Discussion Topic |
|
This thread has been locked |
healyje
Trad climber
Portland, Oregon
|
|
|
Topic Author's Original Post - Sep 26, 2011 - 03:07pm PT
|
Superpin, Super Chicken, retro-bolting, etc., etc...
From what I've seen, it seems like few climbers stay true to their roots as they age - how many really think that decision through versus simply tossing their own history and traditions to the wind with all the thought of emptying an ashtray out a car window? (yes, son, cars had ashtrays before USB ports and people used to litter with abandon)
Is the decision either way a case of convenience, adapt-or-die, obdurate clinging to the past, selfishness, trying to stay popular with the kids, unwillingness to tarnish one's own past, unwillingness to accept one's limitations, bending with time, or being wanting things to remain within reach as we age?
|
|
apogee
climber
|
|
|
Sep 26, 2011 - 03:13pm PT
|
"From what I've seen, it seems like few climbers stay true to their roots as they age..."
Interesting thought.
That's true of a lot of aspects of aging...take politics, for example...some people seem to start out fairly open minded and gradually become more resistant to change over the years. For others, exactly the opposite occurs.
This shift in one's world view and values plays out in many ways- climbing is just one example. I don't think there's one predominant trend.
|
|
G_Gnome
Trad climber
In the mountains... somewhere...
|
|
|
Sep 26, 2011 - 03:19pm PT
|
Most get out of shape and inevitably somewhat lazy as they age. It take a ton or work and lots of pain to stay at the top of your game and most quit playing at some point. I don't think there is anything wrong but it kind of bothers me to see so many give up like that. Once that happens then they start to reconcile other changes to accomodate their new reality. Who am I to say that it is wrong, all I know is that I don't want to go that way!
|
|
atchafalaya
Boulder climber
|
|
|
Sep 26, 2011 - 03:20pm PT
|
"I don't see enough negative choices there..."
Hahahaha, he should have just posted that cut/paste of how gyms ruined climbing and been done with it.
|
|
healyje
Trad climber
Portland, Oregon
|
|
|
Topic Author's Reply - Sep 26, 2011 - 03:22pm PT
|
There are negatives listed there for both sides of the equation...
|
|
apogee
climber
|
|
|
Sep 26, 2011 - 03:23pm PT
|
"Once that happens then they start to reconcile other changes to accomodate their new reality."
Some would say that as they have gained more life experience, they've come to realize that what they used to uphold as a principled stand was really fairly overly-simplistic and unrealistically dogmatic.
Edit for Ron: Though I drew a parallel with politics, I'm trying to point out a more general shift that occurs in the aging process that affects one's view of many things.
|
|
G_Gnome
Trad climber
In the mountains... somewhere...
|
|
|
Sep 26, 2011 - 04:05pm PT
|
Yeah, the ability to pull is no longer important. I can see how that shift happens, it is the 'why is happens' that I have the most problems with.
|
|
healyje
Trad climber
Portland, Oregon
|
|
|
Topic Author's Reply - Sep 26, 2011 - 04:08pm PT
|
Some would say that as they have gained more life experience, they've come to realize that what they used to uphold as a principled stand was really fairly overly-simplistic and unrealistically dogmatic.
A fair opinion. Though I've never considered climbing or aging so complicated as to require any particular retinking of my early beliefs around the former.
|
|
nutjob
Gym climber
Berkeley, CA
|
|
|
Sep 26, 2011 - 04:20pm PT
|
As we age, we tend to have a broader perspective of the world and the importance of stuff in general. Things that once seemed like critical issues take their place as another speck of dust in the wind.
That thread about Marshall South has an apt quote that I'll paste in here in a minute...
He would not compromise. And that is fatal in a civilization where life is a never-ending compromise between the things we would like to do and the obligations imposed by the social and economic organization of which we are a part.
How to balance purist ideals with pragmatic considerations? Maybe this is the art of living.
|
|
aspendougy
Trad climber
Los Angeles, CA
|
|
|
Sep 26, 2011 - 04:31pm PT
|
There are a few like Bob Kamps who seemed to remain in good shape and true to their roots (and routes) until they day they die. Fred Becky is another one who has really hung in there.
