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LAhiker
Social climber
Los Angeles
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Aug 29, 2013 - 02:35pm PT
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Outdoor Gal, thanks for the further reflections and the brief report on the student's dream.
Yes, the fencing could be logs next to a trail. Some people on FB did mention Duck Pass and the Duck Pass Trail -- I think it's in the same general area and goes up near Blue Crag.
I had thought the fencing was more near a drop-off. Maybe we can get more details about the fencing in the dream/vision. (It wasn't clear to me whether that was from the clairvoyant or Tiffany herself.)
Donna from Mammoth posted on FB re some other alternative:
do not know what fence it could refer to but the town bike trail to the Lake Basin has fence along the steepest area. Mammoth also has some historical mining areas with old fencing and buildings? If Matt hiked to the Lake Basin he could have gone by either area.
I need to do some other things soon, but will check back later.
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zBrown
Ice climber
Brujo de La Playa
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Aug 29, 2013 - 03:20pm PT
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Hey zBrown don't forget to come bak and read this one.
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tdg119
Social climber
Northampton, PA
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Topic Author's Reply - Aug 29, 2013 - 04:23pm PT
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this what i saw but much larger. after searching the web all day its called a lemurian crystal.
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ß Î Ø T Ç H
Boulder climber
extraordinaire
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Aug 29, 2013 - 04:31pm PT
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tylerhenry
Social climber
Hanford
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Aug 29, 2013 - 05:34pm PT
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Hi guys!
I'm the medium who's original testimonial is found in the OP. I decided to join to answer any questions you guys might have, as I've been in contact with various intuitive people about this case for the past few days and have gotten quite a few responses. I've established a document compiling quite a few experiences/visions, however it's a work in progress.
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1xOg0HrKwpXQ34MEyKYFjj8c4H8KzzB3mVojEqJ27RJw/edit
After revising my original documentation of the Blue Diamond, I do not feel I found its exclusive meaning. Though I do feel it may have referenced to the terrain, I have to agree with the other individual who posted on this thread that there is indeed much more to it. It very well may have various meanings, and the document I've created will hopefully explore various possibilities.
Last night I had a dream of a very volcanic looking area -- the rock was darker and solid, and again, there were few trees. The portion I saw wasn't particularly rigid, however I know it had rigid parts. May have been a dome or an area where domes may be -- I've never been to Mammoth, so I have no idea of the terrain or if any area like I saw in my vision could even exist.
I'm trying to maintain a logical, intuitive approach to these visions and their compilation. A lot of people have had some profound dreams and experiences, and I don't want to discount anyone, as the possibilities are endless. I also want to find common denominators and note similarities in the visions for whatever they're worth.
Great suggestions on this thread thus far.
T
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LAhiker
Social climber
Los Angeles
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Aug 29, 2013 - 06:14pm PT
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Tyler, thanks for joining us and for your insights. I appreciate your organized approach and Google doc.
Do you remember any more about the fence, such as how tall it was, whether it consisted of posts joined by two lines of railings, or whether it was constructed in some other way?
Do you have any sense of how big the dome or dome-like mountain was?
When Matt showed you the map of Mammoth Crest, were the two prominent mountains on it? Or did you see him standing on the trail with the railing, looking at the mountains? Did you get a good look at the mountains, so you could see what they looked like?
I realize that the dream may have been fleeting and that it may not be possible to answer these questions...
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RM217
climber
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Aug 29, 2013 - 06:20pm PT
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So...this afternoon I did some thinking...or should I say "unthinking." When I finally stopped trying to make sense of it was when it actually started making sense. And without explaining why (very long story) - the dream fit my way of thinking. And my dream began to make sense to me.
The tree - I believe has no significant value itself. The needles, the leaves, the detail. I don't believe that is important. It served as a distraction. The tree itself is an obstruction of view. What I am not sure of if it is a physical or emotional obstruction. My feeling is though, that it is both. Emotions can and will obstruct, distort, distract, making it hard to see anything else. Or the obstruction can represent that the view of Matt is physically obstructed.
