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jonnyrig
climber
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Pretty well with the KTM.
How far do you routinely hike? You know, just out of curiosity.
More than most of us, I'm guessing. Considering you're here touting the assumed inability of the off-road crowd to, you know, see and enjoy nature, I just wondered what it is that you seem to find so particularly offensive that you'd just naturally assume anyone with a transfer case is incapable of appreciating the natural beauty that surrounds us.
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apogee
climber
Technically expert, safe belayer, can lead if easy
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I dunno, Randisi...I'd agree with you more if driving around was all that these guys ever do.
But in the case of this thread, I bet most of these posters do plenty of the kind of adventuring you are referring to. 4x-ing is just part of their fun. I'm down with that.
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jonnyrig
climber
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Yes. We do more than just tromp the skinny pedal. Most of us don't have the time to commit ourselves to a week-long trek as much as we'd like. Others have reached the point where it's physically unrealistic, and possibly a health hazard, to get out and hike due to health issues. So 4x4ing, though fun in itself, often serves as an expedient method to get closer to some of the places in the outdoors than we would otherwise not have time to access. Some of them truly take close to a hundred miles of travel down roads that are not accessible to regular passenger vehicles.
Would you choose to have those roads graded and paved so everyone can get there? Or would you prefer maybe all such roads be closed permanently so that only the physically elite and independently wealthy are blessed with the ability to trek into the far-away reaches of unspoiled beauty?
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jonnyrig
climber
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I'd drive wherever I was interested with a designated access road. And then probably get out and hike as much as my allotted vacation would allow. Kind of what I do these days. Are you saying you're morally superior because you have more time to hike?
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Craig Fry
Trad climber
So Cal.
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Last year me and my wife were driving off road going to the Turtle Mts (awesome!). We had just finished a 12 mile sand section and I was maybe going a little too fast when it transformed into a rocky section.
When all of sudden we hear hissing sounds!!
I stop and watch as my front tire goes flat.
But the Hissing doesn't STOP.
My back tire is draining out of life as fast as the major sadness that enveloped me.
And of course my wife was hysterical "you were going too fast". Our cell phones were low on power, we forgot our chargers, it was Sunday.
There was nothing to do except call a Tow Truck, Needles was 45 miles away.
They asked us about the road conditions, I told them that they were easy, I drove a 2 wheel drive car up there before.
So they send out a flat bed, and it gets stuck 6 miles in. It gets it self out and abandons us as we watch with binocs.
Next they send out a regular truck, we pile in and take one of the tires to Needles. We get a new tire, we drive back, put it on, and drive out.
It took 6 hours and cost $800.
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jonnyrig
climber
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No, I like that there are designated wilderness areas set aside as roadless. I appreciate the idea that vehicles don't belong everywhere.
Maybe I took your comment in the wrong light... it sounded like you're completely anti-4x4, and the kind of guy who would hike a 4x4 trail and then shoot dirty looks at the trucks rolling by.
But if there's an expedient trail that takes me half way up the mountain so I can summit in a day hike, then be back to spend the evening with my kids and better half, then I'm probably going to drive it in order to accomplish that goal.
It doesn't mean we're not out seeing nature and appreciating it, just that in some respects the manner in which we get there sounds different than yours. For some, behind the wheel may be as much as they can physically do anymore.
Additionally, I don't intend to defend the actions of everyone with a truck either, as there are plenty of careless and reckless idiots who shouldn't be out there. I've seen them. We've all seen them. And they cause a lot of the anger and access prohibitions that the rest of us have to deal with.
It's just difficult to let stand an apparently biased statement.
I would LOVE to have the time and financial resources to allow me something like, say, the entire PCT. Hell, even a week of it would be great! I just don't have time.
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apogee
climber
Technically expert, safe belayer, can lead if easy
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What business is it of yours, Randisi?
I mean, anyone has the right to enjoy the world the way they want to enjoy it. As long as that practice doesn't infringe on other's experiences (stay on designated roads & areas, dammit!), they don't deserve anyone's criticism.
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jonnyrig
climber
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Meh. Just another bolt war. Which is more restrictive? Your right to roadless areas? Or my right to drive in? Both limit some user group's right to access. Both limit some group's experience. You don't like the noise and the dust, right? I don't like the elitist attitude that defines only physically fit people with time on their hands will get there.
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jonnyrig
climber
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Reminds me of a minor incident several years ago. Fordyce trail is one of the more popular HARD 4x4 trails in this part of the sierra. We took the easy portion to Fordyce Lake and camped for the weekend, fishing and canoeing around, with some minor bits of climbing too. That portion of the trail can be done in a relatively high clearance albeit stock 4x4. In other words, there tend to be a lot of 4x4's there.
While there, my old jeep developed a cab problem where it would not idle or run at anything less than half throttle. In the process of trying to diagnose and fix the issue, I passed a gal hiking down the road with the engine fairly screaming in 4x4 1st gear low. She actually ran toward the truck threatening to hit it with her walking stick, screaming what a f*#king as#@&%e I was, that there are other people on the trail, and some other obscenities just to... I guess drive home her point?
