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Hawkeye
climber
State of Mine
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Topic Author's Original Post - Oct 25, 2007 - 03:12pm PT
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dont know why but yesterdays thread was deleted.
i am still surprised that jenny (=jody???< #$%#&???) would suggest that the dude was not doing something wrong.
this should provide you with some more facts from the i-da-hoe statesman site:
Let's break down each clue in this crapper caper. The evidence is so overwhelming that only a mind-controlled zombie would question it:
 Trotting 1/4 mile with a bladder full of "3 or 4 coffees" - past 3 other restrooms before choosing the renowned anonymous sex bathroom. (Amazing bladder control for an old guy)
Waiting outside the young police officer's stall for 2 minutes, PEERING THROUGH THE CRACK, while other stalls were empty. (Creepy!)
Two MORE minutes of bladder control? I thought he was going number 1, not number 2??
Sliding his briefcase (and satchel?) to the front of the stall to make room for footsie play.
Tapping his RIGHT FOOT, a well known signal IN THAT BATHROOM for soliciting anonymous public sex (which is ILLEGAL folks).
Sliding his foot UNDER the stall wall. (More creepy!)
Sliding his foot under the stall and TOUCHING the young man's foot. (Super Creepy!)
Putting his LEFT HAND under the stall wall showing his wedding ring, an important secret code IN THAT BATHROOM for soliciting anonymous sex - if you have the stomach for gay porn you can verify this online.
Stroking the filthy underside of the stall wall in a suggestive manner, which is another of the many signals. (Okay, I'm ready to call a cop or punch this guy's lights out now!)
Shrieking "No!" when the young officer presented his badge - wouldn't most INNOCENT people be confused and say, "whaaa?".
No pooh, no flush - what was he doing?
Presenting his Senatorial Card in a threatening manner, proclaiming "What do you think of that?".
Claiming Entrapment before he was told of the charges (listen to the audio). Entrapment to what? How would he know if he doesn't practice anonymous sex?
The cover-up, keeping the whole thing secret for months.
Copping the plea. What part of "Pleading Guilty" do you not understand? Denying it now is way sillier than Clinton's mincing about oral sex.
Saying he was going to resign.
Lies.
Then flip flopping and saying he would resign if he didn't get the plea dismissed at the end of September.
More Lies.
Flip flopping again at the end of September and arrogantly stating "I will not resign".
Phone recording emerges in which Craig coyly discusses to use the word "INTENT" in his resignation speech.
Lying Liar.
Twisting all of the documented facts in a well scripted TV interview and attempting to besmirch an honorable young police officer with a full career ahead of him. Is this how US Senators HONOR our brave law officers?
Contradicts himself in interview: "I took the easy way out...by pleading guilty", then says "I never take the easy way out..." regarding his resignation fight.
Stay tuned. His "INTENT" not to run for reelection might change.
this was posted from a reader who read through the plice report. i didnt have the stomach for that.
http://www.idahostatesman.com/larrycraig/story/191790.html
do you know how your campaign $ are being spent?
oh, yes. i think this behavious goes into the heading, "what women DO NOT want." in case you were wondering...
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Karl Baba
Trad climber
Yosemite, Ca
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Oct 25, 2007 - 03:46pm PT
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"oh, yes. i think this behaviour goes into the heading... "
Well Duh.....
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John Moosie
climber
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Oct 25, 2007 - 03:49pm PT
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" Is heterosexual sex in public places also illegal?"
Yes.
Would you want your children to watch people having sex in the park or on the beach?
..................................
Mommy, Why is that man putting his pee pee in that womans mouth?
Later.......... to his little friend.
Hey, guess what I saw at the park today? I saw a man ...........
Mommy says thats what big people do to have fun.
Lets pretend we are big people.
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Jennie
Trad climber
Idaho Falls
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Oct 25, 2007 - 03:51pm PT
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"i am still surprised that jenny (=jody???< #$%#&???) would suggest that the dude was not doing something wrong."
Check my posts, Hawkeye. I did not post that Craig did nothing wrong. I said the case was WEAK, which it is. (Ask your lawyer)
I posted about police politics in homosexual entrapment. If your brother or a friend was arrested for solicitation and the cops offered him a lesser charge to get 500 dollars in police coffers and not obligate them to testify in court and risk perjury, would you question the operation? But yes, Craig IS a pompous, self righteous Republican so lets not question the little man wearing the funky "Bag the fag" T shirt who arrested him. He HAS to be guilty!
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Gary
climber
Desolation Basin, Calif.
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Oct 25, 2007 - 03:53pm PT
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why is having anonymous sex in the men's room illegal.
Because pols like Larry Craig made it illegal!
