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WBraun
climber
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Yes out loud.
Bush never talked to him .....
And what kind of fool are you? Do you talk to people in your head?
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Zander
Trad climber
Berkeley
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Hey Sport Fans,
The experiment was a waste of money. Prayer does not "work". This has been known for a long time and is not in question. The entire Bible is basically one long passionate discussion about why is it that it doesn't. The New Testament is Jesus answering that question too - How come our prayers won't drive away those awful Romans? As far as I can tell other religions spend most of their time trying to answer that question as well.
Religion is just you and the Big Guy one on one in conversation. Hey, if prayer helps in the conversation, cool. If talking to your preacher helps, great. And if you are sketched out thirty feet from your last pro and you have to use everything you are, and everything you know, and all you want to know, to use your knowledge of the rock, the body your parents gave you, the climbing gear you have on hand, well that sounds like a pretty big conversation going on right there. And if you make it won't be because somebody down in the meadow is praying for you. That doesn't mean you shouldn't be pretty humble the next time you're talking to the Big Guy. I think a lot of us don't have time for a lot of religion, we just try to do what's right, try to tell the truth most of the time and try to help are family, friends and others who need help as much as we can. That's enough for one lifetime. Just my very humble opinion.
Zander
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Karl Baba
Trad climber
Yosemite, Ca
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Here's a little thang I wrote about God awhile back. Hope it doesn't sound too holier than thou cause I like sex,drugs and rock and roll as much as the next guy. I don't separate my friends into believers and not-believers but I step into these discussions because the mystery of life is about as important a question to ponder as they get.
Peace
Karl
++++++++++++
Folks tend to try to understand God in terms they can understand. Many tend to visualize God as very human and somewhat like a stern boss or strict father figure. But it's obvious that any being that created a universe that takes light millions of years to traverse, and manifested the vast complexity of even this world, that being is not an easy target for human comprehension.
God created everything out of his own being. If there were some separate material for God to use to make all this, it would be a type of God itself. The book of John says God created the world out of the "word." Our words are vibrating energy structured by information that originate out of ourselves. Not a bad explanation to a primitive people thousands of years ago.
But even though God is vast, transcendent, and beyond all comprehension, God is also intimate and immediate, closer than the closest. Everyone says God is in heaven. Where is that? Jesus said the kingdom of heaven is within.
God is Spirit which has as its nature consciousness. Would you expect God to be without consciousness? We read that we are created in God's image. Our essential nature is then Spirit which has as its nature consciousness. What's the last thing of yourself that you would ever sacrifice? Your awareness, of course. That's how we have an intimate link with the being that encompasses countless beings, of which there are 6 billion of just humans on this tiny world alone. A spark of the divine is within each of us as our soul and thus, we are keeping track of our own sins and writing our own story in the book of life. Judge not, lest you be judged.
You can think of this world as the dream of God. The reason for it is not comprehensible in rational human awareness. The purpose of our existence in this world is not our pleasure and luxury. The experiences we have in life, bad and good, have the effect of refining and evolving our Spirit. If you look at the course of your own life with openness and clarity, you might see an abstract sort of perfection in it. Everything that ever happened to you has brought you to where you are right now. What you are right now is reflected all around you as your life. Change within and your world will change.
Jesus may have been a pure expression of that divine being, but don't get hung up on one historical figure being the sole expression of divinity. Jesus was talking about his highest nature when he said he was the only way. You can't live without water, but Agua, H2O, and Pani are the same thing, and in a pinch, you can still get along with orange juice, or even cola or malt liquor.
So "what you believe" is a lot less important than "what is in your heart." My feeling is that God doesn't know what religion you are. God sees directly to the heart where that totality of what you are is revealed.
I know this kind of philosophy runs counter to what many folks believe. Believing we have the only way builds religions and makes us feel superior. I respect your path whatever you think, and I'm always open to deepening my understanding, so don't worry about me. If the highest power will grace me with greater understanding, I'm always listening. "Seek and you will find" Just be open to the fact that what you find might not be what you expected.
