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Ghost
climber
A long way from where I started
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May 11, 2012 - 12:26am PT
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Ed Hartouni
Trad climber
Livermore, CA
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May 11, 2012 - 01:10am PT
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from Wikipedia:
The historical existence of Sodom and Gomorrah is still in dispute by archaeologists, as little archaeological evidence has ever been found in the regions where they were supposedly situated.
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Ben Emery
Trad climber
Australia via Bay Area via Australia...
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May 11, 2012 - 09:19am PT
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^^^
Surely that just goes to show that when God smites you, you stay good 'n' smited? None of this Smite-Lite business... ;-)
And now I'm off to repent for bumping this nonsense to the top of the page again.
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Klimmer
Mountain climber
San Diego
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Topic Author's Reply - May 11, 2012 - 09:41am PT
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I too think the destruction of Sodom and Gomorrah was accomplished by an Asteroid impact from the account in the OT. GOD seems to make use of these very natural accurances just when he needs to, for his purposes. Revelations talks of another one headed our way eventually, "Wormwood."
Mankind better shape-up and we must do better than we are . . .
Researchers: Asteroid Destroyed Sodom and Gomorrah
Written By Lewis Smith
Published April, 2008
London Times
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,343674,00.html
Tale of devastation
"Then the Lord rained on Sodom and Gomorrah brimstone and fire from the Lord out of Heaven; and he overthrew those cities and all the valley, and all the inhabitants of the cities ... [Abraham] looked down toward Sodom and Gomorrah and toward all the land of the valley, and beheld, and lo, the smoke of the land went up like the smoke of a furnace."
Source: Genesis 19:24-28
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kc
Trad climber
the cats
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May 11, 2012 - 09:46am PT
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No offense intended here, because I firmly believe that everyone is entitled to their own opinion. Maybe everyone isn't entitled to try to change other people's opinions, but still....
For me, faith/God resides in me. I am suspect of any document (including the Bible) that 'man' has put forth. I don't need anything that man has originated to guide me in this world. If I really listen to what goes on in me/myself, that's all the 'religion' I need.
Perhaps an oversimplification, but that's it in a nutshell for me.
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paganmonkeyboy
climber
mars...it's near nevada...
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May 11, 2012 - 09:50am PT
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and this all ties into my paranoid feeling that swing states will go Mitt mysteriously and this will be blamed on gay marriage instead of election fraud HOW ????
focus, people. they are stealing EVERYTHING in front of you and we are arguing religion...the plan works perfectly, no ?
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survival
Big Wall climber
Terrapin Station
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May 11, 2012 - 09:59am PT
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S&G WAS NOT destroyed by an asteroid.
It was destroyed by a beam from a righteous alien race whose ship crashed on the moon after striking the fatal blow.
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Karl Baba
Trad climber
Yosemite, Ca
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May 11, 2012 - 10:43am PT
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Let's suppose that being gay is not right with God Klimmer. So what? Lots of supposedly "not right with God" stuff is legal. It wouldn't be very virtuous to avoid sin if sin was just illegal and repressed.
and Jesus himself hung out with sinners right? The the very upright temple types.
We're not talking about enforcing Gay Church Marraige, so render unto Caesar and give rights to all. Jesus was a lot more about treating people with Love and understanding, than being strict about the law.
Peace
Karl
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Klimmer
Mountain climber
San Diego
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Topic Author's Reply - May 11, 2012 - 11:48am PT
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May 11, 2012 - 06:56am PT
a new wave Gay church in Reno had declared homophobia a SIN.....Glad to see they are just as f*cked up as all the others.
Sign of the times. Evil is good, and good is evil.
Jesus said concerning the last days, "As in the days of Noah, so shall it be in the coming of the Son of Man (Jesus's return)." (paraphased - I'll look up the actual quote later)
If you want to know how bad it was in the day's of Noah, read Genesis and The Book of Enoch. Pretty wicked. Then the flood came and cleansed the Earth.
GOD won't be made a fool. Sin brings destruction. As The Good Book says, "Sin is a pleasure for a short season." GOD can only tolerate it for so long. When it gets very prevalent and no one stands up for GOD and his righteousness and his Laws, judgement comes.
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Klimmer
Mountain climber
San Diego
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Topic Author's Reply - May 11, 2012 - 11:49am PT
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May 11, 2012 - 06:59am PT
S&G WAS NOT destroyed by an asteroid.
It was destroyed by a beam from a righteous alien race whose ship crashed on the moon after striking the fatal blow.
That actually was really funny. Lol.
