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crusher
climber
Santa Monica, CA
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Topic Author's Original Post - Jun 20, 2006 - 05:29pm PT
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I am blind as a bat (nearsighted, -7 in one eye and -6.5 in the other) and am contemplating Lasik...wear contacts, usually not too much trouble but not fun either like when it's windy, etc....so the Dr. says since I'm now going to start getting far-sighted (i.e. reading glasses territory) at 41, he'd suggest correcting me with "mono vision" meaning my less dominant eye a bit undercorrected and dominant eye more corrected for distance...so I can delay the reading glasses for a while. He said your brain usually adjusts and you don't notice it after a while. I sorta think it may drive me bonkers, but??? Anyone tried that?
My other question is if any of you have had Lasik and have been corrected more for your far sight, have you noticed that your really close up eyesight is not so great while climbing (like seeing texture, feature, depth etc. properly)?
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crusher
climber
Santa Monica, CA
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Topic Author's Reply - Jun 20, 2006 - 06:40pm PT
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OOOh Rok,
You are bad - Im so sorry. :( Dr. gave me some less powerful contacts to try out the "mono vision" thing beforehand, which I will do.
From what I can tell he's a top notch guy - I have relatives who have had Lasik with him and he uses the custom cornea system for a really accurate measurement, etc. (He's a Dr. at Cedars Sinai here in L.A.)...and is not one of those cheapy "sale" Drs. He refuses to do both eyes at once, has done thousands of Lasiks surgeries, etc. I'm super paranoid about going "just anywhere" so making sure he's the right Dr. if I do it is at the top of my list.
Anyway I've been pretty lucky in terms of wearing the contacts when climbing, just have had plenty of discomfort and have had ulcers in my eyes from them. I don't do big walls so the bivy thing hasn't been an issue, however camping can be or just days when I've had to wear my glasses. I also spent years windsurfing with contacts (lost a few) and still now mountain bike, snowboard, etc. with 'em as best I can and I'm always curious as to how others with contacts fare doing outside sports.
Can't sleep in them and would love to one day wake up and be able to see the clock (which I can't, even with 1" tall numbers)!
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Burns
Trad climber
Arlington, VA
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Jun 20, 2006 - 06:57pm PT
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I got lasik about 6 months ago now. It is amazing. I wasn't starting to lose my near vision, so the mono-vision thing wasn't an issue, so I suppose I can't advise on that. If you weren't a climber, I'd say don't bother since wearing glasses to read is not really a big deal. All the other things you do you won't need to be able to see near (if it's that close to your face, you're already in trouble).
I got my lasik done by Dr. Whitten in DC who is the same doc who did Tiger Woods, among others. Something like 30,000 surgeries. Did both eyes at once, whole thing took 10 minutes (that guy is minting money), and now I'm 20/20 in both eyes. It is pretty amazing. For the first two weeks or so my close up vision wouldn't adjust very well. I had trouble looking at a computer screen, etc. However, I'd bank on taking about a month off of any climbing around the surgery (2 weeks on either end) because of the potential for eye irritation and injury from chalk, rock dust, etc. Once I was back climbing I didn't notice too much.
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Joe Metz
Trad climber
Bay Area
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Jun 20, 2006 - 07:04pm PT
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I got very tired of the hassles associated with wearing glasses while climbing and skiing, and had the lasik procedure done in 2000, at the age of 44. I went top-of-the-line (Stanford) and had both eyes done at the same time. I could see my vision improving as the procedure was done - pretty amazing. The results have been great. The procedure accomplished exactly what I wanted: good vision without the hassles associated with glasses or contact lenses. Downside: my night vision (previously very good) was pretty much ruined (but correctable with glasses). Now, at age 50, I can still work at a computer all day without reading glasses. They are necessary when working with surface-mounted components and other tiny stuff, but this is pretty much expected at my age. My vision is perfectly adequate for all climbing- and skiing-related activities -- no regrets.
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crusher
climber
Santa Monica, CA
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Topic Author's Reply - Jun 20, 2006 - 07:08pm PT
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Burns, cool - how bad was your refraction?
I figured I would be ultra careful and no chalk, dust, dirt, saltwater, etc. for a decent amount of time after.
I would be ok with wearing the reading glasses for computer, etc. in order to not wear the dang contacts and coke bottle (even though they're high index) glasses!
Funny thing is I didn't even become near sighted until I was in college and then it was a quick slippery slope down after. My eyes only stopped getting worse about 4 years ago.
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Burns
Trad climber
Arlington, VA
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Jun 20, 2006 - 07:27pm PT
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not that bad in the grand scheme. -2.5 and -2.75 In my opinion though, there are only two kinds of vision: 'needs correction' and 'lucky bastards'.
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TradIsGood
Trad climber
Gunks end of country
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Jun 20, 2006 - 08:31pm PT
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Did both at the same time about 5 years ago. Drove an hour back down the next day for the checkup. It is so excellent. I hated contacts - only wore them for hockey - ever try to keep glasses clear in sweaty cold environment?
