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ME Climb
climber
Behind the Orange Curtain
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Man it sucks going from the hero cop to the bad cop on this site.
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Elcapinyoazz
Social climber
Joshua Tree
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Do you own homework, here's a taste to get you started:
Summit County, Ohio medical examiner Lisa J. Kohler cited Taser use as a cause of death in three cases, Mark D. McCullaugh, Dennis S. Hyde, and Richard Holcomb.
July 2005, UK. Police Tasered a man in hypoglycemic shock, believing that he was a potential security threat. A medical examiner ruled for the first time that a Taser was the primary factor in a death
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WBraun
climber
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Huh?
ME Climb
Well ,,, don't just stand there.
Taze their asses ....
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corniss chopper
climber
breaking the speed of gravity
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Welcome to Rancho Corral de Tierra.
A Dog Walkers Paradise
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Chaz
Trad climber
greater Boss Angeles area
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If I shot a cop with a Taser, I'd bet anything the charge would be assault with a DEADLY weapon upon a peace officer.
A responsible cop only uses a Taser in place of other DEADLY weapons, and only when a response with DEADLY force would be warranted. And only then.
If they can't exercise that basic responsibility, then we should take away all their weapons until they earn our trust back by demonstrating they can behave responsibly.
Apparently, the guy asked again and again "why am I being detained" - receiving no response - before he walked away.
If a cop is unable to answer that simple question, you should walk away, because it's obvious they don't even know why they stopped you.
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Dr.Sprock
Boulder climber
I'm James Brown, Bi-atch!
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what if i wanted to bump off a cop,
what would be the best way?
i saw somebody i did not like on top of yosemite falls last summer,
he could have been easily dispatched, jus sayin,
freaky if lower yosemite falls turned red for a few minutes, jus sayin,
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Dr.Sprock
Boulder climber
I'm James Brown, Bi-atch!
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i've never seen a battery on a police offoicer,
no wait, the duracell commercial,
was bob crane an ex cop?
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rectorsquid
climber
Lake Tahoe
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After all said and done wbraun hits it on the head you try to walk away from the police bad things are going to happen to you. Are you walking away because you don't like the police or is it because you just buried the body?
Could be that you asked the cop if you were free to go and they avoided answer the question. Maybe they say "You would not be asking me that if you were not guilty of some crime." or some other crap that is misleading and not meant to defuse a stressful situation. Remember the recording of the guy in the airport that had a few grand in cash to buy a car? He could not get a single straight answer about his situation from the security guards that were detaining him.
Unless there is a recording of this incident, I'm just as inclined to think that the cop escalated things as I would be to think that the guy walk away while being properly and legally detained.
But the truth is that the cop can give you all kinds of harassment, not tell you your actual legal situation, make up stuff for fun, just be a jerk, and get away with and it is in your best interest to be submissive and just take it.
Dave
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couchmaster
climber
pdx
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We're at post 162. In the old days, Ouch would have posted a pic of Fatty getting zapped by Werner (with bear 46 looking over his shoulder) and flopping all around on the ground like a fish on the dock by now.
I miss ouch. Cosmic...you awake dude?
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wbw
Trad climber
'cross the great divide
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Yes, just cooperate. I've never met one LEO who was just out to screw with peoples lives.
Cooperate, but only because things will most likely get worse if you don't. The fact is, LEOs anywhere have us by the huevos, and we are totally subject to their prejudice and whims, and in many cases ignorance. Contrary to what Fats is saying above, I believe they're all out to screw with peoples lives.
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tradmanclimbs
Ice climber
Pomfert VT
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Fatty, you think you could have caught this soccer player ;)http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=APqMRhzsJQE&feature=fvwrel
The craziest thing I was ever involved in cop related was as a teenager rideing my motorcycle with a friend. I was on a legal street bike, My friend was on a not legal dirt bike. We pulled up to a rural stop sign right behind a state trooper in a sedan, probobly a crown vic or whaterver 1978 equivilant. My friend pops a weelie and bounces his front tire on the back bumper/trunk of cruiser and then takes off like a bat out of hell> I was so young and stupid that I ran as well even though I did nothing wrong up to the point of my running. Lucky for me we split up and the trooper went after the dirt bike......
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Chaz
Trad climber
greater Boss Angeles area
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When a person being detained asks "why am I being detained?", what rationale would a L.E.O. have for not answering immediately? Especially when asked repeatedly.
Cops have to have a reason to detain somebody. What's wrong with simply articulating that reason?
Failure to answer a simple question would lead a reasonable person to believe the person being asked has no answer. No answer = no legitimate cause.
