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i'm gumby dammit
Sport climber
da ow
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Aug 14, 2013 - 04:51pm PT
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sorry if i offended you, but the log is nowhere near 'ready to launch'. you could yard on it all you want it's not gonna budge at this point.
but back on topic, what is the reason for this topic? is there bolting going on recently somewhere or just someone throwing salt in old wounds? pretty much everywhere i go there is either pro or bolts, but rarely both. course i haven't been around long.
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Dr. Christ
Mountain climber
State of Mine
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Aug 14, 2013 - 04:59pm PT
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You didn't offend me. I only go to 90' about once every couple years. The snag seemed unstable to me and others when I was there about a month ago, with a big break about 1/4 of the way from the top. There were several families below, so I didn't test it... but I'm pretty sure I could send it with a little effort.
I think Wegi is just bored.
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Blizzard
Trad climber
South Lake Tahoe, CA
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Aug 14, 2013 - 05:02pm PT
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what is the boldest route in tahoe? which routes set the bar for bold?
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Lambone
Big Wall climber
Ashland, Or
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Aug 14, 2013 - 05:11pm PT
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Keep
Tahoe
Woo
who's with me?
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Brandon-
climber
The Granite State.
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Aug 14, 2013 - 05:12pm PT
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what is the boldest route in tahoe? which routes set the bar for bold?
Anything at Luther Spires.
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Ksolem
Trad climber
Monrovia, California
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Aug 14, 2013 - 05:36pm PT
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The Gunks has had established rappel routes for the last 10 or 15 years that usually go right through good climbs. The walk off trails on the ridge are now overgrown in a lot of places. I hate this.
I totally agree. I learned to climb at The Gunks, and the walk off was always beautiful. It never occurred to us to rap. I mean, why would someone want to do a thing like that?
A few years ago I was back climbing with Williams, Holtkamp and Yoho (boy was that an interesting posse,) and there were all these rap routes. There were people dangling all over the place.
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i'm gumby dammit
Sport climber
da ow
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Aug 14, 2013 - 05:43pm PT
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what is the boldest route in tahoe? which routes set the bar for bold? the unnamed bolted chimney at eagle lake. some of the bolts are almost 5' apart.
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Laine
Trad climber
Reno, NV
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Aug 14, 2013 - 05:44pm PT
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What does every climb have to be bold?
Why the assumption that Tahoe was bold to begin with?
I think there are/were a lot of bold climbers who climb in Tahoe, but a lot of Tahoe's rock has great cracks and a lot of the trad routes are not bold, but moderate and well-protectable. Similarly sport areas like Big Chief have well-protected clip-up routes that have been around quite a while. Like most areas I've ever been to, there are some bold climbs and a lot of less-than-bold routes. You pick your poison.
This idea seems a very elitist and unrealistic view of the area, imo.
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Laine
Trad climber
Reno, NV
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Aug 14, 2013 - 06:19pm PT
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You've further my point, Ron. Jay Smith and others have put up many bold routes in more areas than just Tahoe. Their perception of what a route should be shaped the climb, not the rock itself. They also didn't put up routes in specific walls in these areas because it didn't live up to their level of what they wanted to climb. Yet others did - and now Tahoe has a variety of routes, both well-protected by any standards as well as heady test-pieces.
I still fail to see the logic.
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Ksolem
Trad climber
Monrovia, California
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Aug 14, 2013 - 06:31pm PT
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Bolt anchors are more impact than trails from the top back down to the base?
That, like most things to do with climbing is entirely situational. There are plenty of areas where walk-offs cause all sorts of problems like erosion, rockfall, damage to delicate plants and intrusion on wildlife to name a few. There are other areas, and I would include The Gunks, where the walk-offs are beautiful and pose no such problems. Unless eating handfuls of wild blueberries on the way down is damaging to the environment.