The window/glass - it was crystal clear. The cleanest glass I have ever seen in my life. Trying to decifer this in the beginning, I was thinking binoculars, camera, something with a lens of some sort. It seemed to make sense especially with the out of focus areas of the window. But, I now attribute the out of focus areas on the obstruction of view. With my own words earlier, I wrote how when you take a close up shot, everything in the background is out of focus. That's what happened. I was so focused on the tree as significant, which took my focus off the surrounding areas where the real clues might have been. So, the glass represents to me that something is being missed and it shouldn't be because it should be quite clear. From everything I have read and learned so far, Matt is methodical, he is careful, he's a planner, yet he has the ability to "change course" if he needed to. He is able to spot danger and while he may love the thrill of hiking and climbing, he isn't a thrill seeker, living on the edge, so to speak. He has probably challenged himself and there was probably a time or two (hundred) that he said "whew." But, he learned and exhibited self-control. He respected nature. And he understood nature. He was aware of what equipment to use and what he may not have needed. Through the years, he has gained a vast amount of knowledge about well-being in the wilderness (food, water, etc). He is a quiet person and a private person and it seems he lives a simple life, and is somewhat a creature of habit, therefore predictable. To know Matt is to understand Matt. And I feel there are a select few that know Matt on that deep-connecting level, but I believe they might hold the key.
The glasses that were found are kind of a confirmation about the "crystal clear" thing for me. The glasses shouted "CAN'T YOU SEE?" But, we couldn't see, we can't see. The glasses were dirty and scratched...an obstruction.
Which brings me to the last and maybe most important object. The blue diamond. In the other dreams, the "blue thing" is called a crystal. I suppose a diamond is a crystal in a way. Although I saw the diamond more as a shape, not a ring I see it being significant as a "treasure." A treasure meaning something important (not necessarily as in monetary value). Whether it's a diamond or crystal (and either could be very relevant) it is something that I feel shouldn't be ignored. In Ron's dream, Matt was trying to give it to Ron, in the student's dream, it was behind Matt and in mine, it was almost hidden (by the obstruction). I will have to do some more "unthinking" about the "treasure." Both the gem and the color blue I think are significant. The shapes are all different. One in a wand. One in a diamond. One in a circle (rock/boulder).
(sorry again for long post)
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tylerhenry
Social climber
Hanford
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Aug 29, 2013 - 06:27pm PT
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"Do you remember any more about the fence, such as how tall it was, whether it consisted of posts joined by two lines of railings, or whether it was constructed in some other way?"
The fence wasn't very tall at all. I'd say maybe four feet off the ground. (Just a general estimate). I saw two different types of fences. On one trail, it appeared as though there was a "fencing" that consisted of oak posts connected with wooden planks that went horizontally. I'll consult Google to try and find a visual example.
On the more profound vision, the fence consisted only of upward planks connected by a fine barbed wire. These fences were less intricate and simpler.
Do you have any sense of how big the dome or dome-like mountain was?
I've never been to Mammoth myself, so I have no idea what the norm would be, but the Dome was large enough to look like the side of a mountain. What's odd is that it wasn't very hard to climb -- it just had a smoother surface than a traditional mountain. I only saw the bottom portion of the dome/mountain, but I know had he kept going up, it would have been rugged and much steeper (not smooth like where I saw him as being).
Edit: He was towards the bottom of wherever he would have started venturing. There WAS snow/ice towards the top of this mountain.
When Matt showed you the map of Mammoth Crest, were the two prominent mountains on it? Or did you see him standing on the trail with the railing, looking at the mountains? Did you get a good look at the mountains, so you could see what they looked like?
He had mentioned two mountains in the Mountain Crest area. Whether that was just a reference to Mountains he had seen in prior trips, I don't know. There wasn't a direct correlation to his whereabouts, but it was incredibly notable. I got a good look at them. There didn't seem to be much if any snow where he was standing, so it makes me think he'd be elsewhere.
I don't know the area, and want the professional opinion of well-experienced hikers to come before any form of psychic information. Though it certainly can be useful, the people who know the area certainly have an upper hand.
