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noshoesnoshirt
climber
Arkansas, I suppose
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Topic Author's Original Post - Sep 25, 2010 - 12:03am PT
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I thought you started out selling affordable gear to dirtbag climbers. I am disappoint.
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BooYah
Social climber
Ely, Nv
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Sep 25, 2010 - 12:10am PT
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Ah. Starting out is NOT ending up.
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mark miller
Social climber
Reno
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Sep 25, 2010 - 12:13am PT
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Biners, Pins and camelots are the only useful tools they have made for climbers in the last thirty +years.... Their Gators don't even fit correctly.......all their other gear is over priced and Knott competitive either in Quality or price. Marmot. Mountain Hardware,etc,etc,etc can standup to every Patagonia product and when your stuck on a ledge for the night in a freezing rain poor I hope you made the right decision.
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BooYah
Social climber
Ely, Nv
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Sep 25, 2010 - 12:24am PT
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I do still like their fuzzy stuff. & long johns.
All that other stuff is fluff. Fluff!
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stevep
Boulder climber
Salt Lake, UT
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Sep 25, 2010 - 12:35am PT
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Gators?
Are those the Patagonia equivalent of those rubber Croc clogs?
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Rhodo-Router
Gym climber
Green Cove slabbage BITD!
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Sep 25, 2010 - 01:11am PT
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It doesn't take too long in the retail trade to figure out that the margins are way better selling to people with money. Is this news to you?
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Tom
Big Wall climber
San Luis Obispo CA
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Sep 25, 2010 - 02:16am PT
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The old-fashioned poly pile jackets, with a woven outside and a woolly inside, were great. The outside shed water, beer and ketchup, while the thick fake lambs wool kept you warm. I still have a pair of Patagonia "igloo pants" made from that material. The two jackets I had are long gone.
Sad to say, now they only sell the fancy poly fleece . . . with an exterior fleecy surface that grabs water, beer and ketchup. The shelled pile jackets are way too cool to be wearing in adverse conditions.
And fleece is the operative term with respect to pricing these days. Well, the cut and quality is pretty durn good.
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Shack
Big Wall climber
Reno NV
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Sep 25, 2010 - 02:21am PT
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Hey It's on sale! For only $78 bucks! (was $125)
If I ever pay that much for a shirt, especially an ugly shirt, just lock me up because I have gone insane.
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ron gomez
Trad climber
fallbrook,ca
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Sep 25, 2010 - 10:03am PT
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I'm prolly a minority here but, damn near everything I ever bought from Patagonia I still own. Still have a rain jacket from the 80's and a fleece pullover from the 70's. Their gear fits me, lasts forever, they back their product and yes even some of my hard earned cash goes back to the earth that I use for so many of my loved activities. Some times I cringe at spending what I do of theirs but in the long run I know I won't be re-buying it and that I'll have the product for years to come and I am supporting friends who work for Patagonia. I don't just buy exclusive to them(can't afford it)but when I do do buy Patagonia I know my money is going to a good company, who's been around a long time and I'm helping people I KNOW.
Lot's of other companies out there who make great products, but they ain't cheap either and some of their issues go beyond a price tag. I'll always support them!
Peace
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Srbphoto
climber
Kennewick wa
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Sep 25, 2010 - 10:39am PT
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Marmot, mt hardwear, north face, stonemaster et al. certainly stand up to Patagonia in price. I am with Ron, I still have stuff from the 80's. I have never had a Patagonia item fail. I have worn them out (always years of use). It was expensive then and it is now. The difference is everyone else has raised their prices to match.
If you want to save a couple of dollars buy REI brand. Or Old Navy performance fleece.
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Mtnmun
Trad climber
Top of the Mountain Mun
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Sep 25, 2010 - 11:29am PT
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You get what you pay for. I sent in two pair of completely thrashed climbing pants and a jacket with a broken zipper for repair. I was sent back a gift card to replace all three at full retail. When you buy Patagonia you have a life time of wear. I'll pay extra for that.
