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Gary
climber
Desolation Basin, Calif.
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Aug 17, 2010 - 09:57pm PT
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The WTC wasn't attacked by a bunch of secular Iraqis, either.
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Gary
climber
Desolation Basin, Calif.
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Aug 17, 2010 - 10:15pm PT
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Not at all, cragman. It speaks to the heart of the matter. Inundate the sheep with bullsh#t, scare them with the boogeyman, and then pick their pockets clean. It's classic, it's the modern GOP way.
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Gene
Social climber
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Aug 17, 2010 - 10:16pm PT
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Gary, the WTC was not attacked by a bunch of Muslim restaurant owners.
Can they (Muslim restaurant owners) worship in NYC? If not, what is the proper separation from GZ to an approved Muslim place of worship?
g
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, CA
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Aug 17, 2010 - 10:24pm PT
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You people are way off topic here. It isn't Islam per se. It's a faction within them that feels putting mosques up is actually 'submitting' America to Islam. Most Muslims don't adhere to this crap.
my ggod climbing buddy, Mason, is a Kansas muslim raised by Afghani parents. They Kick ass!!!111!!!! BTW. I met them. His dad is awesome! His mom is too but I spent more time with his dad.
In the morining when I woke up and looked out my rig, they was his dad sitting alone waiting for everyone to wake up at like 7am. I went out and said hey, told hm told to come to my rig and I'd make coffee. We chatted and he remarked, "These people don't know how to camp, they sleep till 9am and don't get going till 11am".
I laughed, but in their defense they had non-climbers and kids and it was a kick-back trip. But I dug the guy's attitude.
The night before I went on a whiskey induced tirade that Islam and Christianity had more in common that in dispute. At least Islam as his dad and he sees it.
Good, honest, religious people. I like them.
Fanatics, not so much...
Cheers, Mason! Your parents rock, see you this weekend.
(I don't post this story to wear tolerance on my sleeve, but rather to tell all you race-baiters to STFU!!!!)
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Gary
climber
Desolation Basin, Calif.
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Aug 17, 2010 - 10:35pm PT
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Goof, LEB, just make sh#t up, since reality isn't behind your position.
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Bertrand
climber
California
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Aug 17, 2010 - 11:00pm PT
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Hahaha.. what LEB said.
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, CA
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Aug 17, 2010 - 11:25pm PT
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Seriously blurring, do some research into the Sufis... you know, the group building this CULTURAL CENTER.
Contrast their beliefs and practices with Al Qaeda... you know, the ones who attacked US.
And then, if you still have time, get yourself a fuking clue.
Did you see what I posted about the Imam's book, asshat? Imam Rauf?
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, CA
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Aug 17, 2010 - 11:35pm PT
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a call to prayer from the world trade rubble: islamic dawa from the heart of america, post 9/11. Muslim version of the Imam's book.
What’s Right with Islam Is What’s Right with America English version title
Why have such different titles?
Gene, I fear a certain brand of Islam that refers to Christians as infidels getting a foothold in this country. A brand of Islam that removes a woman's clitoris because they feel she should no feel sexual pleasure.
THAT is un-American. I don't refer to muslim friends as inferior or infidels. I have respect for them because they're quite decent people. But there is a nasty brand out there (usually funded by Saudis) that cannot be allowed here. We already have enough fundamentalism here already. The crazy Christians, the wahabbiests, etc..
EDIT: In the future, do your own work, Wes. This is the last time I do it for you. If you ask questions, be prepared to research THE F*#KING ANSWER!!! You should know this!!!!
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, CA
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Aug 17, 2010 - 11:45pm PT
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The Imam of this facility has given out mixed messages, would they be open to a multi-religious facility??
No! That would be tolerant of infidels,,,,
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Norton
Social climber
the Wastelands
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Aug 17, 2010 - 11:48pm PT
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Strange that the FBI, under Bush in 2003, asked that Imam to advise their
counter terrorism operation.
Who would have been giving mixed signals then, the Imam or Bush/Cheney?
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, CA
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Aug 17, 2010 - 11:53pm PT
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Strange that the FBI, under Bush in 2003, asked that Imam to advise their
counter terrorism operation.
Who would have been giving mixed signals then, the Imam or Bush/Cheney?
Are you stupid, or just disingenuous????
He knew the peeps to target.
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Bertrand
climber
California
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Aug 17, 2010 - 11:54pm PT
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that sounds eerily like the weak and over-used argument that suggests somehow that if we were once friendly with someone, we can't complain when that "friend" goes bad...
e.g. U.S. support of the Taliban and Saddam Hussein in the 80's. Our past relationship doesn't change the nature of their actions today.