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Karl Baba
Trad climber
Yosemite, Ca
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Oct 25, 2007 - 03:59pm PT
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From that linked interview
""I want this issue put to bed..."
"Craig was unflinching, answering with "Hell, no!" and "Never!" and "You're damn right he misread it!" and "It's a bunch of false crap!" Said Craig, "There's a very clear bottom line here (he,he) Dan. I don't do that kind of thing. I am not gay, and I never have been."
Sorry for the high school pun fun. Sorry that Craig makes bi's and gays look bad just like Falwell and Baker made straights look bad.
"While in this state of intense anxiety, Senator Craig felt compelled to grasp the lifeline offered to him by the police officer; namely, that if he were to submit to an interview and plead guilty, then none of the officer's allegations would be made public.""
And he's in the government? Never tell the man nothin' Lying isn't considered lying with it's a cop lying to you. That's just the way business is done.
Peace
Karl
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Jennie
Trad climber
Idaho Falls
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Oct 25, 2007 - 04:09pm PT
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"Are you suggesting that a cop might arrest a U.S. Senator for soliciting anonymous sex so he could raise a bit of cash for the department?"
Yes, I think it's a possibility. I don't know how many arrests a undercover cop might make in a day, but with $500 fines (each) for pleading guilty to public nuisance, it could be somewhat lucrative by working class standards.
And by persuading an "offender" to plead guilty to the lesser charge, the police get out of testifying in court. (possible perjury implications)
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Hawkeye
climber
State of Mine
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Topic Author's Reply - Oct 25, 2007 - 04:12pm PT
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so jennie,
if you were in a coed public restroom and someone tapped your foot and reached under the stall to wave at you i guess that would be normal behaviour?
leb, you must be trolling about your question as to why sex in public places is outlawed? i am no prude and i dont care what kind of kicks someone gets but i would prefer not to have my kids watch. and now i am being a hypocrite as i have broke that law but i tried to keep it low key....
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Hawkeye
climber
State of Mine
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Topic Author's Reply - Oct 25, 2007 - 04:21pm PT
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for you jennie
Sliding his briefcase (and satchel?) to the front of the stall to make room for footsie play.
Tapping his RIGHT FOOT, a well known signal IN THAT BATHROOM for soliciting anonymous public sex (which is ILLEGAL folks).
Sliding his foot UNDER the stall wall. (More creepy!)
Sliding his foot under the stall and TOUCHING the young man's foot. (Super Creepy!)
Putting his LEFT HAND under the stall wall showing his wedding ring, an important secret code IN THAT BATHROOM for soliciting anonymous sex - if you have the stomach for gay porn you can verify this online.
Stroking the filthy underside of the stall wall in a suggestive manner, which is another of the many signals. (Okay, I'm ready to call a cop or punch this guy's lights out now!)
Shrieking "No!" when the young officer presented his badge - wouldn't most INNOCENT people be confused and say, "whaaa?".
No pooh, no flush - what was he doing?
Presenting his Senatorial Card in a threatening manner, proclaiming "What do you think of that?".
Claiming Entrapment before he was told of the charges (listen to the audio). Entrapment to what? How would he know if he doesn't practice anonymous sex?
BTW jennie. i doubt that your neighborhood bishopric woul like to see this activity in their church....
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Jennie
Trad climber
Idaho Falls
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Oct 25, 2007 - 04:37pm PT
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"so jennie,
if you were in a coed public restroom and someone tapped your foot and reached under the stall to wave at you i guess that would be normal behaviour?"
Actually, no, it wouldn't be normal.
Let me salute you for being alongside the undercover cop in his stall to verify for us what Senator Craig was doing, Mr Hawkeye. That's genuine solidarity with law enforcement operations. Perhaps you could demonstrate the gestures the Senator used, for us, at the next Sushi Fest. Be sure to tell us exactly what each nuance means, so there's no confusion.
Without you there it would just be the cops word (and interpretation) against the evil Senator Craig's. Perhaps you could publish a key to "stall signals" so when I travel to Europe next summer, and have to endure the unisex bathrooms, I'll know if the "waving hand" is giving me a Chamonix snow advisory or suggesting a warm front.
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Forest
Trad climber
Tucson, AZ
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Oct 25, 2007 - 04:41pm PT
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C'mon, folks. Jennie's point is that it's the cop's word against Larry Craig's. Which is certainly true.
Tho I would say that if it was BS, then Craig was nuts to plead guilty. The fact that he did (keep in mind this guy could afford the best lawyer in the world) says to me that something was up.
So he's either a total moron or it's true. Either way, it's satisfying to see someone who's made a career out of making gays feel less welcome in our society in a tight spot.
