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FullMonty
Trad climber
On a big mountain in Colorado
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Nov 19, 2010 - 10:16pm PT
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Yep, thats how it works. When we shoot an Elk or Moose in the backcountry, it either gets hauled out that day, or hung somewhere (quarterd of course.)
I think its a good thing that humans are not the top of the food chain right now. We have lots of toys that make us seem pretty tough, but we have really little teeth.
I saw some fresh kitty tracks last week, and it really made me think about biking in that area again.
Thats how it should be.
When you play (or hunt) in the mountains, just know that you are not the big kid on the block anymore, and thats a good thing.
The original residents want their turf back.
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Jaybro
Social climber
Wolf City, Wyoming
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Nov 19, 2010 - 10:18pm PT
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It's true!
-the following, in Bill Murray's ghostbusters voice.-
I've never seen AC piss!
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Jan
Mountain climber
Okinawa, Japan
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Dec 22, 2010 - 03:14am PT
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Group pushes for nationwide wolf restoration
By MATTHEW BROWN, Associated Press
Tue Dec 21, 8:01 pm ET
BILLINGS, Mont. – Environmentalists said Tuesday they intend to sue the
Obama administration to force it to restore gray wolves across the lower 48
states— even as Republicans in Congress sought unsuccessfully to strip the
animals of protection.
The Center for Biological Diversity said in a formal notice to the Interior
Department that it will sue the agency in 60 days unless the government
crafts a plan to bring back wolves throughout their historical range.
"Wolves once roamed nearly the whole country and down into Mexico, but at
this point there just in a fraction of that range," said Noah Greenwald,
director of endangered species for the Center for Biological Diversity.
About 6,000 wolves live in the lower 48 states. They are protected from
hunting except in Alaska.
Biologists for the Arizona-based group argue there is enough wild habitat to
support thousands of wolves in New England and New York, the southern
Rocky Mountains, parts of Colorado and the Cascade Range of Oregon and
Washington.
But prospects for new wolf packs in other parts of the country are uncertain
at best, given how polarized the debate over wolves has become in recent
months.
Like the Bush administration, the Obama administration has pushed to end
federal protections for wolves and turn control over the animals over to
states. Lawmakers from states where wolves already roam say there are too
many of the predators.
On Tuesday, Sen. Mike Crapo, R-Idaho, tried to force a full Senate vote on a
bill to strip wolves nationwide of federal protections.
The measure was backed by Republicans in Wyoming and Utah, but failed in
the face of Democratic objections.
Wolves were poisoned and trapped to near-extermination in the United States
in the last century. They have bounced back in some wilderness areas over
the last few decades, in part through government-sponsored reintroduction
programs.
Crapo said the growing population of wolves in the Northern Rockies —
more than 1,700 at the end of 2009 — was harming big game herds and
domestic
livestock.
"The longer we wait to resolve this issue, the more difficult it's going to be,"
he said.
But Sen. Benjamin Cardin, a Maryland Democrat, said the Republican bill
would undermine the Endangered Species Act. He criticized what he called
an attempt "to solve politically what should be done by good science."
Cardin suggested he would support a compromise pushed by Montana
lawmakers and the administration that would limit the scope of the bill to
include only wolves in the Northern Rockies.
Crapo said that proposal was unacceptable because it would have forced
Idaho to change the way it manages the animals.
Public hunts for wolves were allowed briefly in Montana, Idaho and
Wyoming in recent years. Those were halted after the federal government
was rebuffed by the courts in several attempts to take the animal off the
endangered list.
Judges have ruled that the government has not proved existing wolf
numbers would ensure the population's long-term survival.
Wolves are notorious predators. Experts say they could survive in most of
the country if they were allowed. But a hunger for livestock often gets the
animals into trouble, particularly in the Northern Rockies where ranches
and wolf territories often overlap.
Young adult wolves sometimes travel hundreds of miles when looking to
establish a new territory. In the last several years, packs have gained a
toehold in parts of Oregon and Washington. Others have been spotted
in Colorado, Utah and northern New England.
"We've learned from where wolves have been reintroduced that they
have a tremendous benefit," Greenwald, of the Center for Biological
Diversity, said. "They force elk to move around more, which allows
riparian vegetation to come back and increases songbirds, and they
control coyote populations."
The U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service is currently analyzing research into wolf
genetics to see how populations in different parts of the country relate
to one another.
Agency spokesman Chris Tollefson on Tuesday said the effort is not part
of a nationwide recovery plan, but declined to say if it could be used for
such an effort in the future.
He said results of the agency's work are expected in early 2011.
"It's designed to establish the best scientific foundation to make future
management decisions about wolves. That's about all I can say about
it at this point," Tollefson said.
__
Matthew Daly contributed to this story from Washington, D.C.
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edejom
Boulder climber
Butte, America
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Dec 22, 2010 - 03:41am PT
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Take away that (Billings, MT) by-line from there and it might hold salt--trust me on this; NOT the way the majority of Montanans think about wolves around here (wolf country).
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Brokedownclimber
Trad climber
Douglas, WY
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Topic Author's Reply - Dec 22, 2010 - 09:05am PT
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Sounds as though Rox and I will need to take some wolves back to Maryland!! That's THEIR Senator asking for them!!