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RM217
climber
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Aug 29, 2013 - 07:19pm PT
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Tioga - I absolutely 1000% appreciate your insight on this. Sometimes the outside looking in provides more clarity than the inside looking out. I, too, did hear that before about the tree and I don't want to count that completely out either. What I initially thought was tree of life. And if you google that for images - there is a wide array of different kind of trees - like mine seemed to be. My brain was so wrapped up in trying to decifer this dream and I just told myself it was time to let it go for a while. I was starting to second guess everything...thinking I was reading in to it too much, or maybe not enough. I think I cleared my head and diverted my attention to something else completely and that's when it came to me...I was reminded of something I had gone through many years ago (my long story) and more than anything I felt it was an obstruction. Maybe the tree does still represent life (or at least hope of life - I am hopelessly optomistic, have always been). I suppose the "obstruction" could have come in any form (house, mountain, bright sun), so the fact that it was a tree could hold some value.
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LAhiker
Social climber
Los Angeles
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Aug 29, 2013 - 07:36pm PT
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Tyler, thanks for your detailed reply! And hi! I wondered whether you were the same Tyler who's over on the Facebook page.
If you get the chance, I have a few more questions.
-You mention that the simpler fence was in the more profound vision. Which was the more profound vision? Also, were the upright planks in the simpler fence right next to each other (more like slats), or were they fence posts joined by wires?
-You say Matt was near the smooth lower sides of a domed mountain with snow/ice on top. Did you have a sense of what color the side of that mountain was? (I think in the second vision you said it was dark.) Did you have a sense of what it was made of -- for instance, do you have a sense of whether it was loose dirt, or something more pebbly, or smooth rock?
Thanks!
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LAhiker
Social climber
Los Angeles
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Aug 29, 2013 - 07:59pm PT
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RM217, I like your "unthinking" and appreciate your discussion with Tioga.
I'm mostly on this thread because I hope that these dreams and intuitions can help find Matt. I'm not usually into spiritual stuff, at least not in public. But though I and we can think of practical meanings for the window and the tree, I nearly cried when I read your post. So I'm going to stop being practical for a moment and tell you what I thought of when I read your "unthinking" post. (I'm not pushing any point of view, just reporting my thoughts.)
First, the glass window. In Buddhism, the clearest glass is awareness, the unchanging frame around everything we experience. Supposedly to experience the awareness -- to feel more the awareness rather than its changing contents -- can bring peace and joy. Perhaps in a moment of extremity, one feels this pure awareness.
Second, the crystal. Matt was trying to give Ron a big crystal. You point out that a crystal or a diamond is a treasure -- not necessarily monetary. What was Matt's biggest treasure? His life. Simple, clear, and complete, like a crystal. Maybe he wants to give that to his friends and family.
But what gets in the way? Matt is too far away and can't reach them. They don't know what happened to him or where he is. Maybe that's why this bugs us so much and we want to find him.
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tylerhenry
Social climber
Hanford
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Aug 29, 2013 - 08:17pm PT
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Tyler, thanks for your detailed reply! And hi! I wondered whether you were the same Tyler who's over on the Facebook page.
That's me! :)
-You mention that the simpler fence was in the more profound vision. The simpler fence (wired one) came through right before I had the vision of Matt on the side of that mountain. It may imply that the trail he used to get there had this type of fencing.
Which was the more profound vision? Also, were the upright planks in the simpler fence right next to each other (more like slats), or were they fence posts joined by wires?
The more profound vision was the one in which Matt was on the side of the mountain -- the one where he was in the Mountain Crest area seemed happier and more trivial -- he was simply looking out into the horizon.
They were most definitely fence posts that were joined by wires -- the planks themselves were feet from another, connected by barbed wire of some sort.
-You say Matt was near the smooth lower sides of a domed mountain with snow/ice on top. Did you have a sense of what color the side of that mountain was? (I think in the second vision you said it was dark.)
It was indeed dark. Not black, but a darker grey. The rigid part of the mountain reminded me a lot of the consistency of rough tourmaline (pictured below).
Did you have a sense of what it was made of -- for instance, do you have a sense of whether it was loose dirt, or something more pebbly, or smooth rock?
