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Afghani
Trad climber
Yay Area
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Topic Author's Original Post - Oct 26, 2009 - 01:10am PT
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A lot of people have told me since I first started climbing back in July that the main thing that I should do is buy a few books, learn the history of climbing and come up the right way. Chris Mac's guidebooks mostly all have history of the climbs included in them. There's lots of history on this forum and this Web site and we have some of the greatest climbers and First Ascentionists posting on this forum everyday.
But I've also noticed another world of climbing out there that I am not entirely sure lives on this planet of the Taco. They are the Type A personalities. You know, the ones that work out everyday. They get yoked up and are involved in Pose Down Safaris. They are hotshot climbers who don't offer up respect to the pioneers of their sport, choosing instead to make their own history. I've watched climbing videos here and there and some pay homage to the greats, but others seem to highlight the raw power and climbing ability, not taking into account the person who made the first ascent of a certain climb being filmed.
What is it about these two or even three generations of climbers that causes such a clash? Are all new school climbers pitted against old school climbers? Or is it just a small, rogue group of climbers choosing to forge their own way steering clear of the fray of mainstream rock folklore?
Afghani aka Mason eight oh five.
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Jaybro
Social climber
Wolf City, Wyoming
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Oct 26, 2009 - 01:13am PT
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Perhaps a misconception, give it time.
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Delhi Dog
Trad climber
Good Question...
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Oct 26, 2009 - 01:32am PT
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As in all forms of life there are differences or simply variations...
and what Jaybro says.
To discover and ponder something that is grander than any one individual is a special thing, embrace it or knott...
Cheers,
DD
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Fogarty
climber
Back in time..
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Oct 26, 2009 - 01:44am PT
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Old School Or New School (Enjoy Your Time In School)
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Captain...or Skully
Social climber
Idaho, also. Sorta, kinda mostly, Yeah.
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Oct 26, 2009 - 01:47am PT
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We all make our own history.
Right?
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JEleazarian
Trad climber
Fresno CA
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Oct 26, 2009 - 02:12am PT
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There's nothing disrespectful to the past about making your own history. That's what climbers do. Any art form that lives exclusively in the past quickly dies.
John
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GDavis
Social climber
SOL CAL
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Oct 26, 2009 - 02:25am PT
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depends on where you climb. in places with rich histories (JT, Idyllwild, sierras) it seems that it is omnipresent. In those areas climbing is a foundation of one generation building on the next, but also piercing through. Things were done decades ahead of their time and people know this. Things bachar did thirty years would still be newsworthy today if a new gen climber did it. Routes done in the sixties and seventies in CO still have that aura, even with sticky rubber and cams and sit harnesses.
The top end sport climbing, project sending, grade pushing climbers don't necessarily need to constantly tip their hats east. There's plenty of folk who have the perspective to realize the magnitude of those that came before him. Someday we will all be waxing poetic about the great stuff caldwell and honnold did at the turn of the millennium, too. So its all a cycle anyway.
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hooblie
climber
"i used to care, but things have changed"
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Oct 26, 2009 - 03:28am PT
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if i may be so bold as to call myself old school, i'm here picking up stitches that were missed forty years ago. that is to say bachar wasn't striding all around yaking eichorn, underwood or weissner. but the record was thin enough, that we accidently learned to spell them.
it may be that what you're calling old school has just lately gained the age of respect, notable exceptions not withstanding.
my mentor picked me up for a couple of years precisely as a result of an air of snide condescension that split the cadre into those that could take it and those that couldn't. i was very lucky to spend rainy days rolling around being schooled in jazz "history" all of 10-20 years precedent, so while lester young, or art blakey was blowin' all about the bridal veil lot brother barry was pointing out the lesser known works of sacherer, explaining the context of kor's days in the valley. this from a kid in his early twenties. the cool thing was,
this "history" was still steaming, brower was layin into them, rowell was catching rays of light, harding still twisting 'em off.
eddie was seething with respect, i'm sayin' he was tied up tight with it! he'd polish his glasses after the rain,
stop bopping long enough to get them back on his head, and look me straight in the eye.
looking to see if i was GETTIN' it, man.
ah sh#t, largo just posted down below. i was just going to go off about him and how i come here
to pick up stitches, like what he wrote about his wilts connection.
but i'll show some respect, the man is in the house
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Largo
Sport climber
The Big Wide Open Face
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Oct 26, 2009 - 03:40am PT
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They are hotshot climbers who don't offer up respect to the pioneers of their sport, choosing instead to make their own history.
