Erik Sloan’s Latest Victim – Ten Days After

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patrick compton

Trad climber

van

Oct 25, 2015 - 07:01am PT

As I argued above (with, I think, a fairly high level of "philosophic clarity"), retro-bolting routes is the antithesis of what CLIMBING actually is. It is non-climbing or anti-climbing. It guts the essence of WHY we climb in the first place.

so the 'essence of climbing' is trusting crappy, 30 year old bolts?

I'll alert the prominent climbing sponsors of this change in focus immediately!

John M

climber

Oct 25, 2015 - 08:02am PT

Patrick Compton wrote..

so the 'essence of climbing' is trusting crappy, 30 year old bolts?

Nope… I'm sorry.. but this is exactly one of the problems. People don't understand the terms.

Retro Bolting .. Versus .. Re bolting

Re Bolting is replacing old bolts with new. No one has a problem with that. Or at least very few do..

Retro Bolting is adding new bolts where there were none before.. A much different situation

It can include adding bolts to a belay.. something perhaps necessary on trade routes. ( my opinion.) Something Eric has admitted to.

It can also include changing bolt ladders to make them easier. Something else Eric has admitted to.

Adding bolt ladders where none were before. ( not sure on this one. )

( if there are others.. perhaps it would be good if you stated them for the sake of clarity )

…….

whats sad to me is all the slagging has made this thread difficult to read. So too many people don't try. Then you have the people who use sarcasm, which is often difficult to interpret, making this thread even more difficult as most of the new climbers don't' know who the older climbers are.

ChizzDizzle

Trad climber

Rocklin,CA

Oct 25, 2015 - 08:54am PT

Sweet!!!! A Select Free Climbing Guide with all the updated free climbing beta there is!!

Rack:
20 QD

Leave that burly rack at home Bro all climbs have fat bolts! You want to climb Outer Limits? QD's yo!!! Rostrum and Astroman?!?! QD's bro! Serenity/ SOY QD's BROOOOO!!!! My team and I are here cauce we are Super Psyched for you and we want you to have a super sweet safe time cause we have the peyche BRO!!!!!!!!

Good luck Tuolumne you are next!!!!!

Prod

Trad climber

Oct 25, 2015 - 09:15am PT

whats sad to me is all the slagging has made this thread difficult to read. So too many people don't try. Then you have the people who use sarcasm, which is often difficult to interpret, making this thread even more difficult as most of the new climbers don't' know who the older climbers are.

Agreed John.

Hey Jammer,

Just because someone says that Erik is a nice guy, does not mean that they support his actions. For me I just thought the Eric Sloan depreciation thread was uncalled for.

I'm a fan of re-bolting, not retro bolting. As The Fet showed there are lots of Grey areas in between where most of us fall.

Cheers,

Prod.

John M

climber

Oct 25, 2015 - 09:43am PT

When people are willing to truly listen and genuinely represent the community, this kind of thing never happens.

That applies to both sides of the equation.

And it is pie in the sky.. people aren't perfect. And are often selfish

HermitMaster

Social climber

my abode

Oct 25, 2015 - 10:31am PT

I'm just curious as to how committed people are to climbing these climbs in the same style as the first ascent.

I mean do you use the same foot wear? Go without chalk? A laid rope when applicable...

Or, is it just Eric's bolts that you have a problem with?

John M

climber

Oct 25, 2015 - 10:43am PT

Chalk has been argued pretty hard. footwear and ropes not so much, as they don't hurt the rock or change the experience for the person coming behind them. People have though often expressed their admiration for how difficult it must have been for early climbers, without the gear we have today.

The two posts I find telling are Greg Barnes post early in the thread saying the ASCA does not support Erik, and Ammon's post ( Elcap pirate), telling his experience. I don't know either of these people, only their reputation and what they have posted on this forum. Both seem very level headed and both have issues with what EriK is doing.

For the sake of clarity. I have not climbed El Capitan. Will likely never climb the Captain. I am a friend of Erik's though. And am interested in this subject. Not the bashing of Erik. But the changing of the guard and the changing outlook on how the rock can be used.

Studly

Trad climber

Oct 25, 2015 - 10:44am PT

I click on a few people who post negatively about Erik like Jammer, etc. and see their photos and/or trip reports, and what I see is just political crap and cartoons, no climbing content. I get the feeling the naysayers suck at climbing anymore, otherwise they would be doing it. When you get to old to climb, maybe you just need to stand down if you can't stand up. Getting old is no excuse for not getting off your ass. You guys got way to much time on your hands and not enough drive and motivation obviously. Erik is out their re-bolting routes that certainly need it, and he may have retro bolted a few things also, I don't know. Madbolter, you disappoint me. You are a guy who did WOS I believe? You were vilified for years, and yet here you are doing the same to someone else. Sad times man.

Studly

Trad climber

Oct 25, 2015 - 11:21am PT

Then start a new thread..

Lurkingtard

climber

Oct 25, 2015 - 11:26am PT

Studly

Trad climber
WA

Oct 25, 2015 - 11:21am PT
Then start a new thread..

Yeah start a 4th thread about this shet.

~~~

Lurkingtard

climber

Oct 25, 2015 - 11:52am PT

Let's start a thread on Growing Up...

Oh wait

...

~~~

madbolter1

Big Wall climber

Denver, CO

Oct 25, 2015 - 11:58am PT

Madbolter, you disappoint me. You are a guy who did WOS I believe? You were vilified for years, and yet here you are doing the same to someone else. Sad times man.

There's a huge difference the the two cases that OUGHT to be apparent:

I was vilified for decades based upon lies, and they were lies that could trivially have been seen for the lies that they were. Erik is being vilified for the FACTS of his behavior on many different routes, and this behavior has been seen and reported-on first-hand by people that have seen his handiwork, including, as we have seen on this very thread, some very credible individuals. By contrast, WoS sat there unrepeated for decades, although it was attempted by many, so the truth was clearly there to be had. In the face of the truth, the climbing community believed lies.

If the vilification of me HAD been based on facts rather than lies, it would have been justly-deserved. HAD Mark and I done what it was claimed, we would have deserved the "vilification."

You seem to think that it is always unacceptable to call somebody out for their behavior, and I have never believed that. I think that peer-pressure is about the only legitimate recourse the climbing community has. By "peer pressure" I do NOT mean physical harm, physical threats, or other forms of illegal activity. I mean strictly and entirely the "vilification" to which you refer. I mean that certain behaviors that are NOT "climbing" should indeed be "vilified" by the CLIMBING community, such that people with a pattern of certain unacceptable behaviors do NOT enjoy the respect and "woot" of the CLIMBING community.

So, let's keep apples with apples and giraffes with giraffes, rather than to conflate apples and giraffes.

c wilmot

climber

Oct 25, 2015 - 11:59am PT

Any proof a power drill is being used? Or is this "fact" assumed?

kev

climber

A pile of dirt.

Oct 25, 2015 - 03:22pm PT

A picture is worth a thousand words...

Tom

Big Wall climber

San Luis Obispo CA

Oct 25, 2015 - 05:09pm PT

he may have retro bolted a few things also

"May" = he has admitted to doing it, and not admitted to many other instances

"Few" = dozens of routes, just in Yosemite Valley

If Erik had only nanooked a route, here or there, there wouldn't be a huge shitstorm over what he's doing. Just on this thread, he's been called out on over a dozen routes.

I find it surprising that so many supporters of Erik's retrobolting on this thread think that they can conjure a separate reality out of thin air, simply by making an absurd statement.