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gonzo chemist
climber
the Orange Curtain
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Oct 27, 2009 - 09:13pm PT
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if pure difficult is what the new generation is after, rather than style, and asctetics, then the art will be lost to competition and will be reduced to a numbers game.
that's poignant. See for example: www.8a.nu
that website makes me queasy....
-Nick
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426
climber
Buzzard Point, TN
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Oct 27, 2009 - 09:26pm PT
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Pbbbbbbt:What is art:||
Guess it's in the eye of the beholder. Mebbe there's an art to climbing granite. There's even some slab paddlin in this clip...then it get haaarth...you can't do it.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UlcQ3mxlNfs&feature=fvw
Freeing old aid routes...art? I keep trying to Hooblie up but it keeps getting dichomatic_-the kids are alright (awe, right("?"{))
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donini
Trad climber
Ouray, Colorado
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Oct 27, 2009 - 09:38pm PT
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The competition aspect of climbing has already lost a lot of steam. A good number of high end sport climbers are discovering trad and a few of them will filter through to alpinism. I have been a climber and an observer of climbing for 5 decades. Sure, there are differences, but all in all I think that the new school climbers are great representatives of climbing a decade or two removed from becoming old school climbers. Sonny Trotter, Chris Sharma, Brittany Griffith, Tommy Caldwell, Colin Haley et al are the current versions of Steve Wunch, Largo, Ron Kauk, Jeff & George Lowe and on and on. Climbing changes, as does everything, but I think the similarities between the generations far outweigh the differences.
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Michael Kennedy
Social climber
Carbondale, Colorado
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Oct 27, 2009 - 10:42pm PT
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What Jim says.
Energy, imagination, purpose, skill, drive - the New School has it all, just like the has-beens did in their time. No need to diminish their efforts.
But we can remind them, once in a while, of the qualities that remain timeless: a sense of stepping into the unknown, of pushing beyond what you think you are capable of. That may be what what binds us together as climbers, whether we're doing a 5-move boulder problem or a 10-day alpine climb.
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WBraun
climber
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Oct 27, 2009 - 10:48pm PT
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Michael Kennedy -- "....the qualities that remain timeless:"
See ... even Michael knows, there is permanence .....
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MH2
climber
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Oct 27, 2009 - 10:56pm PT
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Hmmm.
This was pretty easy to answer when it was just Appies vs. Vulgarians.
My perspective has been knocked awry by Devon Gerrard, Sean McColl, Will Stanhope, and Jason Kruk, all kids who went into the gym and came out to conquer the world, literally in Sean's case, and significant aspects of it in the others' cases.
I get queasy when those kids try to show deference.
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Toker Villain
Big Wall climber
Toquerville, Utah
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Oct 27, 2009 - 11:03pm PT
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Am I the only one who is amazed by what the "kids" are doing but often appalled when I talk with them and find out how ignorant they can be toward the rich history of our pursuit?
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WBraun
climber
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Oct 27, 2009 - 11:09pm PT
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What is the pursuit?
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MH2
climber
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Oct 27, 2009 - 11:26pm PT
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Am I the only one who is amazed by what the "kids" are doing but often appalled when I talk with them and find out how ignorant they can be toward the rich history of our pursuit?
It varies kid by kid. Some are too active and too tightly focussed on climbing to have time or interest beyond the next climb. Others, like one I know who works at MEC, seem to know everyone and everything. I am amazed by the variation in, let's call it maturity, of young 'uns.
What is the pursuit?
I know! I know! Chasing women.
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Karl Baba
Trad climber
Yosemite, Ca
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Oct 28, 2009 - 01:54am PT
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"Well the new school obviously has pushed the difficulty recently is without argument. However are the gains in difficulty due to better climbing skill or is it also a result of better technology? The only way to really know is to hand the youngsters and old rack deviod of camming units, give them some E.B's and see what they can do. If the meet or surpass the climbing successes of the "old School" then maybe what they are doing to raise the standards is valid...if they can't then they aren't really much better climbers than those from the "old school", they have simply benefitted from the technology that offers a margin of safety in previously scetchy situations, and have foot wear that has gecko-like sticking abilities."
I'd say Alex soloing Half dome and moonlight buttress answers this question well enough
peace
karl
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Afghani
Trad climber
Yay Area
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Topic Author's Reply - Oct 28, 2009 - 02:40am PT
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P-diddy,
Sharma, Trotter, Potter and any of the current players are pretty good from what I can gather. No disrespect here, but weren't some of Harding's climbing partners critical about his over bolting? Not trying to say anything bad about the guy, just sayin'. It's all part of the continuum apparently, but it's all part of the game too. Every aspect is analyzed and criticized by one school or the other.
http://www.supertopo.com/climbing/thread.php?topic_id=995687&tn=13
When I thought of climbing back in the day day the use of aid and ascenders and ladders never even came to mind until I started understanding that was a part of climbing big walls. I became slightly jaded when I learned that the Nose couldn't be climbed free. Then I heard of Lynn Hill. It all came back.
Anyway, didn't the Irish invent car bombs, McPatey?
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BASE104
climber
An Oil Field
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Oct 28, 2009 - 07:52am PT
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I still think that using chalk is cheating.
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Jaybro
Social climber
Wolf City, Wyoming
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Oct 28, 2009 - 08:43am PT
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426, do you know what the music is in that clip? Star people-esque
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, Ca.
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Oct 28, 2009 - 12:09pm PT
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That's pretty funny, Wes....
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Afghani
Trad climber
Yay Area
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Topic Author's Reply - Oct 28, 2009 - 01:09pm PT
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Gonz,
That's a Euro website right? Climbing's a lot more popular out there isn't it? In Europe I mean.
Bachar, Kauk et al were super heroes out there, weren't they? It's just odd that rock climbing out here still hasn't become as popular and mainstream as it is and was in Europe.
Maybe that's a good thing, though.
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Wayno
Big Wall climber
Seattle, WA
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Oct 28, 2009 - 01:58pm PT
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Why does it hafta be old vs. new? Old school and New school and No Damn School Atoll.
edit- Aren't we all just maladjusted anyway?
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Toker Villain
Big Wall climber
Toquerville, Utah
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Oct 28, 2009 - 02:06pm PT
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Yeah Wes, you ungrateful pissant.
People like Bill Putnam and his fellow soldiers of the 10th Mountain Division some of whom gave their lives so that you could enjoy the freedom and standard of living that you have today.
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Afghani
Trad climber
Yay Area
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Topic Author's Reply - Oct 28, 2009 - 03:07pm PT
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Pate, I'll pass on the reading about euro climbers. I think I'll just go out and make some history on my own. I'll let you tell me all about the history of European climbing. Brb while I grab some popcorn and chips.
Edit: You're right, though. I'm not feelin' the handle. Great. Another name change.
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Russ Walling
Gym climber
Poofter's Froth, Wyoming
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Oct 28, 2009 - 03:17pm PT
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Afghani I think I'll just go out and make some history on my own.
ANAM?
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Afghani
Trad climber
Yay Area
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Topic Author's Reply - Oct 28, 2009 - 03:21pm PT
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Wes,
I think I read about him a bit in a book I bought a long time ago about "Performance Rock Climbing."
Or maybe that was Dale Goddard.
ANAM? Huh?
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