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Matt M
Trad climber
Alamo City
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Sep 25, 2010 - 11:41am PT
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Meh - No different than a Tommy Bahama shirt and Patagonia probably has MUCH better industry practices than TB.
Climbing Hardware sales is probably one of the toughest sporting goods segments to be in. You make a LOW MARGIN product that's expected to last a long time, has very slow return purchasing ( you only buy a full rack once) and sell it to a community that traditionally prides itself on being extremely cheap. Not FUN.
Technical Softgood have had it good in the past 20 years or so. They went from selling only to climbers to have a much broader "non-technical" market. Now you have clientele who are on a much faster "re-purchase" schedule buying a much higher margin item. Not hard to see where the appeal in that is.
Marmot, MHW, RAB, Montbell etc etc. Even TNF (after a big fall off for a while). They all make good gear. Each company has a different design focus to some degree.
I started out as a Marmot guy. I liked their "version" of TNF Mountain Light jacket a bit more. The pockets and zippers seemed more thought out and they were using a newer version of Gore-Tex at the time. I still have that Jacket from 1994 or so.
As time went on I migrated to Patagonia because I liked their very simple designs. No excess pockets, zippers material etc etc. They tend to go with the less-is-more principle and I light that. Totally bomber. MHW on the other hand, seems to build their stuff like a TANK. Bomber but man it seems over the top. just my opinion of course.
Patagonia pricing is right in line with all the other major players. In fact, they source stuff from the same places Marmot, TNF etc get some of theirs.
Yeah, a $125 shirt is a LOT. But then again, so is a $125 harness, $275 rope or $175 shoes. Within reason, if you find value in said purchases, they are not over priced.
You want to see over priced for what you get, go browse the aisles in a Babies R Us! Jeebus it makes me mad every time I buy something there.
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TwistedCrank
climber
Ideeho-dee-do-dah-day boom-chicka-boom-chicka-boom
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Sep 25, 2010 - 01:51pm PT
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I got some first edition capilene macrostench zip tees. The dark blue ones. They're always the fist layer that goes on for a winter day in the hills. They're 25 years old and still going strong.
A couple of years ago I bought some late edition capilene with odor guard tip tees from the outlet mall in Dillon MT for "a reasonable price". Except the don't keep you warm line the macrostench editions do. Dislike!
Yeah Smartwool!
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jsj
climber
Boulder
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Sep 25, 2010 - 05:28pm PT
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I worked for Patagonia for a short period of time and through that experience some of my opinions have changed. Previously I thought: "Their clothes are just like those of any other outdoor clothing company but cost about twice as much retail." Since working for them that thought has not changed, but now I'd add a few things.
First, the company makes some good items and some crappy items. Usually the things that are crappy don't make it past two seasons before they're discontinued. The stuff that works sticks around season after season seeing only minor revisions and color changes. To a large extent, figuring out what will be popular and what will stand up to abuse is trial and error, and there's only so much that can be ironed out beforehand during design and testing. This is no different than any other company.
Second, and one thing that really sets Patagonia apart from other companies, is that they stand behind their products - even the stuff that falls apart. In our store it was understood that our goal was to make and keep customers for life, and if they had a problem with the performance of their clothing, we would do everything we could to make it right. In other words, if a customer is not satisfied Patagonia will repair items (without charge), replace them, try to find a better-suited piece (sometimes even swapping it out one-for-one even if the replacement is more expensive), or refund the cost. I was pretty amazed by this and it honestly made me proud to work for Patagonia. It was also a source of frustration when people would bring in their 20 year old Cap 1 underwear saying "it wore out" and we'd give them a brand new pair no questions asked. Enough repeat abuse of this policy by a single customer would lead to a conversation in an attempt to explain basic ideas like normal wear-and-tear and appropriate expectations, but generally speaking we would refrain from delivering the deserved ass-whooping to the guy who came in claiming that his down sweater was a piece of crap because he walked on it with his crampons and it got holes.
