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WBraun
climber
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Depends on the rescue.
If the bolts are required in a place that required climbing to get to, then a hand drill will be most likely be carried.
Generally if bolt placement is required a bolt gun will be used, (speed).
But generally gear placement and natural anchors are preferred and used.
Sometimes a bolt will added to gear placement and natural anchors for redundancy to the high loads put on rescue systems that require life support.
10 to 1 safety factor is the norm.
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Spiny Norman
Social climber
Boring, Oregon
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Actually they do ignore it. All those holes you see drilled into the rock on the trails?
Power tools
The trees you see cut on every mile of the 800 miles of trails in Yos
Chainsaws
Read more carefully. Chainsaws are specifically identified as allowable for use by NPS in the park's 1989 Wilderness Stewardship Plan I linked above. See Appendix B. Similarly helicopters are allowed in certain cases such as for rescue.
You may not like the policies but they are there in writing, right there on the NPS web site. And if the 1989 Plan, currently the controlling document for YNP operations in wilderness areas, violates either the US or CA Wilderness Acts, the fact that it's documented provides ample basis for a lawsuit.
Have at it.
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c wilmot
climber
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Does "primative" use include honda generators, roto hammers, gas operated pionjars, motorized wheelbarrows, moterized pulleys, and motorized water pumps?
(not to mention the explosives used in the back country)
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Spiny Norman
Social climber
Boring, Oregon
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Again:
The Park's 1989 Wilderness Stewardship Plan states (p. 13):
Minimum Tool. The Service will use the minimum tool necessary to carry out management and research functions. These tools will be primitive and non-mechanized wherever possible. The tools in Appendix B are the only ones that are approved in the Yosemite wilderness. Exceptions must be approved in writing by the Superintendent.
Most of the tools you mention are specifically listed in Appendix B, right there in black and white.
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overwatch
climber
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Don't let reading get in the way of a good story, wilma
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c wilmot
climber
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That is how Yos defines the 1964 wilderness act under their wilderness management plan from 1989 .
Each park has their own interpretation.
In other parks chainsaws, and gas operated drills are not used in wilderness areas as they keep a closer adherence to what constitutes "primitive" tool use
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BASE104
Social climber
An Oil Field
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The Yosemite ban on power drills is pretty clear. If he is using power drills, and others are as well, then they put the whole climber/NPS relationship at risk.
Yosemite isn't Rifle. It is a treasure. The best routes are cracks. Modern sport routes prefer limestone caves or overhangs, and those just don't exist in Yosemite. It will never be a sport climbing destination. The vast majority of routes are trad, even the bolted routes on the Apron.
One of our local areas is in a designated wilderness. The USFWS decided to ban climbing altogether. It was a huge blow, and took a lot of work and political wrangling to preserve. They allow bolts, but there is always a bolting committee that decides whether a new route is worth the bolts. Pretty much everything gets approved other than convenience anchors. If you can protect a tree by placing a couple of camo bolts, you will be approved. If you want to put chains on top of all of the trad routes, you will probably get a no. It is climber run, and the goal is to allow climbing to continue.
We came this close to losing the entire climbing area, but with a little back and forth, we came to an agreement that would allow climbing to continue. There are sport climbs, but it is mainly a trad area. It is the best area within a few hundred miles, so it is important.
We all, if we have been around for long enough, run into characters who really get off on placing bolts, and they often place them when not necessary. Today's climbers, most of which started in gyms, wonder what the big deal is. The big deal is that climbers have permission to drill holes into El Cap and leave metal anchors all over the thing. If that permission gets out of hand, then the permission of climbing can be revoked. Just look at what happened in Arches. Climbing there hangs on by a thread. You cross the river onto BLM land, and you can do what you want as long as the locals tolerate it.
No other user group is allowed to deface things in Yosemite. That includes carving your name in trees.
Someone needs to forward his statement on MP about using power drills in the park to management. The thing about power drills is that you can place a fat bolt in no time at all. Hand drilling is kind of a pain in the ass.
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WBraun
climber
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Someone needs to forward his statement on MP about using power drills in the park to management.
They already know for years.
You have to catch someone in the actual act to hold up in court ....
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Dickly
Social climber
KY
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Read more carefully. Chainsaws are specifically identified as allowable for use by NPS in the park's 1989 Wilderness Stewardship Plan I linked above. See Appendix B. Similarly helicopters are allowed in certain cases such as for rescue.
You may not like the policies but they are there in writing, right there on the NPS web site. And if the 1989 Plan, currently the controlling document for YNP operations in wilderness areas, violates either the US or CA Wilderness Acts, the fact that it's documented provides ample basis for a lawsuit.
Have at it.
Is really named Opie and has never broken a law in his boring life.
:(
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Dickly
Social climber
KY
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Someone needs to forward his statement on MP about using power drills in the park to management. The thing about power drills is that you can place a fat bolt in no time at all. Hand drilling is kind of a pain in the ass.
"Someone"... my f*#king god...
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overwatch
climber
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Dicky is obviously one of the nookettes
vvvvvvvvv some of his other posts made him seem like a supporter.
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MikeMc
Social climber
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Ehhhh Overwatch, I think he, (Dickly) is pointing out the "someone" part of the post, and how f*#king stoopid it is. Instead of saying someone else should do it, the poster should do it themselves if they feel so strongly about it.
Just my stoopid observation.
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Studly
Trad climber
WA
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If we could just get climbing outlawed, we wouldn't have to worry about any of this. it seems we are on the right track, let's make it a more public issue and raise awareness.
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MattB
Trad climber
Tucson
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^^^
Yup, I'm hoping Sloan sees that report... he still could turn around his ways
Or maybe forever turn to the dark side.
It's sorta like the dui affluenza kid.. he's in deep now
We've all screwed up, at least a wee bit... then maybe try and make better
Whoop!
Edit
Woops!
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madbolter1
Big Wall climber
Denver, CO
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Dang it, Locker!
You made me snort coffee out of my nose again.
Hurts!
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klaus
climber
Slauson & Crenshaw
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Retro- Poewer-Drilling bump for the douoosche
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MattB
Trad climber
Tucson
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No doubt^^
I've met him a few times. They say narcissism is rooted in self doubt, or some such rot...I don't want him to agonize his conscience like Maesrti.
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Ed Hartouni
Trad climber
Livermore, CA
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just drop the "s" from https://...
the page may not exist anymore...
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PAUL SOUZA
Trad climber
Central Valley, CA
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Regardless of what wrong Sloan has done, the constant beratement and the subsequent resurrection of a thread just to continue said beratement really just shows a lack of class...
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