Trying to really stay in shape? There are so many things that can go wrong, and sometimes ones genes bring things beyond one's control.
So it takes both the willingness, which many of us don't have, plus the right genetic makeup.
|
|
cragnshag
Social climber
san joser
|
|
|
Sep 26, 2011 - 04:54pm PT
|
OK, a test for you old folks at the campfire: how many 20 year-olds would you go to for advice? (other than how to use your smart phone)
OK, now that that is settled, can we safely assume that 20 year olds don't know squat? We were all that age once and we thought we knew it all. Then as we aged we realized that there was so much we didn't know.
Wise people tend to be old people- it's just how it works. The older we get, the more experience we have to draw from- more life lessons learned. Hell, I've learned more in 2 years of raising a child than in 25 years of going up and down stoopid rocks.
|
|
healyje
Trad climber
Portland, Oregon
|
|
|
Topic Author's Reply - Sep 26, 2011 - 08:04pm PT
|
The older we get, the more experience we have to draw from- more life lessons learned. Hell, I've learned more in 2 years of raising a child than in 25 years of going up and down stoopid rocks.
And so what did you learn relative to climbing?
|
|
goatboy smellz
climber
Nederland
|
|
|
Sep 26, 2011 - 08:35pm PT
|
If you place a bolt, for any reason, do not take pictures.
|
|
flyingkiwi1
Trad climber
Seattle WA
|
|
|
Sep 26, 2011 - 08:45pm PT
|
Cragnshag wrote:
Hell, I've learned more in 2 years of raising a child than in 25 years of going up and down stoopid rocks.
healyje replied:
And so what did you learn relative to climbing?
Agreeing with cragnshag, responding for myself:
That above all (pun intended), I climb for the sharpened focus and perspective climbing promotes in my mind, body and soul. That that focus and perspective is worth climbing for, but that it's not worth dying for - not anymore. And that there are other ways to get it.
|
|
Off White
climber
Tenino, WA
|
|
|
Sep 26, 2011 - 09:18pm PT
|
Cragnshag nailed it pretty well. You don't have kids, do you Joe? Death and dismemberment while climbing is a lot less romantic once you think you might live past 30, and certainly once you have children who rely on you. No big deal though, there's plenty of risk out there for the asking, and I doubt a couple three bolts on a 5.7 third pitch in Tuolumne is going to deplete the resource, especially if you never climb down there anyway. The world still has a lot more adventure than it has takers, hell, even just a slice of the world like Yosemite.
|
|
Nick
climber
portland, Oregon
|
|
|
Sep 26, 2011 - 10:03pm PT
|
Over the years, a few close calls and knowledge of others who have not been so lucky have helped me I realize that we have only so many empty chambers in the gun of life. I choose to spin the chamber and pull the trigger very selectively these days.
There is no such thing as luck, only uncontrolled variables.
|
|
Hawkeye
climber
State of Mine
|
|
|
Sep 26, 2011 - 10:24pm PT
|
the bolt on superpin was 34 yrs old....nuff said.
|
|
cragnshag
Social climber
san joser
|
|
|
Sep 26, 2011 - 10:24pm PT
|
And so what did you learn relative to climbing?
I've learned a bit about unconditional love, sacrifice, teamwork, and the consequences of my actions. These things I've learned climbing too, but somehow it was diluted with the business of life in a way. I see much more clearly now (is that a song...?)
Plenty of old folks out there who have walked the on the edge. They have earned the right to change their mind about something so personel as an FA. - No need minimize them for that.
|
|
G_Gnome
Trad climber
In the mountains... somewhere...
|
|
|
Sep 27, 2011 - 12:42am PT
|
Taking silly risks because you have too much testosterone and giving up on adventure because you are too lazy to stay in shape are not the same at all. And rationalizing either is just fooling yourself.
|
|
|
SuperTopo on the Web
|
Let us know!