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Hummerchine
Trad climber
East Wenatchee, WA
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Oct 11, 2010 - 10:54pm PT
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That thing is COOL!!!
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ionlyski
Trad climber
Kalispell, Montana
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Oct 11, 2010 - 11:03pm PT
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Boo. Hisssssssss! Boo! Hiss!
Shame. Multi pitch stick clipping. I've seen it clog long, moderate climbs by folks who prolly shouldn't be on the route in the first place.
Flame me please.
Arne
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Steve Grossman
Trad climber
Seattle, WA
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Oct 11, 2010 - 11:06pm PT
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Humjob- If anyone needs to cheat, it is certainly you!
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Wade Icey
Trad climber
www.alohashirtrescue.com
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Oct 11, 2010 - 11:11pm PT
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multi pitch stick clipping?
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nick d
Trad climber
nm
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Oct 11, 2010 - 11:54pm PT
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So, I can stick-clip the second pitch from the ground?
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Disaster Master
Sport climber
Arcata / Santa Rosa, CA
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Topic Author's Reply - Oct 12, 2010 - 12:32am PT
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So many people so firmly in the box.
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Steve Grossman
Trad climber
Seattle, WA
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Oct 12, 2010 - 01:04am PT
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And you are the future, I presume?!?
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Disaster Master
Sport climber
Arcata / Santa Rosa, CA
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Topic Author's Reply - Oct 12, 2010 - 03:57pm PT
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Nope, just a smart-ass with a stick. Happy climbing! :)
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Steve Grossman
Trad climber
Seattle, WA
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Oct 13, 2010 - 12:34am PT
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Happy Clipping...
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MisterE
Social climber
Bouncy Tiggerville
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Oct 13, 2010 - 01:14am PT
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What ever happened to letting people find their own way? And supporting it?
Are we so entrenched in our beliefs and prejudices that we disallow this?
Where did live and let live become my way or the highway?
(Obviously, a while ago sociologically speaking)
If there were a disabled person using this device to make his/her dream ascent of a climb they couldn't do otherwise, would you feel the same way?
Just questions - I don't presume, like many of you, to have THE answer.
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Disaster Master
Sport climber
Arcata / Santa Rosa, CA
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Topic Author's Reply - Oct 13, 2010 - 01:28am PT
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Thank you, Mister E.
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Hawkeye
climber
State of Mine
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Oct 13, 2010 - 01:33am PT
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personally, i would never buy one as a ground up route deserves some respect IMHO. but if you want to use one i don't give a sh#t...it does not hurt my climbing experience.
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nick d
Trad climber
nm
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Oct 13, 2010 - 01:54am PT
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Disabled person? Hey, I resemble that remark!
And I do want the ability to clip over the difficult stuff. But I think that stick is too limited. I'm waiting for the "Jim Donini Ropegun" model.
I hear its killer.
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Mighty Hiker
climber
Vancouver, B.C.
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Oct 13, 2010 - 02:14am PT
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You should go into business with Weld_it. He likes making stuff.
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graniteclimber
Trad climber
Nowhere
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Oct 13, 2010 - 05:43pm PT
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If it saves someone from decking or putting in a bolt, that is good. But you can't claim a redpoint after using this.
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LongAgo
Trad climber
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Oct 13, 2010 - 06:00pm PT
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Yes, Rich, here's another old fart who thought placing pro, even when difficult or dangerous, was as much a rewarding part of the climbing as the climbing. Way old school I know, but seemed so satisfying to get pro in off the deck with a wobbly sigh of relief, or in the middle of hard moves higher along, staying with the same challenges as the FA party, loving them and cursing them on the spot and back at camp where big laughs and hoots go on ... all that.
Of course, one pays for such quirky pleasure, sometimes in heated arguments with partners who see no problem with those stick clips, sometimes with other consequences off the deck when the pro won't go and then you must decide with withering arms to down climb or go on, and wind up falling into the North Sea trying that first ascent, and break a heel and get freezing wet and hobble around your subsequent Scotland tour in a cast with a somewhat grumpy wife, all because the little bitsy nuts you got in were lousy and you knew it but couldn't hang in there long or well enough to get them solid, and tried to down climb and time the coming splash to when the waves were in rather than out but missed that timing and hit jutting rocks ...
Days of old, fond in memory, but not so smart. My better choice: leave the FA for other stronger, better ones to come. Turns out one did come along two years later and get that FA, and since then the Scots around Aberdeen have a tale to tell in the pubs of how one of their own did what the American visitor couldn't. Of course, now it is not hard to see that is a perfectly wonderful and fitting outcome as the days turn for all of us and the better and better come along, and it was good to be sobered as a whippersnapper of the day learning slowly, reluctantly, there is no eternal fame or body, and perfectly wonderful for the hardy and hard climbers of that part of the world and their rich climbing lore. So we see, all is not lost, in fact much gained, as we embrace some dangers and stupidities of climbing, provided we live to reflect upon them.
Tom Higgins
LongAgo
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Disaster Master
Sport climber
Arcata / Santa Rosa, CA
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Topic Author's Reply - Oct 14, 2010 - 12:38am PT
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Why is everyone talking about first ascents? Who said that is what this is for? It's not a one thing tool. Man, it's like listening to a game of Telephone around here.
Who cares about first ascents? It's for any situation YOU wish. Yeah, you, not everyone else.
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Steve Grossman
Trad climber
Seattle, WA
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Oct 14, 2010 - 12:03pm PT
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Thanks for the tale Tom! The quality of one's climbing experience is/was of paramount importance to many of us. Frigging just gets in the way...
MR. MOD- The FA framework is simply a device to put the gizmo's use in some kind of context. Since you give yourself unlimited personal freedom with the thing, that would potentially include an FA, would it not?
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LongAgo
Trad climber
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Oct 14, 2010 - 05:34pm PT
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Disaster,
My post rambled across both first and subsequent ascent experiences. As I said, for some of us, doing an established ascent and facing the same protection challenges as the FA team brings the quirky pleasure I describe. The history, lore, tales, oral and written tracks, interaction and sharing with others who have climbed the route first (and thereafter too) all combine to make for the totality of satisfaction in climbing. I realize for others the satisfaction may be primarily if not exclusively in the climb itself.
For first ascents, again some of us get satisfaction where protection is difficult and would prefer wrestling with that difficulty instead of making it easier by a stick, whether off the deck or higher up. Here, obviously, the satisfaction comes not in reflecting on the travails of the FA or subsequent teams, but in the work and ingenuity required to get the pro in.
So, I address both situations in the post, though admittedly my tale of days in Scotland focused on the FA experience. More generally, I hoped to paint some general lessons about the consequences good and bad of the climbing style choices we make with protection. Looking back, it seems the ramble was pretty rambling, so probably not all was clear.
Tom Higgins
LongAgo
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Mighty Hiker
climber
Vancouver, B.C.
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Oct 14, 2010 - 06:14pm PT
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Thanks, Tom - a nice story and helpful thoughts.
Sadly, some climbers don't understand that one of the fears in climbing that must be managed is fear of the unknown. Those who insist on being spoon fed route details will never experience all of climbing's challenges.
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