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Norton
Social climber
the Wastelands
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Aug 17, 2010 - 11:56pm PT
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Blue, I don't have to ask you if you are stupid.
As usual, I am just stating the FACTS, whether you like it or not.
In March 2003, federal officials were being criticized for disrespecting the rights of Arab-Americans in their efforts to crack down on domestic security threats in the post-9/11 environment. Hoping to calm the growing tempers, FBI officials in New York hosted a forum on ways to deal with Muslim and Arab-Americans without exacerbating social tensions. The bureau wanted to provide agents with "a clear picture," said Kevin Donovan, director of the FBI's New York office.
Brought in to speak that morning -- at the office building located just blocks from Ground Zero -- was one of the city's most respected Muslim voices: Imam Feisal Abdul Rauf. The imam offered what was for him a familiar sermon to those in attendance. "Islamic extremism for the majority of Muslims is an oxymoron," he said. "It is a fundamental contradiction in terms."
It was, by contemporaneous news accounts, a successful lecture.
Flash forward six-and-a-half years, and Feisal Abdul Rauf occupies a far different place in the political consciousness. The imam behind a controversial proposal to build an Islamic cultural center near those same FBI offices has been called "a radical Muslim," a "militant Islamist" and, simply, the "enemy" by conservative critics. His Cordoba House project, meanwhile, has been framed as a conduit for Hamas to funnel money to domestic terrorist operations.
For those who actually know or have worked with the imam, the descriptions are frighteningly -- indeed, depressingly -- unhinged from reality. The Feisal Abdul Rauf they know, spent the past decade fighting against the very same cultural divisiveness and religious-based paranoia that currently surrounds him.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2010/08/17/ground-zero-imam-helped-f_n_685071.html
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graniteclimber
Trad climber
Nowhere
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Aug 17, 2010 - 11:59pm PT
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"You people are way off topic here. It isn't Islam per se. It's a faction within them that feels putting mosques up is actually 'submitting' America to Islam. Most Muslims don't adhere to this crap."
The question is, Bluering, why YOU adhere to "this crap" (as you accurately put it).
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, CA
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Aug 18, 2010 - 12:13am PT
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Most Muslims don't adhere to this crap."
The question is, Bluering, why YOU adhere to "this crap" (as you accurately put it).
Isn't that self-answering??? Should i take the side of moderates or radicals?
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Crimpergirl
Sport climber
Boulder, Colorado!
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Aug 18, 2010 - 12:15am PT
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Interesting:
(CNN) – Former House Speaker Newt Gingrich's latest comments regarding the controversial Islamic center near the site of the 9/11 World Trade Center attack are being called "absurd" - from no less a conservative stalwart than Pat Buchanan.
Speaking on MSNBC on Tuesday, the former presidential candidate and conservative commentator said recent comments from Gingrich likening the proposed project to the hanging of a Nazi symbol outside the Holocaust Museum were merely part of the former Speaker's efforts to appear more controversial than Sarah Palin.
"Newt is a political opportunist," Buchanan said. "What Newt is doing is he's trying to get out and be more flamboyant and more charismatic, if you will, and more controversial than Sarah Palin, who is his primary challenger, if he gets into Iowa and New Hampshire. She will take all his oxygen and a lot of his support."
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, CA
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Aug 18, 2010 - 12:19am PT
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What's your point, Crimpie????
Wes,
fatty, from the Cordoba House website,
So we should believe them with an Imam with books with different titles based on the sub-culture he addresses? Fo real?
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Crimpergirl
Sport climber
Boulder, Colorado!
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Aug 18, 2010 - 12:21am PT
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My point is that is interesting, just as I stated.
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corniss chopper
Mountain climber
san jose, ca
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Aug 18, 2010 - 12:23am PT
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Weschrist
That does sound very nice and sincere. Probably written by some expensive
NY Public relations firm hired by the Iman. Change a few nouns and
it could be applied to a whore house in the NV desert. Doesn't mean anything.
Its all about zoning and we need to know who is being paid off to let them build it there. The rake off is happening. Just want to know their names and see their faces on the front page of the NY papers.
Cc
Zoning is a device of land use planning used by local governments in
most developed countries . The word is derived from the practice
of designating permitted uses of land based on mapped zones which
separate one set of land uses from another. Zoning may be use-based
(regulating the uses to which land may be put), or it may regulate
building height, lot coverage, and similar characteristics, or some
combination of these. Similar urban planning methods have dictated the use
of various areas for particular purposes in many cities from ancient
times.
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, CA
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Aug 18, 2010 - 12:24am PT
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Crimps, I'm sure you'd agree everybody would win with a mosque move. No?
It would show respect and tolerance. That's me though...
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