I'm 53 now. Still use the same reading glasses that I got after the procedure. But hardly ever use them. Only if eyes are tired or in low light situations - yes - strong light makes it much easier to read than low.
I think I am about 20-25 both eyes. Your eyes will eventually have difficulty focusing short anyway. I would say (no expert) go with same vision both eyes. Consult other docs.
Or e-mail if you want name of guy outside phila.
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Mighty Hiker
Social climber
Vancouver, B.C.
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Jun 20, 2006 - 09:51pm PT
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I had lasik surgery in January 2006, after long and careful consideration. My eyes weren't all that bad - about -4.0 in both, and fairly stable. But having had glasses and/or contacts since I was 12, I'd always wanted to do without, though it had never really limited what I did. Just a nuisance, sometimes substantial.
I considered getting "uneven" correction, so that one eye would be a bit more far sighted, one a bit more nearsighted for reading. Decided against, partly because although I'm 49 I still don't need reading glasses at all. (Mystifies the optometrist.) Also because, assuming both eyes post-surgery deteriorate consistently and I eventually need reading glasses, I can buy cheap off the shelf glasses, at least for a while. If the eyes were uneven, then I might have to get prescription reading glasses, which cost heaps more.
Thorough research and cost/benefit analysis are strongly recommended. Don't believe any one source or person, and remember that it's your eyes, you're stuck with them for another 30 or more years, and it's your decision. If you can, find out:
a) the percentage of patients the doctors you're looking at who are turned away - if they reject a reasonable percentage, then they're not doing marginal surgery,
b) the number of patients the doctor has had, and the statistics thereon - number of problems, kinds of problems, etc,
c) the number of patients per day, i.e. is it a factory struggling to meet the bills, or a bit more quality-oriented.
You can also call the medical association and find out about the doctor's complaint and disciplinary record, and possibly check court records to see how often the doctor is sued, and for what. All important indicators.
The surgeon I went to in Vancouver came highly recommended by several climber-optometrists I know. (A good source of information.) Both had lasik surgery with him, and had done post-operative care on a lot of patients from various surgeons. A good part of the surgeon's practice is operating on American eyes - the cost is about C$2,500. So you can take a climbing trip to Squamish, get your eyes done, then head home. One thing to remember is that you could never successfully sue a Canadian surgeon, as they require that you sign a binding waiver of all rights.
I had the surgery at a quiet time of year, in terms of exercise and adventure, and decided in advance to simply take a month off. That's when the eyes are most vulnerable, though they take a year to fully heal, and it seemed a small sacrifice.
I've been 20:20 in one eye, and 20:25 in the other eye, since two days after the surgery. I still need to use saline drops once or twice a day, but no other complications.
Good luck, and keep us posted!
Anders
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Mountain Man
Trad climber
Outer space
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Jun 20, 2006 - 11:13pm PT
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This is a little different means to the end.
I've worn glasses all my life, went to bifocals around age 50, and a year ago began having severe problems with distance vision. An exam revealed early cataracts. Within three months I couldn't read signs, recognize my children from 100 feet, etc.
I had both lenses replaced with multifocal lenses, with a little RK to flatten out my astigmatisms. The result is 20/20 vision, with the world much brighter and colors more vivid.
I can pick a better line on my bicycle, descending on gravel and am climbing much better. I hadn't realized how much my vision had deteriorated.
I'm so glad I got cataracts!
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pyro
Trad climber
Ventura
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Jun 21, 2006 - 01:27am PT
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I had done some research about lasik correction. wanted to give a gift to my best friend. I'm looking at about $5K.
have been in the office only four hours.
driving the next day would be not a problem.
she's going to be happy because loosing your glass is always never fun.
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TradIsGood
Trad climber
Gunks end of country
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Jun 21, 2006 - 06:03am PT
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BTW. For best results you should be off contacts for a period of time. 6 months if I remember correctly.
Also check into FSA accounts, if your insurance won't cover it (almost none does). You may be able to contribute 3000(?) to FSA account, deducted from your payroll. That income is not taxed. You probably must decide to do so before the end of the year for next year. But you can have the surgery in the beginning of January, file a claim for the full amount of the surgery up to the limit of your annual contribution immediately after the procedure, even though there may be zero or one payment made. In my case, the procedure was "financed" with one year 0 interest credit account set up by the doctors office. So the 3000 earned interest for about 11 months, then the loan was paid off immediately.
Tax benefit is your marginal tax rate times 3000 say $750 and maybe $75 in interest after tax.
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Brian in SLC
Social climber
Salt Lake City, UT
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Jun 21, 2006 - 10:42am PT
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A few months back, I ran into someone who works as a contractor at San Diego Naval Medical Center, where they do eye surgery and research. I've always been pretty curious about getting some type of corrective surgery on my eyes, and know a ton of folks who have had LASIK done successfully.
So I asked, "if you were me, what would you do?" I tolerate contacts very well and have pretty good night vision. But, that wake up in the morning and being able to see thing (ok, really, its an impromtu hot tub fantasy) would be sweet.
