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wildone
climber
Troy, MT
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Topic Author's Reply - Oct 31, 2010 - 11:47am PT
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Why? Why can't it belong on the "thinking americans" thread that I'm starting here?
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rincon
Trad climber
SoCal
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Oct 31, 2010 - 11:54am PT
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Jan
Mountain climber
Okinawa, Japan
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Oct 31, 2010 - 12:27pm PT
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I only go for Teton tea thank you very much.
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elcap-pics
Big Wall climber
Crestline CA
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Oct 31, 2010 - 12:47pm PT
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Idiots, striving to become morons.
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philo
Trad climber
Somewhere halfway over the rainbow
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Oct 31, 2010 - 12:56pm PT
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Sums the TP/RP mentality up perfectly.
Make ignorant regurgitated claim, fail to defend it, change subject to another claim unrelated to fact or reality, fail to defend it when questioned, make bigoted statement in the name of patriotism, refuse to acknowledge it, fall back on religious/moral superiority, etc etc etc.....
Rinse and repeat.
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TGT
Social climber
So Cal
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Oct 31, 2010 - 01:00pm PT
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Boy are you guys in for a surprise!
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/comment/columnists/janetdaley/8098844/Midterm-elections-2010-Prepare-for-a-new-American-revolution.html
So the Republicans are, if anything, as much in revolt against the establishment within their own party as they are against the Democrats. And this is what the Tea Parties (which should always be referred to in the plural, because they are not a monolithic movement) are all about: they are not just a reaction against a Left-liberal president but a repudiation of the official Opposition as well.
Nor are they simply the embodiment of reactionary social conservatism, which has been the last redoubt of the traditional Republican Right. There were plenty of people in New York who wanted to believe that Tea Partiers were just a new incarnation of the gun-totin', gay-bashing right-to-lifers whom they found it so easy to dismiss as risible throwbacks. This is a huge political miscalculation, which quite misses the point of what makes the Congressional midterm elections this week such an interesting and historic political event. This is so much more than the predictable to-ing and fro-ing of party control midway through a presidential term. What the grassroots rebellion is really about is an attempt to pull the Republican party back to its basic philosophy of low-tax, low-spend, small government: the great Jeffersonian principle that the best government is that which governs least.
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Eric Beck
Sport climber
Bishop, California
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Oct 31, 2010 - 01:23pm PT
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This is a short piece on the tea party which I originally posted on our Democratic club website: http://www.owensriverdemocrats.org/
Tea Party as Revolutionaries
The Tea Party has become the subject of endless speculation as to what they are really about. I’d like to advance an idea which is not popularly mentioned. This is not entirely original; I first heard it in an offhand remark by Chris Matthews (MSNBC Hardball) who said “I never thought that when the revolution finally came, it would be from the right”.
The annual incomes of the bottom 90 per cent of US families have been essentially flat since 1973 – having risen by only 10 per cent in real terms over the past 37 years. In this same period, federal spending as a percent of gdp increased from 30% to 42% and federal debt as a percent of gdp increased from 33% to 94%. Thus, it is easy to conclude that for a great many Americans, the growth of government has not only not benefited them, but rather is actually quite harmful as they are now obligated to pay off the increased government debt. This observation, I owe to our own Tim Willoughby.
This, I believe, is the real root of the anti-government talk of the Tea Party. The Tea Party, at least so far, has expressed their views in an inarticulate and inchoate manner. They have no theoretician, certainly no Che Guevara or Frantz Fanon. As such, numerous groups try to speak for them in an effort to co-opt their energy. White Supremacists appeal to the least educated and most prejudiced among them. Republicans, who have a traditional anti government bias, try to gain their support in order to weaken government and advance their pro-corporate agenda. Finally, many try to ridicule them. This turns out to not be very difficult. They give us plenty of material from witchcraft to handcuffing reporters.
As Democrats, this should be our constituency. Perhaps it is too late. The Tea Party despises our health care plan, who knows what they would think of one with a real public option. Social Security, while it is a great boon to many, is not the program it should be. Most people only receive a fraction of what they contribute. An elaboration of this takes calculus, beyond the scope (and room) of this post. We are perceived as elitists. Indeed, the unemployment rate for those with college degrees is 4.4%, much below the national average. Thus Ms. O’Donnell says “I’m you”. We continue fighting in Afghanistan, a war benefiting only those who profit from the war.
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dirtbag
climber
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Oct 31, 2010 - 01:37pm PT
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Tea baggage is simply the Republican base, energized and with a new name. Except for their renewed energy, they are nothing new. And increasingly the religious right is joining in.
Same ol' same ol'.
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Norton
Social climber
the Wastelands
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Oct 31, 2010 - 01:50pm PT
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So the Tea Party's great concern is government debt?
