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monolith
climber
albany,ca
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Jul 23, 2012 - 03:33pm PT
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Yep, Mexico will thank us, since a huge number of assault weapons go to Mexico every day.
This should be the real reason for gun reform. These occasional mass shootings are not the real problem.
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monolith
climber
albany,ca
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Jul 23, 2012 - 03:35pm PT
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Yes Jody, it's against the law to shoot people.
What law should have prevented him from getting his guns?
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monolith
climber
albany,ca
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Jul 23, 2012 - 03:40pm PT
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I know, let the word games begin. We already had an assault weapon ban before so it's not that difficult. Sure, there will be loopholes. When those become a problem, then they will be closed.
And you are kidding right, try to wound 70 people and kill 12 with a hunting rifle.
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monolith
climber
albany,ca
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Jul 23, 2012 - 03:41pm PT
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Nothing.
End the assault weapen express to Mexico. Stop unlimited purchases of assault weapons.
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10b4me
Ice climber
dingy room at the Happy boulders hotel
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Jul 23, 2012 - 03:42pm PT
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Everytime I shoot a big game animal. . . . . .
not something I would be proud of.
saw the dude on television this morning, and he looked to be spaced out.
if he is as smart as they say he is, maybe he is playing the system.
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Don Paul
Big Wall climber
Colombia, South America
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Jul 23, 2012 - 03:47pm PT
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toadgas, the AR-15s can be converted to M-16's by modifying the firing pin, and maybe some other changes but it's not hard. This is what David Koresh was doing with a milling machine in his basement at Waco: converting AR-15s into machine guns. Actually, I'm surprised no one has brought up Waco yet.
If large numbers of assault rifles are being smuggled to Mexico, that's reason enough for me to want to outlaw them. Mexico: tan lejos de Dios, tan cerca a los Estados Unidos.
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monolith
climber
albany,ca
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Jul 23, 2012 - 03:50pm PT
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It wouldn't.
Read my post. I said the real reason for gun reform is the assault weapon express to Mexico, not the occasional massacre.
And if you want to play games with what's an assault weapon, then limit any gun purchase to max 1 per month. So you can only buy 12 guns a year. So what?
And you know damn well who is behind the express. It's the cartels getting US citizens to make straw purchases for them.
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fear
Ice climber
hartford, ct
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Jul 23, 2012 - 03:54pm PT
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So what can we do to try and prevent this? I'll give you a hint and it has nothing to do with beta mags or tear gas.
We can try to understand what caused this man to do what he did. Since he's still alive we can use the opportunity to disect him. We'll probably never understand but it can't hurt to try. Is there a physical or chemical difference in his brain? Was he on one of the popular psych pharma products that even General Practioners now prescribe with zero oversight? Just things to look for.
We can understand that sometimes mentally ill people are often hiding in plain sight. To that end it doesn't hurt to try and establish a dialog with people we come into contact with. I think as a society we've become very distant from those closest to us even though we are innundated with the social media bullsh#t. Make an effort to really know your neighbors and people you work with. I feel a lot of that has been lost in the past few decades.
In short, understanding the will of these mass murderers is what needs focus if anything is ever to be done. That's the hard way and doesn't make for engaging news bytes every 15 minutes. Instead there was some talking head on CNN explaining that they will NOT be giving the shooter any attention. As if he wasn't an important part of that night.
The easy way is to focus on the methods and tools which is absurd. But that makes the sheeple feel safe. Perhaps removing one's shoes at the airport gives solace to the woolly flock. Maybe I should feel safe the next time I have to dump my Nalgene out before going through security. Maybe the next Assault Weapon Ban will make the quivering masses breath a sigh of relief. Unfortunately, I know better....
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blahblah
Gym climber
Boulder
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Jul 23, 2012 - 04:13pm PT
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And you are kidding right, try to wound 70 people and kill 12 with a hunting rifle. According to media reports, the shooter's "assault rifle" jammed, so he went to his backup shotgun, and that was why so many people were injured and so relatively few killed. At least that's the report I heard on the radio; I don't think it's anything official. Sorry if this is been brought up already--I didn't read all the posts, but thought the above may be useful to correct the thinking of anyone who thinks that this tragedy was the result of "assault rifles."
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monolith
climber
albany,ca
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Jul 23, 2012 - 04:13pm PT
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He used a shotgun first. The handgun also had a large clip capacity.
I don't think these massacres can be prevented. My focus is limiting the unlimited assault weapons straw purchase express to Mexico.