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Hawkeye
climber
State of Mine
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Topic Author's Reply - Oct 25, 2007 - 04:49pm PT
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jenny, believe what you want.
i find it hard to believe that a cop would arrest some guy for taking a dump. but hey, who knows.
seems kind of strange how there are other factors in the guys record as well, but perhaps you dont believe those either.
watch AC's last vid post.
read the papers.
i suppose that if you had boys you wouldnt mind having them take a dump next to mr craig's stall....
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Gary
climber
Desolation Basin, Calif.
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Oct 25, 2007 - 04:58pm PT
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Jennie, could a police officer lie in court under oath?
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Jennie
Trad climber
Idaho Falls
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Oct 25, 2007 - 05:03pm PT
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Once again, I'm not claiming Craig is innocent of attempting to solicit gay sex. I wasn't there, and can't form an opinion on personal observation. I'm suggesting the conditions and evidences given by the police are weak by legal standards.
If you were a prosecutor or police chief and knew you had a strong case, would you let him off with a public nuisance guilty plea? If you thought your boy could possibly get hit with perjury would you go for the down plea and the $500 fine?
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Forest
Trad climber
Tucson, AZ
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Oct 25, 2007 - 05:06pm PT
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Actually, I have to disagree about the perjury thing. As it's just the cop's word against the scumbag's (basing that on his political views, nothing else) it would also be a very very weak perjury case.
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Matt
Trad climber
primordial soup
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Oct 25, 2007 - 05:31pm PT
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jennie/judy-
you seem to assume that the most serious convictions possible are the goal of the police department. they are/were running the stings in that bathroom as a result of the public's complaints about gay sex goin on there, it seems like their goal would be for whatever group frequents that bathroom to get the idea that it's no longer a safe place to operate. i'd imagine that minor convictions and fines would be enough to get the word out.
why doesn't geraldo rivera get the senator from idaho and the cop from minnesota together on the same show and have them take simultaneous lie dector tests? why doesn't the guy offer up to go on good morning america and do just that? one simple reason comes to mind, he simply likes the taste of annonymous c--k in his mouth, and despite what people say in public, everyone in the world knows it.
if the NSA can listen to every phone call in the USA, i cannot believe that a straight man cannot PROVE he is straight, if he really wants to do so. what's more, if this were a democrat instead of a republican, all you republicans and hannity/rush/orieley would all be calling publicly for just that.
the only reason that the left doesn't push harder on this is because we are not the mean and cruel people that so many on the right are, and yes, we actually have empathy for the plight of a closeted gay man who has to seek his sexual satisfaction in some filthy airport bathroom and who has built his entire life around the lies that he is too ashamed to admit, even if that gay man is in part responsible for his own plight, and that of so many like him who are unable or unwilling to be honest about their own sexuality.
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Hawkeye
climber
State of Mine
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Topic Author's Reply - Oct 25, 2007 - 05:52pm PT
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its also really hard to prove that Craig was soliciting sex in the bathroom.
he may have just needed an extra squeeze to make things happen.
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Jennie
Trad climber
Idaho Falls
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Oct 25, 2007 - 06:30pm PT
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"you seem to assume that the most serious convictions possible are the goal of the police department. they are/were running the stings in that bathroom as a result of the public's complaints about gay sex goin on there,"
Matt,
Part of the issue is that the police never provided documentation of bona-fide public complaints concerning these airport bathrooms. Were the police undercover operations prompted by genuine public concern or police department efforts to gain political favor by catching undesirables, namely homosexuals?? ( whom the public despise.) There was apparently no effort by Minneapolis-St Paul police to catch heterosexuals engaging in public sex in public bathrooms, public parks etc.
"why doesn't geraldo rivera get the senator from idaho and the cop from minnesota together on the same show and have them take simultaneous lie dector tests?"
Probably because he (Geraldo) is too busy demonizing Howard K Stern. Fox News knows the public is more cognizant of the Anna Nicole Smith drama. Pinning two murders on Stern is a bigger coup for Fox than sanitizing Larry Craig.
"if the NSA can listen to every phone call in the USA, i cannot believe that a straight man cannot PROVE he is straight, if he really wants to do so. what's more, if this were a democrat instead of a republican, all you republicans and hannity/rush/orieley would all be calling publicly for just that."
If Jody can't prove he's not Jennie, here, how would you suggest a straight man go about proving he's straight to the country?
Just for the record, I'm not Republican, nor was my family. My dad was a union officer who had a long running battle with Larry Craig, (and claimed to have only voted for one Repub in his entire life.)
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dirtbag
climber
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Oct 25, 2007 - 06:35pm PT
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Was Sen. Craig soliciting sex? YES.
Is soliciting an adult for consensual sex a crime? NO.
Had he yet done the deed with anyone in the stall? NO.
So where's the crime?
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