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That's how the young are supposed to act. Otherwise they wouldn't be hot shots. They deserve their moment in the sun. It's a riot while it lasts - then you find other things . . .
JL
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mooch
Trad climber
Old Climbers' Home (Adopted)
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Oct 26, 2009 - 08:49am PT
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Old skool Dad's = Visionaries
New boys and girls = Conquer and claim
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Jaybro
Social climber
Wolf City, Wyoming
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Oct 26, 2009 - 09:05am PT
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Same as it ever was, Today's new school becomes tomorrow's old school. Got it's moments though. Gotta enjoy the ride!
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Afghani
Trad climber
Yay Area
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Topic Author's Reply - Oct 26, 2009 - 10:31am PT
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And some of these new school guys are making their own history, right? Not just Honnold, Sharma and Caldwell, but a lot of no names that haven't been discovered yet.
I mean, are there any FAs left out there to conquer? Seems like they've all been taken down.
The old school serves as the benevolent mentors.
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mrtropy
Trad climber
Nor Cal
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Oct 26, 2009 - 10:37am PT
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I forgot my harness yesterday and to tie in with a bowline on a coil, does that make me old school?
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hooblie
climber
"i used to care, but things have changed"
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Oct 26, 2009 - 10:40am PT
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any fa's left? depends, you know. ask in the caf and you might be disappointed. ask brutus of wyde, and you'd get a nice wide grin.
i'm sympathetic, the plums were picked quick. finding real gems is a high form of idolatry. get yourself ready for the match.
or prepare to taste real disappointment. and learn to love your crags in a very dear way. you didn't really want a cheapy did you?
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ron gomez
Trad climber
fallbrook,ca
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Oct 26, 2009 - 10:53am PT
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What Largo says..... I think when the guys from the seventies were coming up and changing the climbing scene, they were criticized by some of those that came before them, Largo, Bachar, Kauk, etc. were all criticized for not doing things the way they were typically done and look at what that generation did for climbing, they set the new trend. They were looked at as hot shots and cocky and in some case arrogant. This has happened every time a barrier is broken, yet climbing continues to grow and get better. Maybe acceptance is what needs to happen...accept the changes, but appreciate what has come before you, it set the ground work for what is happening or going to happen. There is a lot of history in climbing and a place for those that want to study and appreciate it, many great books and writers. The so called hot shots will have their place in it all, but like John says...some move on to other things. Find your place and go balls out for it, I think that's what most of us have done over time!
Peace
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WBraun
climber
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Oct 26, 2009 - 11:02am PT
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WTF is the problem?
There's no problem.
Here in Yosemite all the hotshots kick ass.
and all the old guys hang out in the cafe and drool into their coffee.
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Bldrjac
Ice climber
Boulder
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Oct 26, 2009 - 11:03am PT
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What Ron and John said.
BTW mrtropy. Forgetting your harness doesn't make you old school.
It just means you are old!! LOL! I know. It happens to me all the time.
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survival
Big Wall climber
A Token of My Extreme
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Oct 26, 2009 - 11:44am PT
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Don't worry about which school you're in.
Just follow your heart, keep climbing and do things you believe in.
We all reach the same finish line eventually.
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PhilG
Trad climber
The Circuit, Tonasket WA
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Oct 26, 2009 - 11:55am PT
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As I sit here drooling in my coffee, it seems to me it's a matter of there are climbers with very little history and a lot of future, and there are climbers with a long history but very little future left...
I think, in general, the longer one's history, the more one respects history.
Now excuse me while I go back and drool over a Sharp End video.
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Afghani
Trad climber
Yay Area
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Topic Author's Reply - Oct 26, 2009 - 12:31pm PT
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Nah. Not expecting any cheapys. But I'd like to find a few and maybe one day put up a few myself. I'm pretty sure I am new school, but I'm not too concerned with which school new or old I'm in. School lets out eventually. Like I told a few people, I'm definitely interested in the history and respect it. But I just don't have time to learn about it now. Too much stuff going on to focus on one thing.
I just want to climb.
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