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Dr. Christ
Mountain climber
State of Mine
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Aug 14, 2013 - 06:37pm PT
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^ says a guy who no longer climbs
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i'm gumby dammit
Sport climber
da ow
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Aug 14, 2013 - 06:42pm PT
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at shakespeare rock, some are bold (not really yet though)
and others are bowld
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Brandon-
climber
The Granite State.
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Aug 14, 2013 - 07:04pm PT
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Weedge was just trolling anyway.
But, yeah, I've never climbed at Shakespeare rock. I'm not a fan of choss. I'm sure the FA's were bold endeavors, that pile looks like it would fall over if you sneezed on it.
Bold is new highball problems with no one else watching, a long way from the road.
Bold is soloing something you've never seen before. Again, with no one else watching, a long way from the road.
Boldness manifests itself in many ways.
Tahoe climbing is bold, some people just choose not to spray.
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i'm gumby dammit
Sport climber
da ow
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Aug 14, 2013 - 07:09pm PT
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There is some good rock there amongst the choss
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Laine
Trad climber
Reno, NV
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Aug 14, 2013 - 07:20pm PT
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I think we should strive to Keep Tahoe Classic, by preserving our gems in their natural state (or unnatural state - whatever the case maybe) and continuing the develop new routes that meet the level of awesomeness already established. The old and bold should be left as is because there is so much potential for new iconic lines. And while not every cliff needs to be climbed, expanding the area's ecosystem services like climbing is good for us all.
But I think bolts and bold can live in that world.
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PSP also PP
Trad climber
Berkeley
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Aug 14, 2013 - 07:45pm PT
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chop every other bolt on alot of sport routes will be a good start to keeping tahoe bold.
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mouse from merced
Trad climber
The finger of fate, my friends, is fickle.
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Aug 14, 2013 - 08:09pm PT
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And it's hi ho hey, I am a bold marauder
And it's hi ho hey, I am the white destroyer
For I will show you silver and gold, and I will bring you treasure
I will wave a widowing flag, and I will be your lover
And I will show you grotto and cave and sacrificial alter
And I will show you blood on the stone and I will be your mentor
And night will be our darling and fear will be our name
--Words of Richard Farina
And I will place no more bolts on your bumps
And I will laugh at the results this may have
If anyone chooses to listen
--Words of guess who
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Salamanizer
Trad climber
The land of Fruits & Nuts!
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Aug 14, 2013 - 09:53pm PT
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KEEP TAHOE FREE OF BURNTHEMAN AND HIS TOP DOWN GRID BOLTING NEXT TO CRACKS POSER FRIENDS.
If you're going to baselessly talk sh#t, at least have the balls to back it up with your real identity. I'll be in Tahoe on Saturday, we can discuss this face to face if you'd like...
Back on to topic:
Keep Tahoe Bold isn't some argument for bolt chopping and endless debates about ethics etc...
Laine nailed it down the best. It's about preserving the classic routes and the unique character of each climbing area while at the same time striving to meet the highest standards for new route in each area.
That may be awesome well protected and well thought out bolt protected sport climbing areas free of chipping, glueing and squeeze jobs, or balls out zero fixed gear, R/X routes protected only by ones own faith in ability with gnarly bush whacking epic fest walk offs. Each area is unique, every route it's own entity.
Keeping Tahoe Bold is about preserving the awesomeness of Tahoe, and really the whole of climbing by respecting local standards, choosing routes based on aesthetics and not just because it can be climbed, preserving those aesthetics by not grid bolting, retro-bolting or excessive cleaning etc... Realizing that each situation is unique and we should consciously stop and think objectively, even critically of our own decisions and motivations before we choose to take any action.
There is enough room for everyone and routes that represent their individual vision so long as we care to look beyond ourselves.
So keep it Big, keep it Bold, keep it Aesthetic and keep it Badass!
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AP
Trad climber
Calgary
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Aug 14, 2013 - 11:05pm PT
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How long is the 90' wall? It looks very scenic up there. Kind of like Skaha but maybe nicer
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