At the bottom of the mountain, there was definitely large gravel. That's the best way to put it -- large amounts of natural rock that would have been tough on the ankles without proper shoes. There were pretty big clumps of rocks measuring anywhere from four to six inches. The slope of the mountain had a portion that was a bit smoother and easier to access, and then the upper region where I feel he may have gone was far more rugged and vertical.
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tylerhenry
Social climber
Hanford
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Aug 29, 2013 - 08:34pm PT
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Also, I just want to add this -- in the dream of Matt, he made it very clear that he felt he was NOT equipped to do a huge peak, and that he would have had a partner if he intended to do something drastic. Even in the area that I saw in the visions, it wouldn't have been incredibly difficult to get where he went. It's not like he got to the top of a peak or anything like that, it appears as though something happened while he was working on either the lower portion of a mountain, trail etc. He said he had done it countless times (referring to the difficulty of the area he was in) and felt it wasn't of any concern because it wasn't dangerous.
I personally wouldn't be looking high, I'd be looking lower. The bottom and mid-section of smaller mountains as opposed to high peaks. He simply made it clear that he would have had a partner if he intended to do a trail or peak of higher difficulty.
This was something at least intermediate in difficulty that wouldn't have been incredibly hard for him -- a climb or movement that would have been relatively easy that very well may have just gone wrong.
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tylerhenry
Social climber
Hanford
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Aug 29, 2013 - 08:41pm PT
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This is exactly the type of fencing I was seeing in the vision. Maybe someone familiar with the area can clue us in on how prominent that type of fencing is? (If it's not common, maybe give us an idea of what trails it may be near?)
I also want to add that in the vision of Matt on the side of the mountain area, I didn't see a helmet in sight. I certainly saw what looked like a backpack (I was looking at him from the side, so it was rather hidden), but no helmet was apparent (unless it was in his bag -- but even though it was a relatively manageable area where he started off at, it still seems like he'd of worn a helmet to protect from falling rocks had he intended to climb much higher up).
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Klimmer
Mountain climber
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Aug 29, 2013 - 09:42pm PT
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I really appreciate everyone who in some way are all connected to Matt and had dreams, even psychics and what they are experienced, have come forward and shared the detail. Would like to know the students dream in detail too. Hopefully that can happen.
I appreciate no-one has ridiculed all this disclosure either, and has given respect. Thank you.
I will reveal just a little how important dreams are, and how they are at times from the divine.
I make no apologies about my faith, Messianic Judaism. I know HaShem is real and there is another world. People on ST for the most part know this about me and I certainly get ribbed for it. Big time. I have to wear a Teflon armored suit and asbestos underwear to survive here.
However, HaShem does communicate to us through dreams, whether you're a believer or not. Read the whole story of Joseph in the Bible. Many who had dreams would come to Joseph and he would tell them what they meant. He had this gift directly from G-d, and it saved Egypt and Israel from famine. He saved many lives. HaShem gave him dreams and he had the gift of dream interpretation.
Joseph the Dreamer:
http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Genesis+37&version=NCV
Dreams can be from G-d. The fact that many different people are experiencing similar things in their dreams concerning Matt is very important, and one would have to admit its beyond our ability to understand unless you accept that there is more beyond this physical life.
http://www.gotquestions.org/Christian-dream-interpretation.html
A personal experience in my life to show you the power of dreams:
I have had dreams my life long (like everyone) but one in particular has changed my life and woke me up with absolute vivid memory of it. I had a very detailed dream that went on for a long-time. In the dream my wife was driving our Syncro Vanagon, and I was asleep in the passenger seat but fully aware of what was happening around me. Like I had a third person movie view of everything. We were headed down a slight grade on a coastal highway like Hwy 1 in California. We were going South. There was a strong guard rail on the right along the vertical cliffs that were 1000s of feet high, and then a wide coastal plain to the ocean. The highway was turning to the left up ahead. Comatose and with no emotion my wife drove right through the guard-rail rather than turn left to follow the road and we were instantly in free-fall projectile motion 1000s of feet above the coastal plain heading toward the ocean. I immediately awoke and was pissed, sad, and crying all at the same time. I asked her what has she done? She was still comatose looking straight ahead but with tears starting to run down her cheek. To make a long story short, the free-fall continued for a long time. Lots of detail. Eventually we came to a bumpy yet soft landing on the beach. The vehicle started to roll along into the shallow surf and then stopped. I quickly got out, ran around and got my wife and carried her in my arms to the dry beach and set her down. She was crying. I looked back and the vehicle was starting to sink into the beach mud nose first. I ran back got a rope from the vehicle tied it onto the back bumper and pulled the vehicle down and dragged it back up to the dry beach safe. I went back and sat a short distance from my wife and started to cry, and thanked G-d that we were Ok, and that we didn't die. And then someone on the beach who saw us said that was the longest free-fall they had ever witnessed. I answered back, I don't want to ever experience that again.
