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Melissa
Gym climber
berkeley, ca
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Topic Author's Original Post - Jun 13, 2007 - 02:59pm PT
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...sorta not b/c climbing is getting expensive b/c of the gas.
The only sort of car that's in the budget right now is a really cheap one, so anything new or hybrid is not an option.
A look at the cars w/ best gas mileage puts the Honda Civic way up there w/ the hybrids. Old Civics are some of the cheapest and from what I've seen w/ friends are pretty reliable as old cars go too.
My question is...if I get an old civic will the old part negate the civic part and result in mileage that's not enough of a an improvement over the (much nicer) pick up to bother? Is there a rule of thumb for mileage degradation over time?
I won't have $$ to invest in an upgrade for old parts that function OK otherwise.
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Moof
Trad climber
A cube at my soul sucking job in Oregon
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Jun 13, 2007 - 03:09pm PT
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A frind of mine has been running a 4 door civic, maybe a 1990-1992 for a while. At ~170k miles the engine died (stripped out a sparkplug, repair shop found low compression on at least 3 cylinders). Up to the point of the engine death he was still getting ~32-34 mpg. He put in a used engine from a much newer honda (crated used japanese one) and only went up to about 35 mpg.
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Karl Baba
Trad climber
Yosemite, Ca
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Jun 13, 2007 - 03:19pm PT
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Old Civic Rule! A friend had a early 90s one that got fantastic mileage even near 200,000 miles. She bought a new Civic in the same style in 2003 and it got 10 miles less per gallon. It's a rocket though.
Sad that you can't buy a gutless car in this country anymore.
peace
Karl
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Moof
Trad climber
A cube at my soul sucking job in Oregon
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Jun 13, 2007 - 03:24pm PT
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Karl,
I've been told that part of the reason for the more recent drop in mpg's for civics is due to airbags. Reinforcement of the firewall and associated structure as added a fair amount of weight over the old civics that had no airbags. I don't know if it is the whole story, but I wouldn't blame increased zippyness entirely.
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fear
Ice climber
hartford, ct
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Jun 13, 2007 - 03:31pm PT
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No, the reason for the mpg drop in current Civics is they're HUGE. The new civic is as large, if not larger than the Accord just 10 years ago.
But anyway, mpg does not generally decrease with mileage. If anything a modern motor often has more HP and gets better mileage at 40k than it did when new. Unfortunately that trend does not continue forever....
A base used Corolla is always a good bet if decently maintained. Get one with under 100k and you're good to go.
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mojede
Trad climber
Butte, America
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Jun 13, 2007 - 03:38pm PT
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My two Honda experiences were both great. 84 CRX with 210k+ and got 45+mpg at 80mph with the air--and an 88 Accord 2dr. of the Realmojede. Roomier, but still got 35+ going 80 all day with AC--we gave it to my nephew with 207,000 miles on it.
Go for a car that has a short, or thorough history on it--a well loved car gets through "old age" much better than a neglected one.
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CAC
Gym climber
Clairemont
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Jun 13, 2007 - 03:42pm PT
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When I sold my Trooper in 2003, the only cars I looked at were Honda Civic hatchbacks because of the mileage and interior room. I ended up buying a 1996 Civic with 116K for $5,000. I've always got between 30 and 35 MPG, which is actually lower than the high 30s I expected, but the difference doesn't amount to much $$ in gas money. I love the Honda - slept in the back a few times when it was raining and windy at Josh, hauled many large home-improvement type items in the back (10' steel rain gutters, 8' christmas tree, etc). At 175K now, the transmission is slipping a little but I'm babying it so it will probably go a while longer.
Recommend the Civic, but get the hatchback. They're harder to find and a bit more expensive, but every time you don't have to try and stuff a bike or something in the sedan you'll be happy you have the hatch.
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caughtinside
Social climber
Davis, CA
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Jun 13, 2007 - 03:44pm PT
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If you're planning to get a high gas mileage beater for valley commutes and hang on to your truck, do you know what effect owning two cars will be on your insurance? (I don't, just curious.)
Also taxes (should be low) and smog (something like $80 every other year now?)
Just some things to consider. It seems to me like you would have to drive a lot, over a couple years, (on a high mileage vehicle) to have a second beater car make financial sense gas price wise.
If you're just switching cars, disregard!
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handsome B
Gym climber
SL,UT
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Jun 13, 2007 - 03:44pm PT
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I bought a used (32,00 miles) 2002 Honda Civic sedan about 2 years ago. Now I am pushing 90,000 miles and the thing is running like a champ! 42 miles per gallon makes me happy. Get one!
