Discussion Topic |
|
This thread has been locked |
Steve Grossman
Trad climber
Seattle, WA
|
|
|
Topic Author's Original Post - Jan 15, 2008 - 12:09pm PT
|
Alrighty then Tadpoles! Your little cesspool has dried up and it's time to stand tall or whatever it is that Tadpoles do!?!
Before the quasi historical vivisection begins, just one teensy little clarification concerning the Pilgrim's Ponderous Pride and Perniciously Problematic Payload. Still steaming after all these decades, the Unholy Pile.
I would like to keep it simple because I know how you must blather on so....................................
Is the bloated half ton Appendix yours and accurate?
Or is it your editor's appendix?
Or did you suddenly receive his appendix or he yours, ten feet off of the ground on Wings of Steel, and THAT'S what changed everything!?!?!?!?
|
|
JuanDeFuca
Big Wall climber
Stoney Point
|
|
|
Jan 15, 2008 - 12:12pm PT
|
Does anyone know when the war with Iran starts?
Juan "Son of Migrants" De Fuca
|
|
the Fet
Knackered climber
A bivy sack in the secret campground
|
|
|
Jan 15, 2008 - 12:54pm PT
|
Wow, look at all that sh#t.
Didn't those guys know there is only one style to climb in that's acceptable? Don't they know that everyone climbs for the same reasons?
|
|
ontheedgeandscaredtodeath
Trad climber
San Francisco, Ca
|
|
|
Jan 15, 2008 - 01:01pm PT
|
Downward spiral is right. How old are you? Get a life.
|
|
the Fet
Knackered climber
A bivy sack in the secret campground
|
|
|
Jan 15, 2008 - 01:03pm PT
|
And what's with 24 pkgs of figurines?
You got Jesus, the wisemen, the apostles, some angels, but do you really need 24?
|
|
deuce4
Big Wall climber
the Southwest
|
|
|
Jan 15, 2008 - 01:29pm PT
|
Leaving the ground with 185 bolts! That's not even sporting. Back then, a new route that was expected to need 75 drilled holes was considered highly contrived.
Barbella and I climbed the Atlantic Ocean Wall with only 58 new holes total, in 1985. I think we brought along 25 some odd bolts (for belays), and maybe 40-50 rivets max.
Wings of Steel is what it is, a route that didn't set any standards or has significance in the historical realm of things (except for the local's reaction), but probably quite difficult in a contrived sort of way, but which apparently doesn't really appeal to anyone.
Still, there were other routes throughout the years that were "retro" in terms of standards. I'm a little baffled why this one gets so much attention and reaction (including mine, I suppose).
|
|
deuce4
Big Wall climber
the Southwest
|
|
|
Jan 15, 2008 - 01:37pm PT
|
Still, I suppose these guys should be commended for not drilling all their bolts they were prepared to drill. When you think about it, their 385 bolts and rivets x 6 feet per drilled placement (easy to do when topstepping on less-than-vertical) = 2310 feet of continuous bolt ladder.
Instead, they 'only' drilled 145 holes, take away 30 or so for belays, so 110 x 6 = 660', so only about a third of their new ground was drilled.
|
|
Clint Cummins
Trad climber
SF Bay area, CA
|
|
|
Jan 15, 2008 - 01:38pm PT
|
> Back then, a new route that was expected to need 75 drilled holes was considered highly contrived.
But that is for routes which had some cracks. The analogy is like doing a new route on the Apron - it will take more bolts per pitch than if you are doing a crack climb. They were doing a "slab hooking" route.
|
|
Mimi
climber
|
|
|
Jan 15, 2008 - 01:42pm PT
|
The only reason it gets any attention is due to the two goofs that did it continue to try and slip their travesty past people as some prized accomplishment. People who don't know what really happened continue to believe them and those of us who know better continue to call them on it.
They dropped their sharpening stones or there would've been more filled holes. But they had no trouble using their blunt bits to enhance. Tiny, little 12-point font crystals is all they removed for their hooks. Yeah, right. taptaptaptaptaptaptaptap
|
|
Clint Cummins
Trad climber
SF Bay area, CA
|
|
|
Jan 15, 2008 - 01:43pm PT
|
Steve,
What is the point of the insults? So what if they were slow and brought a lot of gear? Are you hoping they will say "We wish we had not done it?"