I told my wife and my kids my dream in fine detail the very next morning. They all listened intently. I told them wow, not sure what that means, but it was vivid.
One week later my wife left me. I had no clue that was going to happen. Things seemed to be going well. The moment she left me and the shock set-in the dream came rushing back and I knew exactly what it meant. HaShem warned me but I was asleep. I couldn't understand what it meant when he told me at the very moment. I wasn't meant to. The dream at that moment was meant for my wife, not me. It was so vivid I couldn't help myself, I had to tell her and my children. She had been secretly preparing to leave me for a month before she left. HaShem was telling her that he knew what she was going to do before she did it. And he also let me warn the children, yet they didn't know what it meant either. Well, now I know what every little detail in that dream means today. I've gone through it time and time again, and with a Christian marriage counselor. We know what it means. And in the end I let her go. That is gonna happen soon through divorce court, over 2 years later.
Back to dreams regarding Matt ...
The dreams regarding Matthew and the Blue crystal, blue diamond, trees, Matt trying to give the long blue crystal to Ron, arrowheads, wooden fences, looking through someone else's eyes through a very clear window etc. etc. all tell a very accurate story that HaShem through Matt is trying to get you to pay attention to. The fact that the blue crystal is long is probably him telling you that there is something about the blue crystal that is important. He's trying to emphasize that point, that blue crystal, that blue diamond. And he's having a hard time giving it too you perhaps because you don't want to accept what it might mean.
The fact that all of you including the psychic came forward and shared a little about your dreams and experiences before the pictures of the glasses were ever revealed is very, very important. Similar to how I revealed my dream to my wife before she left me.
Think on that. The answer is before you.
Edit:
RM217 your dream with 9 window pains then down to one. Perhaps means many ideas but then only one is true.
I have mentioned this in another thread, July 16th, 2013, was the last night of the 9th of Av, 2013. In Judaism, the 9th of Av, is like Friday the 13th. Not good. Too much bad history has occurred on this date. It's as though extreme evil is released on this date, or always takes advantage on this date.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tisha_B'Av
http://www.chabad.org/library/article_cdo/aid/946703/jewish/What-happened-on-the-Ninth-of-Av.htm
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RM217
climber
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Aug 29, 2013 - 09:46pm PT
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Second, the crystal. Matt was trying to give Ron a big crystal. You point out that a crystal or a diamond is a treasure -- not necessarily monetary. What was Matt's biggest treasure? His life. Simple, clear, and complete, like a crystal. Maybe he wants to give that to his friends and family.
LAhiker - Yes, this is EXACTLY what I was thinking. The diamond/crystal was what Matt saw as a treasure. Not us. And it makes perfect sense. His life is his biggest treasure. Yes. Agree with this 100%.
First, the glass window. In Buddhism, the clearest glass is awareness, the unchanging frame around everything we experience. Supposedly to experience the awareness -- to feel more the awareness rather than its changing contents -- can bring peace and joy. Perhaps in a moment of extremity, one feels this pure awareness.
This makes sense also. The awareness kind of walks hand in hand with clarity.
But the glass is also an obstacle, as what's behind the glass is unreachable, miles and time separating the dreamer from what they see.
Tioga - Absolutely true. This is what I felt. I wanted to reach out and touch the tree, but the window was the barrier. And in my dream, there was no way to open the window.