Finally, Patagonia makes it a priority to encourage responsible environmental stewardship. This is done through business practices, company-wide initiatives, giving to local, grass-roots organizations, through media and campaigns, and encouraging employees and customers alike to reduce, reuse, recycle. Nothing made me happier than when someone came in with an old item that had blown a zipper or developed a whole and they insisted on having it repaired instead of being replaced.
So no, the company isn't perfect. I have gripes about their athlete sponsorship programs and certain employee-related policies. I've returned stuff myself that has been total crap. And yeah, that Hawaiian shirt is ridiculously expensive and clearly priced for the yuppy. But even such, I think the company is definitely doing something right.
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k-man
Gym climber
SCruz
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Sep 25, 2010 - 07:20pm PT
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My Patagucci leather jock strap and matching sport bra have stood the test of whatever I could throw at them (or on/in them). Sure, the seams might be bustin' out, but heck, I got them at the outlet sale where they were marked 40% off after being marked down to the outlet price.
Sure, some folks will pay full price, I pity those fools. Wait, actually no. They got buckets of cash, so pity quite ain't the right word now. But I digress...
I got organic cotton tee's for $7 apiece. Was I wrong to buy the 'gucc? I also got an amazing R3 fleece for about $70. Wind-proof and warm as all get out. If I had a GF, I know she'd steal it from me. Right, those azzoles.
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Tom
Big Wall climber
San Luis Obispo CA
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Sep 25, 2010 - 09:03pm PT
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This "retro-X" fleece jacket is not even CLOSE to the pile jackets they used to sell. The odd-ball upper pocket and the exterior pile surface are both WRONG. And $199????? The simple sinchilla jacket is only $99, and the fabric is probably more expensive.
This is a shot of the Patagonia pile igloo pants I have. The interior is thick pile, and the exterior is a rather smooth (wale?) surface. This fabric had a tendency to "pill" on the surface after washing. The pile jackets were made from this exact same material.
I'll look on eBay to see if someone has one of the old gray or khaki ones from the '80's.
EDIT: GOOD GOD! $800 asking price!
Crazy eBay Listing
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drljefe
climber
Old Pueblo, AZ
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Sep 26, 2010 - 11:58am PT
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Technical stuff~ worth it.
Lifestyle wear~ whadda joke!
Iron Clad Guarantee~ bitchin'.
The Gooch debate ~ never ending.
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edejom
Boulder climber
Butte, America
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Sep 26, 2010 - 07:04pm PT
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Special Edition "transparent/translucent" down sweater:
$275--interesting concept.
Glad that we have an Outlet less than an hour away:-)
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Jingy
climber
Somewhere out there
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Sep 26, 2010 - 07:20pm PT
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Never have liked the pata-gear...
high priced.... and never heavy enough
but that's just me
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Ricky D
Trad climber
Sierra Westside
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Sep 26, 2010 - 07:22pm PT
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I gotta admit - Patagucci spins me both ways more times than not. On one hand, the threads I have bought from them hold up to more than a lot of abuse. Still have a couple of early '80's megastunkfunk capilenes and two or three Synchilla pullovers - my fav being the cool black one with neon turquoise trim ribbon.
However, over the past decade, their clothing has seemed to trend towards latte drinking cafe cruzers with a tendency to wear butt ugly printed shirts.
Yes...I know that whales have been saved and milk bottles recycled - but cripes man - however picks the colors and patterns must have been overly influenced by a 1958 J.C.Penney catalog.
And don't even get me started on the size thing. For twenty plus years, medium was a medium - now medium won't fit my ferret. A quick look at any of their catalogs over the past decade shows a clear deference towards nonathletic anorexic bonebags for models. Which is weird considering Yvon is built like a fire hydrant.
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