Peace
karl
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WBraun
climber
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Karl said: "God sees directly to the heart where that totality of what you are is revealed."
Yes he is within the heart as Paramatma along with the individual soul, atma.
Hey did all you anti-god and anti-prayer guys give up?
Hehehe God exists.
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yo
climber
I'm so over it
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I once saw God solo up behind me on NEB of Higher, so I can tell you I believe.
Turned out to be Werner.
Then I prayed to be able to climb like Werner so I can also tell you there is no God.
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Minerals
Social climber
The Deli
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I am currently searching for other inhabitable planets that are not under the control of a Dog. Earth appears to be an anomaly in the Universe as there are many, many Dogs here.
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dirtbag
climber
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I've seen God, he looks like George Burns.
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WBraun
climber
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Are you trying to convince yourselves he (GOD) doesn't esist?
You will fail, you have failed.
Common, common, just try and prove the sun ( the eye of Narayana ) doesn't exsist either. hehehe
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dirtbag
climber
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Actually Werner, it's the other way around. I've tried to convince myself that God exists but the evidence has always come up short. I can't outright deny it, but I can't confirm it either.
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leezus
Trad climber
Salt Lake City
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If the statement that humans only are
capable of using 10% of the brain is anywhere
close to being accurate then what do any of us
really know for certain? I guess about 10%.
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dirtbag
climber
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Maybe 11 or 12% on a good day, though.
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leezus
Trad climber
Salt Lake City
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Ha!
yeah, for sure.
I think I only get about 5%
on a good day. When I use
my good eye.
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yo
climber
I'm so over it
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The eye of Narayana vs. eye of Sauron--which would win?
And it's the middle of the day, I can't currently disprove the existence of the sun. Try back tonight.
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straightandnarrow
Sport climber
Salt Lake City
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The only time I find myself in prayer, is during sex (especially with a women). I find that a little orgasm prayer can help me reach the pinnicle of climax and I love to pray while looking "down" at one of my lovers in prayer herself.
My two cents,
Jennifer
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healyje
Trad climber
Portland, Oregon
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Topic Author's Reply - Apr 4, 2006 - 09:10pm PT
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Jennifer and I are definitely into the same form of worship and praying at the same altar if not to the same god.
But as far as the following statement is concerned:
"If the statement that humans only are capable of using 10% of the brain is anywhere close to being accurate then what do any of us really know for certain?"
No form of life can afford any excess capacity - we may not be able to consciously access more than about 10% of our capacity, but that doesn't mean the other 90% isn't permanently utilized operating the machine that is you. You may be able to tap into in spurts, but a permanent tap would likely age you at an inordinate rate.
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Spinmaster K-Rove
Trad climber
Stuck Under the Kor Roof
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The power of Intent is very real and very powerful and is essentially what prayer is. More and more science, particularly physics, is coming to recognize the awesome power of intent.
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healyje
Trad climber
Portland, Oregon
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Topic Author's Reply - Apr 5, 2006 - 05:57pm PT
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unknown > fear > desire > intent > projection
>
loop
<
projection < intent < desire < fear < unknown
God = fear of the unknown
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Minerals
Social climber
The Deli
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Was just at the post office, picking up my mail. Got a Jesus Christ brochure (in color!) that said that they wanted to convert me! First thing I thought was ‘where is a pen when I need one’? So I just hung the brochure on the bulletin board… put the pushpin right through his forehead… Poor guy sure gets to hang around a lot… Somebody will probably tweak… LOL!
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dirtbag
climber
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Some people say "Oh, God!" during sex, I say "Oh, shit!" Does that make me a Shitinist?
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WBraun
climber
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You guys are so scared of God.
You have to continually tell us he doesn't exist. hahaha
If he didn't exist neither would you .....
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