Are you concerned about the possibility that other people will put up similar parallel routes on the big slab there?
If you hate it so much, why don't you just get over there and chop the whole thing?
|
|
Clint Cummins
Trad climber
SF Bay area, CA
|
|
|
Jan 15, 2008 - 01:46pm PT
|
Mimi,
> People who don't know what really happened continue to believe them and those of us who know better continue to call them on it.
Bring some real evidence to the table if you want to make that claim. So far, all I've seen from you and Steve is hate and claims with no photos or actual observations except for that pitch which intersects Horse Chute.
Pete, Tom, Randy, and Ammon have brought real observations and photos to the discussion. But you and Steve seem to rely on reports from anonymous choppers from 25 years ago, and do not respond to the evidence from last summer. Get real.
|
|
healyje
Trad climber
Portland, Oregon
|
|
|
Jan 15, 2008 - 01:50pm PT
|
Fess up now, who among you Supertopians [n]ever once turned a curious or covetious eye towards that slab?
|
|
Mimi
climber
|
|
|
Jan 15, 2008 - 01:53pm PT
|
Funny how the pitch seen from Horse Chute doesn't count. Nor does the mountain of evidence provided in their book, when they were being honest for once, that points toward total technical incompetence. And the other eyewitness (who don't post here) accounts of what they saw and heard at the time don't count. And the fact that because of what they were doing, they had to get permission to climb from the rangers. How many parties have you ever heard of having to get permission to do a route because their competence was questioned?
|
|
Jaybro
Social climber
The West
|
|
|
Jan 15, 2008 - 01:58pm PT
|
Did you see any of the figurines,Jody?
|
|
Nefarius
Big Wall climber
Fresno, CA
|
|
|
Jan 15, 2008 - 01:58pm PT
|
"Still, I suppose these guys should be commended for not drilling all their bolts they were prepared to drill. When you think about it, their 385 bolts and rivets x 6 feet per drilled placement (easy to do when topstepping on less-than-vertical) = 2310 feet of continuous bolt ladder.
They only drilled 145 anchors, take away 30 or so for belays, so 110 x 6 = 660', so only about a third of their new ground was drilled."
I'm lost, JM. Just not following you there. It may be just me though - I *did* take a pretty decent fall recently and suffer a slight concussion. Good thing it was an aid pitch, or I wouldn't have been wearing a helmet! Of course, if it wasn't an aid pitch, I doubt I'd have inverted either.
|
|
Tomcat
Trad climber
Chatham N.H.
|
|
|
Jan 15, 2008 - 02:40pm PT
|
Mimi,how can they have "total technical incompetance",and no one can repeat the route?
I can't imagine having so much negative to say about a route I can't do.
P.S.I really loved the comment in part 27 or 59,I fergit which,where someone surmises their sins(in granite no less)have been washed away.This corresponds exactly with the continuous upgrading of granite slab climbs worldwide.....lol!!!!
|
|
graniteclimber
Trad climber
Nowhere
|
|
|
Jan 15, 2008 - 02:48pm PT
|
Was there an honest question in there, or was that just the rantings of a bitter old man?
Steve, It is your crediblity that is under a cloud now. Can you prove you didn't enhance hook placements on Sea of Dreams?
|
|
Mungeclimber
Trad climber
sorry, just posting out loud.
|
|
|
Jan 15, 2008 - 02:54pm PT
|
Tomcat, I hate The Nose, still haven't done it. Nothing wrong with that approach. :)
|
|
dirtineye
Trad climber
the south
|
|
|
Jan 15, 2008 - 03:01pm PT
|
Will someone just retro bolt this thing into the mother of all sport climbs?
|
|
Mimi
climber
|
|
|
Jan 15, 2008 - 03:03pm PT
|
Tomcat, most of the 13 pitches (plus 9 of Aquarian) of this route have been repeated by different parties including the 'crux' second pitch.
Dirt, it's only a matter of time.
And why are elcapfool's observations of doctored placements disregarded?
|
|
|
SuperTopo on the Web
|
Let us know!