If I was doing 10mph in that gearing, I'd be surprised. Incidentally, there is a speed limit there of 15mph, as enforced by forest service on dirtbikes.
Considering that area, and its proximity to a designated roadless area with better views and no risk of degenerate 4x4's, what the hell was her logic in choosing to hike down that road? What did she expect? We passed her husband about 200yds further up, around a corner. We chatted briefly, mentioning her words and her reaction. His response? "yeah, she gets like that."
Randisi, are you that kind of guy?
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jonnyrig
climber
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If you want to consider me an as#@&%e with that attitude, there's not much I'm going to be able to do to change that opinion. I stay to the established trails, and use them to get closer to areas that I'd otherwise not have time to explore. I slow down when I pass people on trails (exception above notwithstanding) because I'm also a hiker and I don't like getting dusted any more than they do.
What I take from this exchange is that you view my use of four wheel drive as as a sign of moral degeneration and weakness. Along with, I suspect, anyone else who drives a 4x4. I see your objection to the existence and use of established 4x4 trails as an elitist and snobbish attitude that fails to take into account the diversity of people's available time and ability in an outdoor setting.
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pinckbrown
Trad climber
Woodfords, CA
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Randisi, what I take from your posts is that you
probably are not getting in the 4x4 with us this
Sunday on our way to the Selenites!
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Mungeclimber
Trad climber
Nothing creative to say
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Topic Author's Reply - Mar 7, 2015 - 10:01am PT
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pinckbrown,
nice shots
jeesus, a portable welder? Yeah, maybe I'll stick to the flat stuff afterall. LOL
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Sierra Ledge Rat
Mountain climber
Old and Broken Down in Appalachia
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What's in yur 4x kit? Another 4x4 with me
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Mark Force
Trad climber
Cave Creek, AZ
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The simple stuff is the best and most reliable over time. Shovel, ax, pick, straps, chains, rings, Kevlar line, recycled tire doormats for traction, and hi lift jack. Favorite trick for getting unstuck when a diff or some other part gets hung up in the rocks is to hi lift off the bumper and shove the whole rig to one side or the other. Love how rough and simpe that is. The hi lift makes a reliable come along.
When you have lockers and get stuck, the simplest way to get going is just lock the diffs and move on.
My toy, a 1983 Landcruiser Wagon. Chevy V8, 5 speed with granny first, manual cable lockers front and rear, PTO winch, onboard air compressor. Makes me smile and takes good care of me.
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Dapper Dan
Trad climber
Menlo Park
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Wow, beautiful LC...
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Marlow
Sport climber
OSLO
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Nonattachment
Kindness
Firmness
Focused and relaxed
If only one: judgement
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pb
Sport climber
Sonora Ca
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in some places they carry an earthquake kit; lots of goodies in em.
Mine? crowbar
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pinckbrown
Trad climber
Woodfords, CA
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Mar 22, 2015 - 04:05pm PT
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Couple more pics using the rig.
It is amazing the difference twin
air lockers and crawler gears make!
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ruppell
climber
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Does a 97 4Runner, 5.29's, dual locked and close to dual cased get to play the game? Long story short, my wifes DD has turned into our weekend trial rig. It's run all the hardest trails in Bishop without an issue. I decided to add the dual case to it. Here's the case on the bench:
I'm currently waiting on the correct 23 spline coupler to finish the install. Once they're in I have plans to Dusy it in August. In the meantime here's a few shots of what Bishop has to offer.
and then there was this gem on my way out. lol
As far as the best tricks for saving your ass go. Don't be stupid and have lockers. I keep it open/open until I need to be locked. Then I lock the rear. If that doesn't work I lock the front. Haven't been stuck yet. lol
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NutAgain!
Trad climber
South Pasadena, CA
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There are some good gems in this thread!
Only new things I have to add are more for human survival in case of getting stuck somewhere for a while:
 a few gallons of water per person
water filter
emergency space blankets & first aid kit
If you don't heed the advice "don't be stupid," then having kids to take depth soundings and scout the holes during river crossings can be important too. This was from a few years back. Prius clearance is somewhere between a hand/fist stack and a double-fist. Hybrids don't have important electrical stuff do they?
Shovel is a time saver, but I've dug out the Prius when the whole belly was buried in sand, just using sage brush roots and my arms to scoop it out. I think that was when I started carrying a folding shovel. It went faster in times after that I got stuck. I also carry a folding handsaw, another survival metal coil wire saw, a small axe, bailing wire (which I used on the muffler at Black Velvet Canyon in Red Rocks), duct tape, fix-a-flat with a little 12V compressor, tire plugs (which I've used to fix a sidewall slash somewhere near Shuteye), and when I was with the kids, typically about 6 gallons of fresh water in the car along with a water filter. I also carry a few space blankets in case I'm caught in the cold without having planned sleeping bags or blankets. Plus bandaids with cartoons.
Jumper cables too. One time I gave myself a jump in the new van, when the main battery died but I forgot I had an aux battery not hooked up to anything yet. I've used the jumper cables to help other people, and to enable other people to help me when they don't have jumper cables but willing to help.
1" tubular nylon webbing does let a jeep pull a Prius about 50 yards through deep sand. It's not just for motorcycles.
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