate Israel, like Abu Mazen (Abbas), vanish from our world".
He went on to say: "May God strike them down with the plague along with all the nasty Palestinians who persecute Israel."
blew-
many muslims believe america wants to, and has actively been, doing muslims harm, and yet if they were to make an identical prayer, you would be up in arms.
there's a word for that, what is it?
i think it starts with an "h", has a "yp" in there.... hmmmm.
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dirt claud
Sport climber
san diego,ca
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Aug 30, 2010 - 08:05pm PT
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ok, I asked for examples of where there is a sect of Islam religion that didn't preach these bad parts of the Koran and looks like Skeptic sent one. Thanks, I'm actually checking out the site right now and plan to call and talk to someone so I can better understand.
I don't know why I got a bunch of examples of how Christianity compares to Islam. I don't care about that. I used it as a comparison because other religions have many diffirent sects, they teach the same religions in diffirent variations. Meanings are read and understood diffirently. I don't see that in the teachings of Koran. How many diffirent ways is it interpreted? Where is the one that says not to kill non muslims and not mistreat woman.
My main intrigue was there doesn't appear to be diffirent variations of the Koran like there is of the Bible.(once again just an example)
It's a fact that the quotes I put up are from the Koran. Set me straight if I'm wrong as I'm sure you will have no problem doing. My question is "If there is only one version of the Koran than what do they do with those parts that talk about getting rid of infadels and the treatent of woman? Am I looking at two diffirent versions of the Koran? Hopefully they can clarify these questions for me.
It's clear you guys think I hate all muslims, truth is I don't mind them at all. It's not like if I see someone who appers to follow Islam I assume their bad. i never said I hated muslims or wanted to get rid of them, simply am confused about their teachings. If there is any people who follow or know more about Islam than cool, let me know where I'm way off.
As I said if I'm way off, I can admit that and if anything be glad I'm not as ignorant to the issue anymore.
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dirt claud
Sport climber
san diego,ca
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Aug 30, 2010 - 08:13pm PT
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So Mattyboy you really get off on insulting people hiding behind that screen huhh? A true man if I ever so one.
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, CA
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Aug 30, 2010 - 08:13pm PT
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blew-
many muslims believe america wants to, and has actively been, doing muslims harm, and yet if they were to make an identical prayer, you would be up in arms.
Why always the equivocation? Do you have any sense of right and wrong? Any sense of legitimacy? You don't, apparently.
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Skeptimistic
Mountain climber
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Aug 30, 2010 - 08:22pm PT
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DC- Let me retract the invective tone of my post. If we can take you at face value in your apparent desire to understand the entire issue from multiple viewpoints, I applaud you. I for one welcome those on this forum who can resist the impulse to sling insults instead of facts; something we all fail at occasionally, but I'm tryin'...
Good onya!
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Matt
Trad climber
primordial soup
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Aug 30, 2010 - 08:25pm PT
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So Mattyboy you really get off on insulting people hiding behind that screen huhh? A true man if I ever so one.
is it me that's insulting you, or you that's insulting millions of people?
maybe your perspective is a bit self absorbed?
that's a nice combination, eh?
ignorant and self absorbed...
=)
Ps- i'll happily say those things to your face. cheers.
edit-
wrt your last post, where you are off is in describing millions of people, and definitively so, when you in fact know little or nothing about them. all you are doing is repeating what you have heard? and even that is not much.
if you really think direction (to what? some link or another?) is what you need, i'd counter that no, you need some exposure, and some curiosity, that's what you need. maybe you ought to buy a plane ticket, and try to meet some people with a life different than your own.
btw, being ignorant is not necessarily a bad thing. there are many things i am ignorant of, and i freely admit it.
i, however, cannot be found posting on the www about things i am ignorant of...
and btw-
if you are older than a high school kid, i'm even more surprised.
if you are just a kid (or just acting like a kid), then please try to learn a thing or two from this debate, like maybe it's best to keep yourself from spewing mindlessly (or even just quietly making assumptions?) about people you perceive as being different from you. "they" are less different than you'd imagine.
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dirt claud
Sport climber
san diego,ca
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Aug 30, 2010 - 08:31pm PT
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It's all good Skeptimistic. I can take some funny pictures and jabs, but if I'm gonna get called ignorant because I don't know much about one particular issue that's messed up. But, whatever it's clear, that here in ST anyaway, if I'm of more conservative values I'm instantly conceived as a hating, gun totting, nationalist. I was ready for all this anyway.
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dirt claud
Sport climber
san diego,ca
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Aug 30, 2010 - 08:42pm PT
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Awesome Matt, hope to see you in San Diego sometime, or if your from the area let me know. Don't care to get into a physical confrontation unless I have to, but would love to tell you to go f*#kyourself to your face as well.
You seam like a real narcissit, have you never posted anything on a site and been wrong before. or for that matter, been wrong about anything?
Just because you've been around the world Magellan doesn't mean your better than me or anyone else. Practice what you preach as#@&%e.
I never said I hated anyone, and admitted when I was off base.
Whatever traveling you have done sure hasn't taught you much about intercating with others who differ in opinions from yours.
No, I'm not a high school kid. Just someone who was wrong about something.
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Matt
Trad climber
primordial soup
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Aug 30, 2010 - 08:45pm PT
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soooo, you are sayin you're a high school kid and ain't never been nowhere or talked to nobody? mostly just livin in yer white neighborhood, goin to your white school?
thought so.
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dirt claud
Sport climber
san diego,ca
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Aug 30, 2010 - 08:48pm PT
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Born in Mexico City, been in the States since I was 5. Raised in normal middle class family.
Got that one right on Matt. Sounds like your the one that makes assumptions. Would be glad to send proof of my birth certificate unlike Obama.
Matt wrote:
is it me that's insulting you, or you that's insulting millions of people?
I apologize, I had no idea millions of muslims read ST.
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graniteclimber
Trad climber
Nowhere
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Aug 30, 2010 - 08:52pm PT
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"Born in Mexico City, been in the States since I was 5. Raised in normal middle class family."
So do you even remember Mexico?
What is your idea of a "normal middle class family?"
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Matt
Trad climber
primordial soup
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Aug 30, 2010 - 08:53pm PT
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I am just going off the level of intelligence and worldliness you display.
and btw, i've been to san diego, plenty, and believe it or not, it's pretty damn white. maybe not iowa white, but pretty white.
how long you lived there?
and how many muslims you know?
hmmm?
where have you ever been?
a few beaches?
a few parks?
good for you, get back to me after some growing up.
until then, do try to avoid making vast generalizations about large portions of the world's population without any 1st hand info whatsoever.!
thanks in advance.
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