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neebee
Social climber
calif/texas
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hey there, say, tuolumne_tradster
thank you so much!! got it now...
thank you...
thanks for the pics, etc, here, too...
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healyje
Trad climber
Portland, Oregon
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This video and the photos above show a clear lack of substance, almost absent structural design and poor material and execution throughout.
[Click to View YouTube Video]
Dude! Where's my concrete and rebar!
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Reilly
Mountain climber
The Other Monrovia- CA
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Yes, TT, it does but it doesn't look very homogeneous and that's a pathetic
amount of rebar for something like that. It should have 10x that amount.
at the least. For that thickness it should have a top and a bottom cage.
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tuolumne_tradster
Trad climber
Leading Edge of North American Plate
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DWR appears to be posting self-incriminating photo evidence from the crime scene on their website.
The lack of rebar & other engineering design flaws coupled with the underlying geology and some bad decision making, lead to this disaster. In their defense, the recent poor decision-making is easy to criticize in retrospect.
Fortunately no one was killed...at least not yet. They are definitely not out of the woods yet either, with the amount of snow remaining in the watershed and the possibility of another atmospheric storm or abnormal warming trend later this month.
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healyje
Trad climber
Portland, Oregon
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Talk about take the money and run...
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Reilly
Mountain climber
The Other Monrovia- CA
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Geophysical imaging beneath the Main Spillway using Ground Penetrating Radar w/GPS
That sure looks to me like bolting the barn door after the horses done run.
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Winemaker
Sport climber
Yakima, WA
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Maybe more like seeing if they have to tear the whole thing out and start over. Intelligent and necessary move; you should be complaining if they weren't checking.
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Phil_B
Social climber
CHC, en zed
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Tradster,
Yep, you'd get a very good reflection from the contrast between air and concrete. It'd be much stronger than what you'd expect between concrete and the baserock.
With as thick as that slab is, I'd say that the 500 MHz antenna is the best one for the job. We did a lot of void surveys when I was in NZ, but the slabs were never thicker than 200-300 mm. We had no luck with a 500 mm slab.
I think they are totally justified in trying to see if there are other areas of weakness/voids beneath the slab. Main problem with GPR is that the area of investigation is so small. The 500 MHz antenna will not image areas of concern of even 0.5m so it would take a lot of transects to cover the remaining slab, even if they want to do a 10% coverage, which is not a lot.
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Winemaker
Sport climber
Yakima, WA
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Hey Reilly, here's some more rebar for you.........
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trailridge127
Trad climber
Loveland, CO
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^^Boom...In your face. See California can build structures to last. Oh wait.
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labrat
Trad climber
Erik O. Auburn, CA
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Keeping the upper spillway intact should be the highest priority. If they find voids under slab I would guess they will go for some form of high pressure grouting. Looks like they are working on the left sidewall as well. Anybody seen close up pictures of that?
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healyje
Trad climber
Portland, Oregon
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That sure looks to me like bolting the barn door after the horses done run.
No sh#t there.
Maybe more like seeing if they have to tear the whole thing out and start over
The upper spillway is a just as much a piece of fraudulent work as the rest of it. The whole thing definitely needs to be replaced with something substantial, but how the f*#k do you do that now - no time and you don't know what the next season or two will bring. The pooch has been way screwed by greed and avarice in the original construction.
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August West
Trad climber
Where the wind blows strange
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I would think, and hope, that if they can't get repairs completed by next fall that they are confident of, then they will substantially drain the lake.
If things stay wet the lack of storage won't be too big of deal.
If CA goes back into a drought you have some pissed off farmers.
So what. If you spend a billion dollars fixing the dam the cost of paying off a few farmers will be a footnote.
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healyje
Trad climber
Portland, Oregon
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I dunno, I would think that's somewhat wildly optimistic. There's really no 'repairing' the spillway. They can attempt to stabilize the what remains of the upper spillway, but that's about it. If they still have to use it, and they likely will, it will still be cutting away in its new channel and filling up the river below with debris and that will have to cleared after each time they use it. The only solution is an entirely new spillway. As I said, I just don't know how or when they'd be able to pull that off without draining the lake substantially as you suggest as it would be a multi-year project.
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Winemaker
Sport climber
Yakima, WA
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The spillway failed at 50,000 cu ft/sec. The rated maximum flow is 150,000 cu ft/sec. The ultimate flow, from a post by 'Stack Dump' on metabunk.org is:
According to the Emergency Spillway Release Diagram, the maximum capacity of the main spillway before the emergency spillway kicks in, is 250,000 cfs. The 150,000 cfs value is an operational limit determined by what happens downstream at Oroville.
I suspect the whole thing would have been gone. It's amazing to see the erosion to rebar on the spillway surface; seems to be heading for another failure higher up if they have to use it at high rates. Wish I owned a concrete business near the dam.....
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WBraun
climber
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When the dam filled up too fast it triggered a small quake 3 miles away which probably caused the original break in the spillway.
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tuolumne_tradster
Trad climber
Leading Edge of North American Plate
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The 2.1 magnitude earthquake that occurred about a month ago at about the time of peak inflow >180K cfs, was a quarry blast, not an earthquake.
Note depth of earthquake = 0 km.
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labrat
Trad climber
Erik O. Auburn, CA
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Perhaps the duck smoked a bit too much when he came up with that one....
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tuolumne_tradster
Trad climber
Leading Edge of North American Plate
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as far as the gubermint is concerned...IMHO, the USGS is fairly reliable
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