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Klimmer
Mountain climber
San Diego
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Topic Author's Reply - May 11, 2012 - 11:52am PT
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May 11, 2012 - 07:43am PT
Let's suppose that being gay is not right with God Klimmer. So what? Lots of supposedly "not right with God" stuff is legal. It wouldn't be very virtuous to avoid sin if sin was just illegal and repressed.
and Jesus himself hung out with sinners right? The the very upright temple types.
We're not talking about enforcing Gay Church Marraige, so render unto Caesar and give rights to all. Jesus was a lot more about treating people with Love and understanding, than being strict about the law.
Peace
Karl
Karl,
I will get back. Requires very involved answers. Busy today.
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Karl Baba
Trad climber
Yosemite, Ca
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May 11, 2012 - 01:57pm PT
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let's not forget the Biblical version of marriage is between one man and any number of women. Soloman, supposedly a wise guy, had 700 wives and 300 concubines
It doesn't seem Jesus was married, which was very unusual for those time when there wasn't a tradition of celibate rabbis. He easily could have been persecuted for seeming Gay (no wife) Another reason to err on the side of compassion
Peace
Karl
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lostinshanghai
Social climber
someplace
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May 11, 2012 - 03:30pm PT
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Another theory is Jesus was not dead when he was placed in the tomb, has happened to a few people where they have been declared dead then two, three days later came back to life. Slow heartbeat. Easy to wake up then push the stone aside and walk away.
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climbski2
Mountain climber
Anchorage AK, Reno NV
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May 11, 2012 - 03:34pm PT
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Have you ever met a live person who stopped sinning?
So my guess is there is only one person in the kingdom of heaven or lots of sinners.
That is assuming it exists. Which I do choose to believe personally.
As a christian I just try to do better and not pretend I am not a sinner or that my sins are any better than others.
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apogee
climber
Technically expert, safe belayer, can lead if easy
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May 11, 2012 - 03:42pm PT
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"a new wave Gay church in Reno had declared homophobia a SIN"
Oh, I'm sure there's a whole lot more to that than Ron's hyperbolic, oversimplified post, but...
The approach sure is novel...and consistent with core Christian values, methinks...
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John Moosie
climber
Beautiful California
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May 11, 2012 - 03:47pm PT
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I took some heat for saying this before, but I will say it again. I believe that homosexuality is a choice, unlike the color of your skin or your sex. The reason it doesn't feel like a choice to many is because that choice was made in a previous lifetime. One of the biggest problems we have today is not understanding that we have karma from previous lifetimes.
As for making it illegal. I think that it is good for people as a whole to state the things that they are against. Murder is an obvious example. Gay marriage is somewhat less obvious.
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rectorsquid
climber
Lake Tahoe
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May 11, 2012 - 03:51pm PT
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Except, are we on a slippery slope? Polygamy? Gay polygamy? Inter species marriage?
No. The debate is about letting some people have a political and financial benefit from a government plan while not letting others have that same benefit.
The government will let all people, black, white, young, old, male, female, form a contract that involves benefits from the government in all cases except where the two people are of the same sex. It is only a matter of discrimination.
Since the government does not support marriage with animals for anyone, no one is being discriminated against. The same goes for polygamy or any other alternate form of marriage where no one is given more or less benefit from the government than any other.
All people should be treated equally by the government regardless of race, sex, or sexual orientation.
So no, there is no slippery slope.
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Binks
climber
Uranus
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May 11, 2012 - 04:02pm PT
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I don't believe in Christianity, Islam, or any religion. I think they are all fabricated social constructs.
I'm getting more annoyed the older I get when religious people claim they speak for God or they have God's word. I believe this is utter and complete nonsense.
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John Moosie
climber
Beautiful California
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May 11, 2012 - 04:05pm PT
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I'm getting more annoyed the older I get when religious people claim they speak for God or they have God's word. I believe this is utter and complete nonsense.
A lot of people feel that way. Out of my own curiosity, do you believe in any form of God? If so, do you think that God communicates at all with humans?
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rectorsquid
climber
Lake Tahoe
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May 11, 2012 - 04:09pm PT
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As for making it illegal. I think that it is good for people as a whole to state the things that they are against. Murder is an obvious example. Gay marriage is somewhat less obvious.
The fact that there is a debate on this clearly shows that the people as a whole have not yet decided how this will work out. If it does turn out that discrimination based on sexual orientation is acceptable then that is a slippery slope that will result in many more people being discriminated against well into the future and based on religious teachings.
That will suck for everyone except for the moral majority.
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