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WBraun
climber
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Jan 16, 2008 - 01:05am PT
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Nah sorry healyje I can't. When the slow, stop command comes over the radio I can't make out the intelligibility. You'll just go screaming at speed straight into the ground.
If you don't believe me ask any current or ex yosar member.
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graniteclimber
Trad climber
Nowhere
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Jan 16, 2008 - 01:06am PT
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I hadn't noticed that Richard rekindled the WOS debate by posting in the Bill Russell thread. That was stupid. He should have stuck with his resolution on 12/31 and let it go.
But then if someone sh#t on my gear, I wouldn't let it go either. Also, the WOS haters can't let it go either, even after 25 years, and no one even sh#t on their gear or chopped their routes.
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healyje
Trad climber
Portland, Oregon
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Jan 16, 2008 - 01:09am PT
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No squeeze job - completely virgin territory around the SE corner that's never been climbed - still inbounds, though. Above that 35 foot roof there are several more somewhat smaller ones up above it on the three pitch headwall no one has ever seen let alone climbed on. Well, go out to the tracks and you can see it about as well as one could have seen Mark and Richard on WoS.
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Mimi
climber
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Jan 16, 2008 - 01:10am PT
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You've got to be kidding!
Just when I had you for a troll, I realize you're a twinky. Thanks for clearing that up. Does the twinky have a name?
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healyje
Trad climber
Portland, Oregon
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Jan 16, 2008 - 01:11am PT
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"You'll just go screaming at speed straight into the ground. "
Werner, just how is that likely to be any different an outcome than if I get on WoS when or if I ever manage to make it down there...?
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healyje
Trad climber
Portland, Oregon
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Jan 16, 2008 - 01:12am PT
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Oh, mimi - you're welcome to come up and get creamy with me too...
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Mimi
climber
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Jan 16, 2008 - 01:17am PT
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You're not my type, Joe, nor are the guys you're supporting. And I'm not into twinky cream. The name just came to mind. All this time I thought it was another identity of Richard's. Kinda like that gunsmoke guy, Mark.
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healyje
Trad climber
Portland, Oregon
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Jan 16, 2008 - 01:51am PT
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Mimi, still climbing or just posting nowdays? Then as now twinky is as twinky does, hon...
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Mimi
climber
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Jan 16, 2008 - 01:54am PT
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Yes, I still love to climb, Joe. So you must know twinky? Who might he be? He's shy and won't tell us his name.
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Jaybro
Social climber
The West
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Jan 16, 2008 - 02:07am PT
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I get your point Mimi (back to the one she addressed to me) but what's to be gained, at this point, by dragging this on, even more than it has been flogged already? a clearing of history? a cautionary tale for those yet to come? I respect the views on all sides, will we hear something new if this keeps on?
Looks like a cool line to me, Joe!
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healyje
Trad climber
Portland, Oregon
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Jan 16, 2008 - 02:14am PT
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Just so there are some clear, specific statements about the route from a non-twinky who has actually been on the route, here is Ammon's statement from the Bill Russel thread:
"since Madbolter continues to drag my name into the WOS debate I feel I need to set the record straight on a few things. I reported honestly on MY experience on the first two pitches and only on the first two pitches. I didn’t find any enhanced placements or bathook holes like I’ve heard a number of people claim. Also, the drilling of rivets and bolts were well spaced apart and it’s not a bolt ladder like it seems to appear in the Reid book."
Those are quantitative facts from a source we can agree is relatively unimpeachable by either side. Then he gives his qualitative opinion of the route:
That being said; There is a reason I didn’t continue the route, and it’s not because it was too hard. As many of you know, I am not afraid to whip and will put my butt on the line anytime IF I think the route is worthy. The two pitches I climbed reminded me of doing one of those 5000 piece puzzles, where you just stare at the pieces all day and nothing gets done. If that’s your cup-o-tea, then this route is for you. It bores the crap (no pun intended) out of me."
Followed up by comments somewhat more germane to style / ethics / worthiness of the line relative to other Valley routes old and new:
"In my opinion it seemed contrived, especially for the next ascent, since on the first ascent if you get to a blank place where you can’t go any further, you just drill. To follow such a route you have to keep trying different “puzzle pieces” until you found the exact way that was done on the FA, that kind of climbing is uninteresting, to me. If I would have found it interesting or remotely fun, I would have continued the ascent."
Those are [roughly] three distinct categories of [valid] commentary on the line. The first speaks to the reality of the route in stone; the second in all likelyhood to why it has only seen one 'innocent' second ascent attempt (by the Looking Glass team); and the third talks to issues which could construed as contributing to any debate of the 'worthiness', 'purpose', or 'utility' of any route up the slab.
Agree or disagree with anything he writes - but it represents observations, opinion, and commentary rooted in actual experience on the route. Slab climbing of any sort isn't my sort of thing given the only way to get upsidedownis to dive down them headfirst. And I probably also share his assessment of the utility of any route up the slab relative to the practicality of second ascents which pretty much brings in to question the what practical 'legacy' such FA's leave to the collection of routes in the Valley. But as a clueless and ballsy thing to step up and attempt as a first FA - thumbs up every f*#king time.
Like I said, after all this noise I just have to try and get down to take a dive on it myself even if not really my deal.
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Mimi
climber
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Jan 16, 2008 - 02:17am PT
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Jaybro, being fuzzy on the number of enhancements loses plausible believability considering Richard's meticulous recordkeeping. So, yeah, a clearing of history would be appropriate.
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healyje
Trad climber
Portland, Oregon
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Jan 16, 2008 - 02:17am PT
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Well, mimi, then the invitation stands to you as well - clearly just another easy and contrived twinky line for the likes of the mighty mimi.
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Mimi
climber
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Jan 16, 2008 - 02:20am PT
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Joe, you of all people know it doesn't matter whether I climb the route.
Who is graniteclimber and why do you avoid naming him?
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yo
climber
The Eye of the Snail
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Jan 16, 2008 - 02:20am PT
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She's doing the Streaked Wall with me first.
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WBraun
climber
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Jan 16, 2008 - 02:21am PT
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Where angels and demigods dare to tread, the mighty man mortal healyje will go.
LOL, just pulling your chain man. Best of luck to you .......
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Mimi
climber
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Jan 16, 2008 - 02:21am PT
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Really, The Streaked! That would be awesome!
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yo
climber
The Eye of the Snail
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Jan 16, 2008 - 02:22am PT
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hehe
Bring yur hammer and 24 figurines.
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Mimi
climber
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Jan 16, 2008 - 02:33am PT
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I'll bring my hammer alright but I'll try not to use it.
Edit: Do you think they were referring to Fig Newtons?
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healyje
Trad climber
Portland, Oregon
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Jan 16, 2008 - 03:10am PT
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Werner,
I said I'm going to try - I may or may not get off the ground and don't know if I'll make it one pitch / foot or nine pitches / feet. As I said, not really my cup of tea at all and I have zip experience with anything like it. Could get completely shut down if Ammon and Pete are correct, but hey, at least I will have attempted to see it for myself. And don't nobody sh#t on my ropes as it's likely I'll do that deed for you myself in the process. I'm also betting my attempt will rank way up there warranting at least a footnote symbol to be ripped from the anals of Valley history.
[ Mimi, who are you calling GC a twinky? Sounded like you were calling me one; but on re-reading it I'm guessing you were talking about whomever GC may be (I have no idea). The whole anonymous-with-a-'twinky'-name thing blows, people should have to use their names or list who the f*#k they are in their profile ]
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