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edejom
Boulder climber
Butte, America
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Dec 22, 2010 - 08:38pm PT
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Not afraid of spotted knapweed either, sure as hill don't want that in my backyard too...
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TKingsbury
Trad climber
MT
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I talked to my buddy an hour east recently and I asked how his hunting season went. He told me he had the best hunt in years. 4 elk and a whitetail...
I asked him about the wolves and elk herd sizes...he laughed and said something about lazy hunters eating weak and diseased elk...and that they should just learn to hunt...not sit in there rigs on a ranch waiting for a herd...
Anecdotal but interesting...wouldn't mind seeing numbers on tags issued vs elk harvested for this season though...
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Jaybro
Social climber
Wolf City, Wyoming
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Is your farm overrun with Turkeys and deer, like out here?
I've lived with wolves, I'd LOVE to have them here!
One of the first times, on one of my first backpack trips with my dad when I was 11 we hiked the length of Isly Royale NP in lake superior. This is an island 3 miles wide and 50 miles long, with an active population of Wolves and Moose, that depend on each other. We heard the wolves every night and every morning, an experience I'll always remember.
You know they're there, in your 'backyard' in Az? You might hear them, sometime, i have, there. Well, not right where you are.
Yes, please, re-introduce them in the Sierra!
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Jaybro
Social climber
Wolf City, Wyoming
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Never trust a fox to do a wolf's job?
Some places here in the golden state the turkeys are much like you describe with the rabbits, I always see them on the road to Gary Carpenter's house.
So, about the deer, Mtn Lions are at the top of their expansion phase of the pyramid, pretty much all over the west, right now. Is that not the case in Pa? Honest question, I really don't know.
Oh and the wolf howl is unique. If you're mindful at the time, you'll know it. Completely unlike sounds of dogs or coyotes. The coyotes' song is a treasure as well, though.
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Jaybro
Social climber
Wolf City, Wyoming
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Maybe a job for big weasels, like martins or something...
There is one section of a trail tha tirun here that I see Coyotes, i assume the same ones, about one in ten runs. Some times they will trot along on the trail maybe only thirty or so feet ahead of me, looking over their shoulder regularly until they get to 'their exit.' Sometimes they run behind me or will just see on the hillside and watch. They keep their gaurd up, but don't seem especially concerned. Not like some middle aged geezer is gonna catch them in a sprint or anything.
I saw one pee on the gas pump that used to be by camp four once.
How about Canada geese? They can be problematic here. They take over public parks and leave feces the size that cats leave in their boxes. All over the place.
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Jaybro
Social climber
Wolf City, Wyoming
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Dire wolves were.
Corn-ice, our tax dollars at work! Nowadays they just club them to death with $1200 toilet seats, recycling, as it were....
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Jan
Mountain climber
Okinawa, Japan
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Apr 17, 2011 - 03:36am PT
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The beginning of the end is my guess.
Wolves to come off endangered list within 60 days
BILLINGS, Mont. – Federal wildlife officials say they will take more than 1,300 gray wolves in the Northern Rockies off the endangered species list within 60 days.
An attachment to the budget bill signed into law Friday by President Barack Obama strips protections from wolves in five Western states.
It marks the first time Congress has taken a species off the endangered list.
Idaho and Montana plan public wolf hunts this fall. Hunts last year were canceled after a judge ruled the predators remained at risk.
Protections remain in place for wolves in Wyoming because of its shoot-on-sight law for the predators.
There are no immediate plans to hunt the small wolf populations in Oregon and Washington. No packs have been established in Utah.
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sandstone conglomerate
climber
sharon conglomerate central
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Apr 17, 2011 - 10:30am PT
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Hopefully the can start shooting eagles too. I hear they carry off babies and sheep
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golsen
Social climber
kennewick, wa
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Apr 17, 2011 - 10:53am PT
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AC
I don't believe wolves were ever native to the Sierra Nevada mountains.
That doesnt keep you from having your very own http://www.californiawolfcenter.org/
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Fritz
Trad climber
Choss Creek, ID
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Apr 17, 2011 - 11:30am PT
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sandstone conglomerate. re Hopefully the can start shooting eagles too. I hear they carry off babies and sheep
Nope we need those eagles. Not only do they take care of un-tended infants, but they really go after poodles.
What do you folks know about getting a tourist permit? I always see talk about tourist season, but I can't ever seem to buy a permit to shoot some.
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Brokedownclimber
Trad climber
Douglas, WY
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Topic Author's Reply - Apr 17, 2011 - 12:37pm PT
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I had a good discussion re: rights of ranchers and wolves with the local game warden last week. Any predator harassing livestock may be shot on sight, but then the G & F needs to be notified for removal of the carcass.
Of the 2 wolves seen nearby earlier, one was definitely killed from a helicopter by a wildlife biologist and professional hunter/tracker. The other of the pair has been seen several times since, but has avoided capture or being shot.
I'm now in the process of eliminating many of the feral cats that folks from town bring out and "drop off." They are the destroyers of nests of ground-nesting game birds: turkeys, sage grouse, and hungarian partridges.
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