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Matt's
climber
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Topic Author's Original Post - Nov 9, 2015 - 04:33pm PT
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given the sloan fiasco, here is some pretty relevant comments from Mikey Schaefer on the state of El cap...
https://instagram.com/p/9yreHKrY66/?taken-by=mikeylikesrocks
"I've hung out underneath this trees many times in my life and it always brings me happiness. But this time I was actually a bit sad. Underneath this amazing tree was some trash. And then underneath the boulders just a few meters away there was more trash. And pretty much everywhere I looked on top of el cap there was trash. Stashed gear, old water bottles, sleeping pads, fire rings and rock houses.
And then on El Cap there is all the fixed rope, stashed haulbags and all the new convenience bolts. It looked awful up there and really quite sad. This trash wasn't left by "tourists" this trash was left by climbers.
Yosemite was once home to strong ethics and good morals but in my opinion that is slowly eroding to a place where climbers think it is their right to climb on the walls and do whatever they want and however they want. The lack of respect for El Cap and all of Yosemite these days is astonishing. I think a serious discussion needs to happen about the future of El Cap and the responsibility that goes along with climbing it. We need to do better as a user group to police ourselves before that isn't even an option. El Cap is not some shitty sport climbing crag and shouldn't be treated like it anymore."
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Bruce Morris
Social climber
Belmont, California
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strong ethics and good morals
Apples vs. Oranges. Two different kinds of fruit.
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skitch
Gym climber
Bend Or
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HAHA! None of the "shitty sport crags" I've ever been too have much garbage or fixed crap. . .and I guess climbers can't be tourists???
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donini
Trad climber
Ouray, Colorado
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Hear, hear! couldn't agree more but I believe you have a tiger by the tale. It has to do with familiarity which breeds both wanting to do harder things AND wanting to enhance the possibility of doing so by comfortizing the process.
Fixed ropes all Winter at the Cookie are an example as are fixed ropes on the Salathe Headwall and that's just concerning free climbing. You get into Big Wall aid climbing and the problem increases exponentially.
Locals need to police but some locals may be a part of the problem.
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Don Paul
Big Wall climber
Denver CO
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I used to walk around the base of el Cap looking for dropped gear to booty. Some of it is still on my rack. Just walk around the boulders under the Nose, there's tons of sh#t there, literally. In the stovelegs, I think we got 2 or 3 cams out but I didn't get them. As for picking up the brown paper bags down there ..... well, someday maybe I will go to one of those Yosemite clean up parties and consider it.
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Moof
Big Wall climber
Orygun
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If nothing can apparently be done about a gross offender such as Sloan, we might as well throw in the towel and let it be a sports crag. He has been at this for more than a decade, and it has taken a truly blatant violation for even the internet posse to take notice. People railing against him for prior offenses have mostly been written off to date.
Those that feel like remaking the place in their image, for their convenience, and for their target consumer have every reason to seek approval from a few un-named apparitions and then bolt, chip, saw, and earth-move to make the place to their own liking.
In all fairness Yosemite and El Cap have a long history of things like tossed sh#t bags back in the 60's-80's, the Jardine Traverse, and much more. Sloan brings the level of destruction to a new single person record, but is not entirely out of character from previous villains.
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Studly
Trad climber
WA
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When can I start clipping? I got the fancy rock shoes with the Velcro and threw away my cams. This is going to be great.
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Reilly
Mountain climber
The Other Monrovia- CA
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Maybe the Park Service should man up and ban climbing for, let's say, a decade?
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ecflau
Gym climber
CA
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Agreed here, even little things like climbing tape and cigarette butts and cliff bar wrappers are left all over the base of any popular route. Forget disgusting TP.
Would you leave trash all over your home? I often bring a small bag and pick up a few pieces of trash whenever I'm out climbing. It takes very little effort. Not telling anyone what to do (or if anyone thought about it) but I hope people adapt it as well, so we don't have to wait for a once-a-year crag cleanup. A small contribution by everyone goes a long ways.
(confession : I've dropped stuff up on a climb before, so I'm not totally without blame either. But I try to do my best to keep nature as natural as possible, nobody has a right to destroy for no other reason then being lazy)
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thebravecowboy
climber
The Good Places
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There is a reason some people avoid the place in favor of "shitty crags" elsewhere
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WBraun
climber
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Confucius say ....
Without "Those People" self righteous hypocrites will not have anything to bitch about .....
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Mark Hudon
Trad climber
On the road.
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Ha! Good one, Werner!
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couchmaster
climber
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If only someone were to start a club to pick up the trash. It could be called....(wait for it)....
...the Cult of the Blue Caguole....
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bbbeans
Trad climber
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Usually try to grab a piece of trash or two every time I am out.
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i'm gumby dammit
Sport climber
da ow
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I also never see any of this at any sport crag. Where I did see it recently is the lake at trail camp on whitney. obviously some of this could have inadvertently blown in but there were also sardine cans and plenty of stuff that wouldn't just blow around. Not to mention the other unmentionables the dogs are so good at finding.
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Jaybro
Social climber
Wolf City, Wyoming
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That's the way Cave rock is now
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Kalimon
Social climber
Ridgway, CO
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Hypocrisy is a common human quality.
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Nick
climber
portland, Oregon
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I know I will catch heat for this...but I do not see the difference between climbing routes and trails. In our public lands, you can hike off trail, but not dig new improved paths to semi- permanently alter the land. Are there not enough paths for all to follow? Get out and explore off the beaten path and leave no trace.
Personally I think the Park service screwed up by not controlling the amount of development on the cliffs. El Cap and most of Yosemite have become overused, overdeveloped E-ticket amusement rides.
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Fossil climber
Trad climber
Atlin, B. C.
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Well,other than the trash which is reprehensible, if you've got permanent bolts and retreat routes ensuring safety on every difficult pitch, what have you got?
Stacked sports climbs?
Porta ledge camping in between.
Maybe, before long, will you have to go somewhere other than Yosemite to find an honest big wall climb?
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