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Ed Hartouni
Trad climber
Livermore, CA
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Topic Author's Original Post - Aug 31, 2008 - 12:44am PT
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I was reading the introduction to Pat Ament's History of Free Climbing in America and of course we learn that Tom Frost contributed photographs for that book.
Tom's photographs nearly define a period of climbing, some are so iconic that we forgot that he took them. You can see some of these on his website
http://frostworksclimbing.com/photogallery.html
I don't believe that there has ever been a book of Tom's photographs published. Am I wrong? and if I'm not wrong, why hasn't there been? It would be a wonderful treasure.
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Captain...or Skully
Big Wall climber
up Yonder (someplace else)
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Aug 31, 2008 - 12:56am PT
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Ask him......
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Ed Hartouni
Trad climber
Livermore, CA
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Topic Author's Reply - Aug 31, 2008 - 01:08am PT
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next time I see him I will, but I wasn't sure if a book hadn't been published, and there are many of you who would know if one had been...
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Captain...or Skully
Big Wall climber
up Yonder (someplace else)
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Aug 31, 2008 - 01:12am PT
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I bet he's got some great shots.......
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Ed Hartouni
Trad climber
Livermore, CA
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Topic Author's Reply - Aug 31, 2008 - 02:01am PT
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Tami, yes I believe you're correct, however Patagonia did publish Denny's photos, perhaps they might take on yet another project?
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Bullwinkle
Boulder climber
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Aug 31, 2008 - 02:32am PT
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Tom is working on a Book of his photographs currently, it should be out in a year or so. On the subject of Climbing Photo Books, John L and myself are close to the design phase of our StoneMasters tome. There is a market for these books, you need to selfpublish, not depend on publishers with no vision. DF
that's what I did with StoneNudes, to bad you can't see the art tami
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originalpmac
Trad climber
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Aug 31, 2008 - 08:25am PT
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can't wait to see those books. Seeing those Frost photos almost made me cry about the fact it is raining in the Sandias.
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Prod
Social climber
Charlevoix, MI
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Aug 31, 2008 - 09:19am PT
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Thanks for the link and info. Those are some great pics, can't wait for a book.
Prod.
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Steve Grossman
Trad climber
Seattle, WA
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Aug 31, 2008 - 11:46am PT
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I am in the process of writing Tom's book currently. The only place that his photos have been reproduced in large format as a collection is the Stanford Alpine Club history written by John Rawlings and Glen Denny, 1999.
I have seen Tom's entire body of work and it is second to none. As Glen once noted, he is a photographer's photographer and always gets the shot!
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Ed Hartouni
Trad climber
Livermore, CA
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Topic Author's Reply - Aug 31, 2008 - 01:05pm PT
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Great news, I will certainly get a copy once it is published!
And the news about the Stonemasters book is good too.
Bullwinkle - I didn't necessarily interpret Tami's comments as missing the art of Stone Nudes, it was more about selling them in stores where the majority of customers are young men. Now you might hypothesize that young men have a more developed sense of art than the larger population... I've thought a lot about "figures" in photography. Figures in painting were studies of the human body, posed, clothed, etc, that might fit into a larger scene. Practicing drawing the human figure was an important antecedent to producing a larger piece of art. Of course it eventually came to pass that figure drawing, and painting, became a genre unto itself.
In victorian photography it was not uncommon to assemble a scene from a number of negatives, I'm thinking of Oscar G. Rejlander's oft quoted work The Two Ways of Life from 1857... where individual figures were shot and then incorporated in the final work.
While the form of the human figure is a subject of art, one wonders how well Stone Nudes would do at the climbing stores if it was a mix of male and female figures, or even entirely male figures. I believe that independent of the sex of the models, you would produce an artistic collection of images.
I take Tami's point as a statement of the fate of the sales of such a collection at the climbing stores.
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Bullwinkle
Boulder climber
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Aug 31, 2008 - 01:37pm PT
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Ed
Most of the people that buy my Calendars are women purchasing the work for their boyfriends. Seems that they do in fact see the Art and would rather their partners look at something real, guys on the other hand see what they want to see.
I made one Calendar with only men/2002 and I sold almost none even though it was some of the best work I've done. My partner/muse Liz worked her (very small) butt off trying to get our Art into Climbing shops. She lost alot of money supporting myself and this project.
The current US magazines refuse to print my work, in Europe I'm becoming the new Jerry Lewis, they seem to love StoneNudes. Guess what? the next Calendar 2010 will be all photographed there. Given the current Nazi State of things and the falling dollar this is one of the few good ideas I've ever had.