The dream book I mentioned says that "seeing a tree through the window" in a dream means: "seeing the world through the eyes of another person"--I haven't noticed this part right away, only when I moved onto "window" meaning.
Very interesting! So, am I seeing things through what I believe to be Matt's eyes? Then what I see as the obstruction, maybe it was Matt's obstruction. I understand the meaning of the tree in a dream and even agree with it, because I thought that initially - but I still can't count out the obstruction - (or maybe it is the glass as an obstruction?) I definetely feel the obstruction is important. Mostly because I didn't seek that answer...it wasn't until I let it go that it came to me.
And - LAhiker - I too hope this leads to the finding of Matt. I am by no means a psychic. I don't even read my horoscope... but I have had some strange dreams in the past that have come to pass. In those dreams, something specific took place and then later happened. There was nothing to try to decifer, like in this one.
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RM217
climber
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Aug 29, 2013 - 09:52pm PT
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I'm the medium who's original testimonial is found in the OP.
Hi Tyler...nice to see you jump in and give your thoughts. What is the OP?
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tylerhenry
Social climber
Hanford
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Aug 29, 2013 - 09:56pm PT
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Hi Tyler...nice to see you jump in and give your thoughts. What is the OP?
Hi there! The OP = Original Post. The testimonial at the beginning of this thread was sent by me in an email. I mentioned in one of my first posts with this account that I agreed with your interpretation about the Blue Diamond (even though I was the one who felt it was a play on words) -- as I think it very well may have many meanings, and I really appreciate your contribution to the thread -- we have some great ideas flowing and hopefully we can get some answers. Hope you're having a great day. :)
T
From a blog post about Crystal Crag, as it mentions the reason why it was named so (even though it's been mentioned it's not the likely climbing choice):
"Crystal Crag is a little fin above Lake Mary, near Mammoth Lakes, named for a vein of quartz crystals near the top of its north end"
"I was close enough to reach the crystal pitch, though, which was short, but as cool-looking as promised. I stopped to take a few pictures of the huge quartz blocks, but it was hard to get a good shot in the shade."
"From the top of the crystals, a long, exposed 4th class traverse led to the summit."
I really like this tioga. It wouldn't surprise me if the blue diamond/crystal reference might be describing a location.
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RM217
climber
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Aug 29, 2013 - 10:31pm PT
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The fact that all of you including the psychic came forward and shared a little about your dreams and experiences before the pictures of the glasses were ever revealed is very, very important. Similar to how I revealed my dream to my wife before she left me.
First, I am so sorry about your wife leaving you...And I hope you have found peace in it all. I believe when one door closes, another opens, but you have to have the courage to walk through.
I agree... the fact that the dreams/visions came out PRIOR to the glasses being found was very important. Credibility would have been out the window (no pun intended). I can't help but think that people have to think this is borderline insanity. I am definitely out of my comfort zone here. But, I feel it was important. In my entire life I have rarely shared my dreams with anyone...and especially not the "strange" ones. And I even shared this one with my son. It was too overwhelming to hold on to alone. I thought he would finally call the rubber wagon for me, but he didn't. He even told me several times to email the family, but I just couldn't bring myself to. I didn't know how it would be taken. My son told me that I would regret it if it was found out that something in the dream may have mattered. He didn't have to tell me that - I did already know that. Well, when the family consulted a psychic, I thought that was my cue... and I sent a PM to Tiffany. And that is when I learned about Ron's dream. "Wow" was all I could say. This was just a few hours before the glasses were found. And right around the time my son got home that night, the glasses were found. And when he got home he said "you are not going to believe this..." and proceeded to tell me the story of the 3rd blue crystal dream. My son did not initiate this conversation. He didn't say "my mom had this dream..." It was the other boy (who my son hardly knew) that came up and started talking about "Mr. Greene." And then that boy revealed the dream. I feel that we all stayed quiet about it for long enough and it was meant to come out - despite what the nay sayers said. I suppose I would rather be mocked and made fun of and be found "wrong" then to hold in something of potential importance and find out I was "right."
I prefer to view "coincidence" (especially of this magnitude) as Divine Intervention...
I have to believe that this will lead somewhere...
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