This person had compiled tons of data on eye surgery. They said that the Navy prefers (or requires) PRK over LASIK in that there's less complications especially for active folks. Having that flap pop open after an impact might not be so good.
But, bottom line was, if I tolerate contacts well, then, to not get the surgery. Interesting.
Anyhoo, FWIW.
-Brian in SLC
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doc bs
Social climber
Northwest
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Jun 21, 2006 - 10:53am PT
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1. Try "monovision" in contact lenses before you have it done surgically for good.
2. Remember: near vision worsens continuously through out your life (your lenses get more rigid with age).
3. You can have reading glasses at different focal lengths to accomodate your different activities. Focal lengths for climbing, reading, sitting at computer are all different...
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prongo
Trad climber
east side kid
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Jun 21, 2006 - 11:41am PT
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had my eyes done a couple years ago, been happy with the results except for the always dry eyes. also i used to be able to focus up to 6" away, right after the procedure went to 10"-12".my night vision improved 2 nights after the procedure went out and saw the stars for the first time ever-wow. driveing or hiking at night no problem. vision ended up with 20-10 in both eyes but the dryness does suck and can take away from that 20-10
if you already made up your mind about getting it done dont read this site
http://www.surgicaleyes.org/News.htm
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Karyn
Social climber
Southern CA
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Jun 21, 2006 - 11:48am PT
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I had Lasik about 8 years ago. I was concerned about the night vision (the halos around lights). It only bothers me when I'm really tired, and then only as bad as my contacts were.
Lasik's the best thing I've ever done - medically speaking.
I'm 43 and don't have reading glasses...yet. But that's because I can't read :-) I decided to correct the near-sightedness and cross the reading glasses/far-sighted bridge when I come to it.
The one thing the doctor "forgot" to tell me about was the false contact lens he put on to help heal the eye. The contact was folding and falling out. Freaked me out! I thought my eye was falling apart. LOL
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Joe Metz
Trad climber
Bay Area
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Jun 21, 2006 - 12:57pm PT
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Chris,
My loss of night vision is not typical. As I understand it, I have a fairly wide iris opening in the dark (about 7mm) and the flap was about 6mm wide, so there is some problem with spherical aberration (?). Stars appear as fuzzy patches rather than points. Contrast is bad, so walking around in the woods at night without a light is no longer advisable. However, my problem was easily corrected with glasses that I wear only at night. I would prefer not to have this problem, but it's not so bad that I regret having Lasik done. I haven't heard from anyone else who has had a similar issue. You might want to ask your optometrist / opthamologist about it before going forward.
One very common problem after Lasik is "starring" at night -- every light source appears to have four or six radial rays emitting from it. I'm sure you have seen photographs taken with filters that purposely create this effect. The problem is pretty bad at first, but it goes away completely after a month or two.
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TradIsGood
Trad climber
Gunks end of country
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Jun 21, 2006 - 01:07pm PT
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Chris, I have always had good night vision. Still do. No halos, no stars.
But it does happen. Find out the latest techniques and find excellent doctor. An excellent one may personally be doing about 1 pair of eyes per hour at least on 2 - 3 days per week.
Make sure that they are using the latest equipment. The quality of the results are primarily in the equipment - assuming that the cut of the flap is done well.
Oh, and check into the follow-up visits. You will be back the next day, maybe next two days, etc. You may have a half-dozen or more follow-up checkups in the next year to check that vision stays normal and that the flap grows back properly.
So going to Canada might not be the best idea unless you understand what proper after care will entail.
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mark miller
Social climber
Reno
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Jun 21, 2006 - 01:19pm PT
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I had Lasik (2x) 4 years ago, at age 40. I think everyones results are different.
The final analysis for me is I love it but there are compromises in my vision.Per the eye chart and Doctor I'm now corrected to 20/15 and 20/20 which is good, right?
No Halos on lights at night but I sure have to drive alot slower than usual, I just can't see the road far enough ahead of me like I use to. I usaully don't need eye drops unless I have a hard eye day; ie many hours on the computer or hours in the sun.
My reading vision is ok and I usually don't wear glasses unless I'm doing cabinet construction and need to be accurate (1/32") on cuts. I do need alot more light to see in all applications.
The biggest and strangest effect( and I've never heard anyone else mention this, didn't read all the above posts) is my vision is slower than before. It takes a brief second to focus when I turn my head and even though my specs are great something is not right in Hooterville. I have trouble seeing the "sweet spot" on pool balls like I use to and 5.11 smears and little edges are visible but not quite the same.
My procedure was done by Doctor David Chaffin in Reno and he is supposed to be the best around Reno. I am happy I've had the procedure but there have been trade offs.
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dufas
Trad climber
san francisco
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Jun 21, 2006 - 01:21pm PT
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night vision effect seems to vary. my wife had lasik 8 years ago and has been unable to drive at night due to the halos since. our uninformed opinion is that the doc mis-measured pupil dilation due to ambient light and now the pupil will dilate beyond the lasik insert. should have sued the quack.
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