My guess is not one percent of them can tell you what the most recent gross revenue and outlay of the US Government was in 2009.
Or state the three largest by far expenditures.
Or know that the interest rate we pay on the dept has actually FALLEN by more than 25 percent in the past year, and NOT risen.
Or know which political party presided over the largest growth in both debt and also in growing the sheer size of the Federal Government.
Or can say why they kept their mouth's shut until after 1/20/2008.
Grass roots my ass.
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John Moosie
climber
Beautiful California
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Oct 31, 2010 - 01:57pm PT
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Dang Ive never seen more experts on Tea partiers than here.. I went to a tea party and my message was the REDUCTION of "uncle monkey" off our backs...Which was the message of most others...For decades the gubment has been acting as a DOMESTIC enemy...That has been the poiint of tea party gatherings ive been to...fyi.
The problem as I see it is that you think the republicans can do this better then the dems, when in fact the opposite it true. So you will vote for republicans because there aren't very many tea party representatives and those there are, are mostly crazy.
If the tea party really did stand for things like; a balanced budget, sound.. not "less" government, sound..not "less" rules, fair...not "no" taxes,
then I might support them.
But mostly all I have seen are a bunch of whack jobs that in the end will vote for a party that gave us the biggest recession since the great depression, a destroyed economy, an attitude of .. if you aren't for us, then you are against us, an over taxed military, an atmosphere of fear, endless war, majorly increased government, ect..
In the last 30 years, the dems are the only party that gave us a budget surplus and started paying down the national debt, but tea partiers will fail to acknowledge this.
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John Moosie
climber
Beautiful California
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Oct 31, 2010 - 02:07pm PT
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.Its CAREER politicians that are to blame.
Are you voting for republicans this election?
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karodrinker
Trad climber
San Jose, CA
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Oct 31, 2010 - 02:07pm PT
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Ron, you sound like the tea party cartoon! "Career politician", what the F does that even mean? If you are a politician at all, is that not your chosen career at that point? Are you in the top 3% income bracket Ron? If not, how in the world could you fall for this crap. Quit voting against your best interest dude.
Are you just afraid of the gays? Ahhh, that must be it.
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John Moosie
climber
Beautiful California
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Oct 31, 2010 - 02:11pm PT
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One of the funniest things I have heard in the last few years was Sarah Palin saying that career politicians were to blame for all of our problems. She made a career out of being a politician, until more lucrative things came along. haha..
Mayor, councilman, governor, and then ran for VP.. naw. thats not a career politician.
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John Moosie
climber
Beautiful California
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Oct 31, 2010 - 02:11pm PT
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Come on Ron.. are you voting for a republican this election?
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dirtbag
climber
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Oct 31, 2010 - 02:25pm PT
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Dems or repubs same same....Its CAREER politicians that are to blame. NOT one of them have acted in the interest of the common man. This system needed flushing a hundred years ago, but the apathy of america has let them loose fo far too long and now we are paying for ignoring the warnings of men who created the system. Thats my tea party mantra.
Ahem...there's a better mantra, you know:
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Norton
Social climber
the Wastelands
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Oct 31, 2010 - 02:34pm PT
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So the Tea Party's great concern is government debt?
My guess is not one percent of them can tell you what the most recent gross revenue and outlay of the US Government was in 2009.
Or state the three largest by far expenditures.
Or know that the interest rate we pay on the dept has actually FALLEN by more than 25 percent in the past year, and NOT risen.
Or know which political party presided over the largest growth in both debt and also in growing the sheer size of the Federal Government.
Or can say why they kept their mouth's shut until after 1/20/2008.
Grass roots my ass.
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John Moosie
climber
Beautiful California
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Oct 31, 2010 - 02:38pm PT
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Whenever someone is asked to define "career politician", they always use a democrat as an example. I have yet to see them point out a republican, unless that republican is already out of office. That seems like a bias, since so many of the things that are wrong right now can be directly attributed to the policies of the republicans. They gave us two wars, the largest recession since the great depression, the biggest increase in government in many many years. So why aren't they labeled as "career" politicians since they don't seem to have the best interest of the country at heart? My guess is that there is a serious bias.
Who are the "career" politicians that are republicans?
My question is serious because the last time I voted for a third party, we got 6 years of total control by the republicans, and they gave us a mess.
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guyman
Trad climber
Moorpark, CA.
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Oct 31, 2010 - 02:49pm PT
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Just waiting for Tuesday.
Personally if your are now in office, I will vote against you.
Party affiliation means nothing.
Both the dems and the repubs are to blame for the mess.
So a yes on 19 would be a good start.
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John Moosie
climber
Beautiful California
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Oct 31, 2010 - 02:53pm PT
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So.. you can't name even one "career" politician who is a republican and should be out of office?
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