Ed I'm not so much taking offence at Tami's coments as saying, if you want to make Climbing Art, just do it and sell it directly to those who seek it. Don't depend on short-sighted publishers and nay sayers to feed you. . .it won't happen. . .DF
Tami, my bad, sorry. . .alway thought your work rocked. . .
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Mighty Hiker
Social climber
Vancouver, B.C.
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Aug 31, 2008 - 02:52pm PT
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Dean's business model makes a lot of sense for this kind of publication, especially if it can be tied to "on demand" printing. Unless, of course, someone (e.g. Patagonia) is willing to subsidize it directly or through promotion. The book that Majka Burkhardt and Gabe Rogel did on climbing and development in Ethiopia ("Vertical Ethiopia") is being sold in much the same way, though possibly someone has a basement full of boxes of books. (www.verticalethiopia.com - not sure why it's a .com instead of a .org)
I usually end up buying a copy of these sorts of books, if only because I have a climber-brother who sometimes needs gifts. I'm not such a good consumer myself, in general, but do at least read them.
Will the books of Frost's photos include photos from others of the period, that is will it be stories illustrated by photos, mostly but not entirely by Tom, or will it be simply an art/photo book, with only Tom's photos? I liked Ed Cooper's book quite a lot, given that it had stories and photos, but it might have been enhanced by inclusion of a few photos by others.
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Bullwinkle
Boulder climber
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Aug 31, 2008 - 03:29pm PT
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Anders
Yes its all about numbers, Patagonia sold out the first printing of GD's Book a run of 3000? or 5000 not sure on the count. The 2nd printing is not doing as well, perhaps small numbers are best in this market.
As to Tom, in our conversations he wanted to do things in his own way, this is what selfpublishing is all about. Tom Frost is the man when it comes to Climbing Art and when his and Steve's Book comes out, I'll take 12 please. . .oh and a few copies of Tami's too. DF
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Steve Grossman
Trad climber
Seattle, WA
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Several peoples work will be included in the biography. Such as Henry Kendall, the Nobel physicist who is largely responsible for introducing Tom to climbing as a junior at Stanford. From The Stanford Alpine Club by John Rawlings and Glen Denny, 1999.
Tom's first climb of record and one specifically chosen for the photograph by Henry.
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Mighty Hiker
climber
Vancouver, B.C.
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An old thread, but a good one.
There is an article in the new Rock & Ice (#188) about Tom Frost and his photography, by Cory Rich. Including many photos of Frost's not previously published, and the story behind the photos. Well worth a look.
Frost's story is that they were preparing for the second ascent of the Nose, in 1960, when Bill "Furror" (Feuerer) stopped by and handed his Leica to Tom, saying "You'll want it." So the photo of Pratt and Robbins with the gear was the first photograph that Frost ever took.
Nothing on the R&I website yet, though.
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klk
Trad climber
cali
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missed this thread. glad to see that tom frost's work will get its own book format.
tami is exactly right on the economics of publishing, especially in the outdoor industry. most climbers in the us don't read, and the few who do, buy almost no new books.
high quality, large-format books, have to be subsidized, unless they are either arty porn (like most taschen books) or a big brand like ansel adams.
when i was shopping publishers, one of the decisions i had to make was whether to go with the publisher that i thought would do the best job of design or the one that could actually get the damn thing into stores and overseas markets?
guess which one i chose? if your book doesn't get marketed and distributed, no one will ever see the great design.
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steelmnkey
climber
Vision man...ya gotta have vision...
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The beauty of today's online community is that you can self-publish about anything you want. Distribution is facilitated online as well, so if you have a vision, make it happen!
I recently produced a hard cover coffee-table (10"x13") book for my wife's 50th birthday. It has 208 pages, all photos of her climbing in various areas with a list in the back of all the routes we've ever done together. It turned out great and I think she was pretty happy with it.
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H
Mountain climber
there and back again
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Aug 14, 2010 - 12:28am PT
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Ed there has been rumors for years of Tom publishing his prints in a book. I talked to him recently about this and he as much as told me that its so much work that he really is not interested. I felt the topic of conversation was a little vailed so who knows.
He is a master photographer and his shots have graced many a magazine and book for centuries. I for one would love to see them compiled into one bound volume. Tom has done so much for the climbing world but because of who he is its not really known outside of the well informed.
Thanks for bringing up the topic. If anyone has sway over the outcome of such a venture I hope they step up to the plate.
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