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Ouch!
climber
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Sep 23, 2007 - 04:59pm PT
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Found this online. What does it signify in the scheme of things?
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Toker Villain
Big Wall climber
Toquerville, Utah
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Topic Author's Reply - Sep 23, 2007 - 05:05pm PT
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that mormons like to pose anonomously with a floral backdrop??
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Ouch!
climber
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Sep 23, 2007 - 05:10pm PT
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What would you call it? Armored Boxers?
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Sam Lightner, Jr
Social climber
WY
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Sep 23, 2007 - 10:58pm PT
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Loooks like comfortable attire for climbing in Thailand.... or playing quarterback for the 49'ers for 8 years.
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Toker Villain
Big Wall climber
Toquerville, Utah
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Topic Author's Reply - Sep 24, 2007 - 08:47pm PT
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As of 3:30 the Jeffs jury was hung on count two, the charge of "accomplice to rape" that applies to the extended duration of the arranged marriage (of a 14 year old to her 19 year old cousin).
They may have already decided to convict (or aquit) on count one, the shorter time duration charge.
No doubt there are mormons on the jury. The defense attorney has already stated that this should not be a referendum on religion, but I doubt half the jury listened.
It'll be interesting to see how this one shakes out.
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Jennie
Trad climber
Salt Lake
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Sep 24, 2007 - 10:42pm PT
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No offense, Ron. When you say Mormons on the jury, who are we defining as Mormons? Members of LDS church or any one connected with polygamous sects?
Warren Jeffs was never a member of LDS church, although his father was excommunicated early in the 1930's. Jeffs was born and spent part of his childhood in San Francisco.
To LDS people, calling Jeffs a Mormon is a joke. I can't wait to see the next human comet hurtling out of the Oort Cloud of quasi religion whom mormon bashers and the media can put up as their straw mormon.
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Toker Villain
Big Wall climber
Toquerville, Utah
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Topic Author's Reply - Sep 24, 2007 - 11:35pm PT
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I never called Jeffs a mormon. He's FLDS isn't he?
But with OUR demographic I truly doubt there aren't devoted LDS members of the jury. As such it seems likely to me that it becomes one sect's disdain for the other with rhe facts of the case merely a convenient construct.
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Jennie
Trad climber
Salt Lake
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Sep 25, 2007 - 12:19am PT
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I never called Jeffs a mormon. He's FLDS isn't he?
No, you didn't refer to Jeffs as a mormon but you alluded to mormons on the jury. I wondered if you meant members of LDS faith. Others, here, have used a loose interpretation of "mormon".
Yes, there is some prejudice in the mainline LDS against other sects who are seen as "pretenders". But there is still a tendency, on the part of Latter Day Saints to "go easy" on people who practice polygamy since many members ancestors practiced plural marriage also.
Jeff''s offenses go well beyond plural marriage, and the charges against him probably only scratch the surface of his iniquities. (My opinion) But you know if he's acquitted pundits will say it was mormons on the jury in sympathy with him and his practices and if he's found guilty it will be " mormon jurors wanting to make an example and distance themselves from polygamous sects."
The conditions associated with John D Lee's trial and execution had parallels with respect to how the national press interpreted events. The jury was predominately mormon. Had he been acquitted for his role in the Mountain Meadows Massacre it would have been "fellow mormons allowing him to skate free." When he was found guilty it was "mormons attempting to distance themselves from MMM by sacrificing Lee."
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Toker Villain
Big Wall climber
Toquerville, Utah
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Topic Author's Reply - Sep 25, 2007 - 12:35am PT
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We'll see.
I bet the verdicts in tomorrow.
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philo
Trad climber
boulder, co.
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Sep 25, 2007 - 01:12am PT
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I believe that the above picture signifys that Calvin Cline aint no Mormon.
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Toker Villain
Big Wall climber
Toquerville, Utah
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Topic Author's Reply - Sep 25, 2007 - 02:04pm PT
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I was dead wrong.
A juror has just been replaced for an undisclosed reason. The new jury goes back to square one.
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Ouch!
climber
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Sep 25, 2007 - 02:39pm PT
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Back about 26 years, I worked with a guy who hooked up with a Mormon woman. Joined the church and married her. Right away he dived into his new religion with all four feet. He became a true fanatic. About drove me nuts with his proselytizing until I finally put my foot down and told him to shut the hell up. He was a nice enough guy. Like an overgrown kid.
He was forever driving to get some approval from his bishop and hauling down to Salt Lake, doing something he called ordnances. I got the idea he had to pay each time he went.
He had a notion that to get right, he had to go back and ask forgiveness from everyone he had done wrong. Sort of like Earl on TV. He had a list made up.
There was a married woman he had played around with and when he showed up at her house to atone, her husband found out about it and took a dim view of the process. I guess it turned into a hell of a mess and I never found out how the poor woman made out or what it did to her marriage.
He barely got out of town ahead of a bullet so I have doubts as to the acceptance of his apology.
Didn't slow him down at all. Last time I saw him, he was still convinced he could single-handedly convert the world and was giving it his best shot.
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stevep
Boulder climber
Salt Lake, UT
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Sep 25, 2007 - 02:53pm PT
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The LDS juror in the Jeffs trial question is an interesting one. I'd guess, just based on percentages that at least half are LDS.
Does that make them more or less likely to convict? On the balance I'd say maybe a little more likely, as I'd guess many of them are not happy with the abhorrent things Jeffs and the FLDS is doing being in any way associated with the mainstream LDS church.
On the other hand, I think many LDS folks in that corner of the state are somewhat liberatarian leaning, and oppose government interference (except in the case of booze or porn). Maybe those libertarian leanings will balance things out?
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Jennie
Trad climber
Salt Lake
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Sep 25, 2007 - 04:07pm PT
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"He was forever driving to get some approval from his bishop and hauling down to Salt Lake, doing something he called ordnances. I got the idea he had to pay each time he went."
Ouch, the LDS church doesn't charge money for temple ordinances, or bishop recommends. (Bishops aren't salaried, no tips either) But he probably had to buy his own gas or air fare to get to Salt Lake. Could have saved gas money marrying a nice Catholic girl. And I understand confession is a one stop service in the Roman faith. No atonement lists, no husbands, no dodging bullets.......
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Ouch!
climber
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Sep 25, 2007 - 04:32pm PT
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"And I understand confession is a one stop service in the Roman faith. No atonement lists, no husbands, no dodging bullets..... "
Jennie, you have me at a disadvantage as I know little about the Roman faith. I suspect they might be like most of the lot. Stripped bare of ritual, icons, metaphors, and myths, all that's left is imagination in any of them. I can do without the bullets.
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Toker Villain
Big Wall climber
Toquerville, Utah
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Topic Author's Reply - Sep 25, 2007 - 07:41pm PT
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Looks like I guessed right about them slamming him.
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Ouch!
climber
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Sep 25, 2007 - 07:48pm PT
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Lost origins. Inconvenient.
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Quaken
Trad climber
Las Vegas
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Sep 25, 2007 - 07:52pm PT
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You don't really think they could have let him get away with his antics any longer with Mit ready to take the country by storm.
If you are morm and tired of the 'bashing' now, just wait till hillerys' jack booted storm troopers get a full head of steam!
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Ouch!
climber
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Sep 25, 2007 - 07:56pm PT
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"Mit ready to take the country by storm."
Wind storm
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