Bush and Obama tried to stop the express, with their gunwalking operations and failed.
I suppose it makes one feel free to know they can buy 10 assault rifles any time they want.
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apogee
climber
Technically expert, safe belayer, can lead if easy
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Topic Author's Reply - Jul 23, 2012 - 04:18pm PT
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fear, much of what you suggest should play a role in a preventative approach, but to not address the aspect of the 'tool' in any respect is unlikely to produce any significant success.
There are two parts to these tragedies: the tool, and the person who uses it. Best results will come from acting on both.
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rectorsquid
climber
Lake Tahoe
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Jul 23, 2012 - 04:21pm PT
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Is there a physical or chemical difference in his brain?
Sure. And once we discover it, do you want to go get the voluntary test to see if you have the same thing?
Then pretend that you do test positive. What will society do with you?
I was in a theater many years ago when someone was stabbed to death in the parking lot. For that one person, the tragedy was pretty equal to any on person in the theater in Colorado. Making knives illegal would have prevented that death!
Life is dangerous and people can't stop all crime or all accidents without making life a living hell for everyone. At some point, a line needs to be drawn and it cannot be crossed or we will be a society of prisoners in a prison of our own making.
Dave
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Elcapinyoazz
Social climber
Joshua Tree
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Jul 23, 2012 - 04:55pm PT
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I don't hunt, but how many deer hunters hunt with semi-auto rifles, compared to bolt action or single shot or lever
Quite a few. In my family gun safe growing up we had ~12 deer rifles at any one time and typically over half were bolt actions (Rem 700s, a Weatherby, Ruger 77s) about 1/4 semi autos (Browning BARs almost exclusively).
It's pretty easy to design a semi auto deer rifle that would be really difficult to modify to hold more than 5 rounds or so (top loading, no removable mag), and they do serve a legit purpose in hunting.
Not in the same realm at all, but as a teenager my first upgrade after getting a new Ruger 10-22 was an aftermarket 50round magazine to replace the 10 round that comes stock. Granted this is .22LR, not exactly what you'd grab to murder people, but the concept is the same...anything with removable magazine is fairly easy to fit with larger magazine.
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michaeld
Sport climber
Sacramento
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Jul 23, 2012 - 04:57pm PT
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When I got my first rifle, Remmy 770, I wanted a bolt-action over a semi auto, because I wanted to be cool and rack the bolt.
Jus' sayin.
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Don Paul
Big Wall climber
Colombia, South America
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Jul 23, 2012 - 04:58pm PT
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If this guy really wanted to make a point, he would have been naked and stoned out of his mind on bath salts.
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michaeld
Sport climber
Sacramento
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Jul 23, 2012 - 04:58pm PT
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"Guy on bath-salts storms back entrance of theater, eating 12, wounding 59"
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graniteclimber
Trad climber
The Illuminati -- S.P.E.C.T.R.E. Division
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Jul 23, 2012 - 05:58pm PT
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According to media reports, the shooter's "assault rifle" jammed, so he went to his backup shotgun, and that was why so many people were injured and so relatively few killed. At least that's the report I heard on the radio; I don't think it's anything official. Sorry if this is been brought up already--I didn't read all the posts, but thought the above may be useful to correct the thinking of anyone who thinks that this tragedy was the result of "assault rifles."
The media reports I read say he started with a Remington 12 gauge 870 shotgun, and then quickly moved to using the AR-15 with a 100 round drum. The drum jammed after around 70 rounds, so he switched to a Glock 19 with a 40 round mag.
Remington 12 gauge 870 shotgun in action:
[Click to View YouTube Video]
AR-15 with jam-prone 100 round drum:
[Click to View YouTube Video]
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little Z
Trad climber
un cafetal en Naranjo
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Jul 23, 2012 - 06:38pm PT
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got back home last night after 3 days of blissful disconnect out in the wilds. Heard about the shooting and just started reading news bits, one of which includes a list of the victims' names. Saw the last name Blunk and wanted to know if this person was any relation to Scott Blunk, the Ft.Collins boulderer/climber. Anyone know? Sorry if this topic has already come up but the thread is a long one and I don't have time to sift through it right now.
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Crimpergirl
Sport climber
Boulder, Colorado!
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Jul 23, 2012 - 06:45pm PT
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MAJOR EDIT:
The photo I showed was of Scott Blunk, but he was not the one killed in the massacre. Sorry for any confusion. That particular Blunk is still posting to facebook today.
However, his buddy, JT, was killed. Clear they were close. Very, very sad.
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