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j-tree
Big Wall climber
Typewriters and Ledges
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Nov 17, 2015 - 07:44am PT
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quoting Karl
In fact none of this stuff (except if there's stuff I don't know about) is making the routes much easier or safer than they were for the FA party except to adjust for the fact of being able to support more traffic during this new era of climbing where crowds have become the crux of some trade routes.
We aren't going to agree about the fine points of route maintenance. I'm glad there are people doing it. If you want it done differently, go fix some stuff. I don't think Erik is going to rework any route that's already been fixed with non-ancient gear.
Peace
Karl
Check out the newish topo for slab route in Erik's bigwall book. Not only adding bolts to avoid A4 sections, one is called "EZ variation" if case the intent of the retro bolting wasn't immediately clear.
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overwatch
climber
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A sure sign of sociopathic narcissism.
Tom,
Thanks for taking the time to go back and forth with this seeming whacko. guys in the valley in position to do something really need to. and I don't mean violence I am talking about an effort beyond this forum to let people know what he is doing
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brotherbbock
Trad climber
Alta Loma, CA
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Tom that post was amazing........WOOT!
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JEleazarian
Trad climber
Fresno CA
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Hear, hear. I do have a quibble about:
Make all climbs "go clean" by bolting past cracks.
I remember in the early 1970's some talk about doing just that on all new routes, i.e. never place a pin. If it won't take a clean placement, use a bolt. Galen Rowell tells a story about the interview he and Steck did of Royal Robbins around this time, shortly after he "erased" the first few pitches of the Wall of the Early Morning Light. After Robbins finished railing against excessive bolting, Rowell mentioned that the East Side climbers were employing the "bolt rather than pin" ethic on their routes. Before Royal could respond, Liz said "Far out!"
Of course, for aid climbing, I'm with you all the way on the resistance to chicken bolts and bolt ladders.
John
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limpingcrab
Trad climber
the middle of CA
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I love that Erik bumped this thread
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squishy
Mountain climber
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I'm excited to hear what they think about the route, as it has garnered so much online controversy.
I love how he has tried to redirect the "controversy" to the route itself, like he created a new Wings of Steel, when in fact it's really the person, HE, who is the controversy, lol.
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overwatch
climber
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I love that Erik bumped this thread
Me too
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Tom
Big Wall climber
San Luis Obispo CA
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I remember in the early 1970's some talk about doing just that on all new routes, i.e. never place a pin.
If someone establishes a new route with no pins, no cams, one hand, eyes closed, whatever, that's fine. No problem. I don't understand why a bolt, instead of a fixed pin, is more ethical, or better, but the FA team basically has carte blanche.
Erik Sloan is not establishing new routes - - - unless you twist that concept to mean that Sloan is retrobolting existing, difficult routes to make them easier, and then renaming them for his guide book.
FA - First Ascent
FFA - First Free Ascent
FSA - First Sloan Ascent*
* This is the date when Erik Sloan retrobolted the route and renamed it, deluding himself that he is a pioneering mountaineer, and has accomplished a "first ascent" of some sort, to get his name in the guide book.
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k-man
Gym climber
SCruz
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Erik must be psyched because his bolts allowed the team to go fast by flying up bolt ladders instead of working the slow aid...
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Steve Grossman
Trad climber
Seattle, WA
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Sloan has no problem with pitons at all and drives iron on C2 pitches. Go back and read some of his TRs on well traveled routes. He is about the approach of least resistance whatever the technology employed and thinks that everyone should get in line with that mediocrity in their climbing.
Without technical challenge and problem solving what is the point of aid climbing really? The thrill is gone on a Sloan bolt ladder...Big Wall Buzzkill.
Keep telling him that he sucks and don't buy his guidebook or his corrupt rationale for character assasination.
If he moves forward with his free climbing guide undermining Cmac's livelihood then he is done here and has been warned about that choice of Woot.
Nice helping of Yellow Snow Tom!
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clinker
Trad climber
Santa Cruz, California
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Sloan may want to patent his deflection method.
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overwatch
climber
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late night bump to keep him on the forefront the way he likes it. His "woot, me worry?"deflection method just makes him seem more nuts
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Studly
Trad climber
WA
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What does free climbing Ten Days After go at currently?
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Spiny Norman
Social climber
Boring, Oregon
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Dec 9, 2015 - 07:58pm PT
What does free climbing Ten Days After go at currently?
A0.
A1 if you are under 5'7".
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Tom
Big Wall climber
San Luis Obispo CA
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Dec 10, 2015 - 09:36am PT
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It's not A0.
The new Climbing Rating System puts it at AS
AS = Aid Level of Difficulty: Sloan
AS is easier than A0. Mathematically, AS would be about like A(-3)
Notice that "AS" kinda looks like "A5" - - - woot woot woot
I just did an AS pitch. RAD! I'm totally bitchen! Put my name on a list somewhere on the internet!
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Studly
Trad climber
WA
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Dec 10, 2015 - 09:55am PT
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In other words, no one has done the route lately, and no one here has a clue about it.
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brotherbbock
Trad climber
Alta Loma, CA
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Dec 10, 2015 - 01:34pm PT
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Tom you crack me up!
WOOT to you good sir.
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ElCapPirate
Big Wall climber
Ogden, Utah
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Dec 15, 2015 - 12:24am PT
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Erik, it really doesn't make you look good when you start a thread on Facebook talking about this controversy, all your peers and friends chime in to kindly ask you to PLEASE STOP ADDING BOLTS, and you just delete the entire post.
Why even start the conversation when you're not going to listen to anyone anyway?
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Tom
Big Wall climber
San Luis Obispo CA
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Dec 15, 2015 - 02:03am PT
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The MOST important thing is that the TREND of retrobolting stops NOW.
One guy, who is dysfunctional, is not the real problem.
The real problem is that Nanook, Doctor Dysfuncto, advises, and encourages others to drill, baby, drill.
When Erik Sloan retrobolts existing routes, other people might think that is acceptable.
And, then other people might retrobolt other routes, as if they are assisting the situation, and doing Sloan's Work.
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