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Karl Baba
Trad climber
Yosemite, Ca
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Jun 13, 2007 - 03:55pm PT
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"I've been told that part of the reason for the more recent drop in mpg's for civics is due to airbags. Reinforcement of the firewall and associated structure as added a fair amount of weight over the old civics that had no airbags. I don't know if it is the whole story, but I wouldn't blame increased zippyness entirely."
I tend to blame in the difference between a 90 HP engine and a 160 Hp engine.
Melissa, you might look at the Honda Fit. Around $13000 new and gets 33/38
Peace
karl
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hobo_dan
Social climber
Minnesota
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Jun 13, 2007 - 04:08pm PT
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for reliable cheap transportation we go with toyota corollas- not as sexy as the honda but they run forever. If you can get a wagon do so. We get 31-33 mpg with our 92 and 35+ withour 95. They are a little under sprung (is that a word) so if you weight them down.........and the engines have no guts BUT if all you want is cheap and reliable there you go
My last gave up the ghost at 285k.
murf
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Rhodo-Router
Gym climber
Otto, NC
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Jun 13, 2007 - 04:21pm PT
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Adding a second car to insurance doesn't cost much at all, esp. if it's old. I guess they know you can't drive 2 cars at once.
We added the '81 toyota camper for, I dunno, $100 a year?
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Forest
Trad climber
Tucson, AZ
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Jun 13, 2007 - 04:26pm PT
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Not sure what your budget is, but a 98 - 02 VW jetta TDI (diesel) will get well 40 - 50 mpg and the engine will run forever (i.e. well above 300k miles.)
Older ones do well, too, I'm told.
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Phil_B
Social climber
Hercules, CA
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Jun 13, 2007 - 04:32pm PT
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I had an '89 Civic that I ran to 225K miles and still had the original clutch. I had to replace the head at one point because I neglected to replace the timing belt. That turned out to be a good thing because I got a lot better HP afterwards.
At the end, I was still getting close to 40 mpg. My new Toyota Matrix XRS doesn't even get 30 unless I drive way slower than I like. However, it always has enough power to do what I want, which is part of the reason I bought that model. It's nice being able to pass cars going up Tioga.
I would guess that with good maintenance, an older Toyota or Honda will be good for ya if ya treat it right.
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the Fet
Knackered climber
A bivy sack in the secret campground
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Jun 13, 2007 - 04:40pm PT
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Lot's of good advice above.
But, check the safety ratings for the years you are looking at. We were going to buy a civic about 7 years ago (I think a late 90s model) and it really felt like a tin can. We ended up with a BMW 318Ti, which does get good mileage (low 30s) has power and handling and it much more substantial, but was much more expensive for everything than the Honda. But who cares how much money you saved if you're dead. I don't think I'd go that route again (BMW), but maybe compare the civic to the accord or camry, you'll give up some mpg, but I think safety is more important.
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Melissa
Gym climber
berkeley, ca
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Topic Author's Reply - Jun 13, 2007 - 04:51pm PT
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Thanks for sharing all of your experiences. This is sort of a new idea since I took a job 50 miles away last week and J's machine failed to start yesterday.
The two truck thing never made a heap of sense (I bought mine about 2 weeks before I met him), but both of us are sort of attached to our sleep-in rigs.
Between the inconvenient truth of the badness of driving in general and the badness of driving on my bottom line, I at least wanted to consider the car option. I think I could reasonably sleep in the back of a civic hatchback.
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caughtinside
Social climber
Davis, CA
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Jun 13, 2007 - 04:53pm PT
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Good luck with the new job, Melissa!
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kellie
climber
Seattle
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Jun 13, 2007 - 04:59pm PT
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My '91 Toyota Tercel has about 215,000 miles on it and gets 33-35, occasionally a little better. It has to be fully loaded going over mountain passes in a headwind to get under 30. Before I put snow tires on it, it got high 30s.
I can't sleep in it, but I've only really wished I could two or three times in all the years I've had it.
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pro_alien
Sport climber
Zurich, Switzerland
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Jun 13, 2007 - 05:31pm PT
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Sleeping in the Civic might be a squeeze. It was pretty good on gas, of course.
I have done it in a Ford Focus ZX3 hatchback. Get a star drive bit to take off the bench, then the rear cushions will fold down flat.
Not a bad car once all the recalls are taken care off (grumble grumble). Gas mileage is still reasonable, and used prices might be lower than on Civics.
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slabhappy
Trad climber
North Carolina
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Jun 13, 2007 - 05:46pm PT
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I had a 94 Accord LX coupe. Gave it to my brother when it had 274,000 miles on it. It now has 301,000 miles on it. Oil changes, tune ups and general maintenance. If you want something to last, you gotta take care of it.
Sometimes I wish he would give it back to me.
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