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dmons
climber
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a few months ago they indited several southern california officers for first degree murder in regards to the beating death of a seated man with known mental problems
the DA came on tv and made the statement that " when the officer acts are intimination and assault under color of authority the individual has no responsibility to conform to the officers demands, he has ever right to resist"
said it on tv
just what was it, that was actually "threatened" by a man who comitted an infraction, walking away from the meter maid?
an assault on the pigs pride is all
so the pig commits a felony assault in exchange for suciety suffering an infraction
she could have just followed him
oh wait! that would have been to much like home life with papa to bear
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Toker Villain
Big Wall climber
Toquerville, Utah
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Cost of a taser cartridge,,...... $30
Cost of a trip to the ER,.... $800
Cost of a defense attorney,... $5000
Cost of civil rights attorney,.. $10000
Seeing the ranger put on trial in federal court for violation of civil rights under color of authority?
Believe me, PRICELESS!
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corniss chopper
climber
breaking the speed of gravity
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The NPS belatedly realizes that the millions of people who have dogs 'see' themselves also as the electrocutee in this incident,
and are so upset that the smart thing to do
would be to expedite the 'transfer request' of this ranger
to some obscure Florida or Maine NP.
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Dr.Sprock
Boulder climber
I'm James Brown, Bi-atch!
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i bought a cop uniform and a tazer at the gun show last weekend,
so,
whats up?
let's roll,
i wanna see what it's like to be joe cop.
would i arrest johnny rivers for huffinn a doob?
hell no, i ain't no square,
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Dr.Sprock
Boulder climber
I'm James Brown, Bi-atch!
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everybody, please obey the law,
we got neighbors down south going nuts,
we need to be cool.
that means lots of weed, hear me?
count on weed to lift you up,
but everything in moderation, and moderation is the first to go,
you don't want to end up like phil spector,
is ronnie availble?
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bvb
Social climber
flagstaff arizona
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It seems very odd to me that nothing whatsoever on this this incident has appeared in the Morning Report. Clue #1 that the agency knows it has a legal problem on it's hands, not to mention an enormous PR debacle.
The really sad thing about all this is that the day arrived -- quite a few years ago now -- when a lot of people began to regard Park Rangers as frightening, and when approached by an LE Ranger wearing a duty belt they react with apprehension and fear, wonedering but not knowing what, if anything, they have done wrong.
I'm old enough to remember when an encounter with a ranger was cool, they were people-freindly generalists, and every kid wanted to be one. The end of that era began around 1993 or 1994 when the "Professionalization" initiative created a cadre of LE Rangers, put them all into the 6c retirement catagory, they all spent 6 weeks at FLETC, and were indoctrinated to beleive that they were law enforcement officers first, and that everything else was secondary.
I've said this many times, and I'll say it again: it was a monumental mistake on the agency's part to carve out a few people from the traditionally generalist 025 series and turn them into cops. If the NPS needs a dedicated LE presence in any park, and GGNRA is a prime example of this, they should have vastly expanded the U.S. Park Police numbers and stationed them as LE officers in the appropriate parks. That way, the common visitor would be able to distingush between ranger freindly and a police officer.
Since the early 90's, the cultural shift has been profound and the gestalt of the ranger ranks today would be utterly unrecognizable to a ranger from the 60's or 70's, or even the 80's.
I know that the vast majority of rangers in similar situations would use a little more commen sense. They simply would have stood down and called for backup. It sounds from the reports as though other rangers were on scene within moments of the tasing. What is truly bizzare and baffling and disturbing is this guy got tased in the back.
Having said that, it's obvious that the vast, vast majority of rangers are pretty cool people. The ones who aren't stick out like sore thumbs, and are often badge-heavy heat-seekers who intentionally wind up in places like the Valley district in Yosemite, or in GGNRA -- urban or semi-urban areas with plenty of LE action. There are rangers who groan with dismay every time they think they might have to suit up with tactical gear, and others who wetdream about it every night. They are two different species.
Get yourself out into the deep backcountry of any big western park and if you see a ranger at all, you'll be meeting a kindred spirit who loves being out in the wilderness as much as you do, and figured out a scam to get to be out there all the time, and get paid for it.
Either that, or you needed a rescue and they're busting their ass to help.
In any event, something about this GGNRA thing does not pass they smell test, not by a longshot.
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WBraun
climber
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6 weeks at FLETC
Actually 6 or 7 weeks is basic training for seasonal LEO not permanents.
Permanents have additional requirements now.
4 months FLETC including another 4 months in another park simultaneously.
That's 9 1/2 months total training for NPS permanents when you include their original basic training.
Along with that there's even more training on top of all that.
Not that this has anything to do with what happened in regards to this thread's events.
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