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MisterE
Social climber
Bouncy Tiggerville
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Topic Author's Original Post - Jul 6, 2010 - 01:38am PT
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Arnold wants to reduce the state workers minimum wage to $7.25 an hour.
Court OK's Reduction proposal
I know it is hard to keep your two-party sectarianism out of this issue, but please try to look beyond the reaction. This hurts all of us, on both sides.
Discuss.
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jstan
climber
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The last report I saw was from the State Comptroller saying the wages could not be reduced because the state's payroll computer could not do it. No more information than that.
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, Ca.
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that's not a bad living wage, dude.
just sayin'....
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Jaybro
Social climber
Wolf City, Wyoming
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they've been doing this every year for a while, then they pass a budget and the real wage is retroactive. Makes Ahnold feel Butch.
$7.25 isn't even a living wage in Camp 4....
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Chaz
Trad climber
greater Boss Angeles area
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If the State Controller signs his name on a check when he knows damn well there are insufficient funds to cover it, he needs to go to The Joint for a few years, the same as you or I would.
If he issues thousands of bad checks, perhaps a life term would be appropriate.
The State needs to learn to live within it's means, the same as you and I do.
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chellam
Trad climber
coimbatore,tamilnadu
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Not in our lifetime. Batteries can not store as much energy as gasoline in terms of space and weight. A full tank of fuel for my truck weighs 210 pounds and is good for about 450 miles. A bank of batteries capable of moving the same truck that distance would weigh 1500 pounds and fill most of the bed. Until battery technology drastically changes electric cars will be limited to local commuting.
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Brokedownclimber
Trad climber
Douglas, WY
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Are the people getting "entitlements" getting their checks reduced too?
If they are......
Look for riots in East LA and Watts!
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JEleazarian
Trad climber
Fresno CA
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The state workers I know are honest people caught in the middle of a crossfire between two sides that care more for ideological purity than for the welfare of the State of California. While AFSCME and SEIU certainly have some culpability in the budget mess, I don't see the state workers as any more or less of the problem than all of the rest of us.
Until we Californians can propose something different from "cut someone else's programs and raise someone else's taxes," we won't solve this mess. That means we need to look carefully, honestly and mercilessly at every item of spending and every tax (and tax break) to see if it is worth it. I personally believe that our extra-long prison sentences for drug crimes aren't worth the cost, as an example. I also question why we give tax breaks to any particular business (e.g., the motion picture industry, "green" technology, etc.)
We also need to look at how we spend our money for particular services, e.g. education. Do we really need as much administration as we currently have, and are we smart imposing one-size-fits-all from Sacramento?
Finally, we need a rational property tax that pays for absolutely essential local services such as education, fire and police, whose demand does not vary with the economy. I'm not sure how we do that. I know the arguments for the split roll, but that hardly ameliorates the unfairness of disparate tax bills depending upon when property was acquired. Throwing out Prop 13 (for which I voted, mea culpa), though, would kick untold numbers of people on fixed incomes out of their homes.
Tough problems, and no simple solutions. And yes, I voted for Arnold, and would do so again, given the same options available.
John
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Karl Baba
Trad climber
Yosemite, Ca
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Good ideas John
Prop 13 has become a sacred cow but it is also the root of the problem. I suggest revoking Prop 13 for businesses. Perhaps for individual dwellings, it could be grandfathered but bumped up a bit when the old owners die but pass the property off to kids. The problem is that Businesses never "die" but often have made separate corporations out of their property so the tax savings get passed on even if they sell the property to a different corporation. You can have two identical corporate properties, side by side and one pays vastly more. Ain't fair and hurts the state
Peace
karl
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dirtbag
climber
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The state workers I know are honest people caught in the middle of a crossfire between two sides that care more for ideological purity than for the welfare of the State of California. While AFSCME and SEIU certainly have some culpability in the budget mess, I don't see the state workers as any more or less of the problem than all of the rest of us.
Until we Californians can propose something different from "cut someone else's programs and raise someone else's taxes," we won't solve this mess. That means we need to look carefully, honestly and mercilessly at every item of spending and every tax (and tax break) to see if it is worth it. I personally believe that our extra-long prison sentences for drug crimes aren't worth the cost, as an example. I also question why we give tax breaks to any particular business (e.g., the motion picture industry, "green" technology, etc.)
We also need to look at how we spend our money for particular services, e.g. education. Do we really need as much administration as we currently have, and are we smart imposing one-size-fits-all from Sacramento?
Finally, we need a rational property tax that pays for absolutely essential local services such as education, fire and police, whose demand does not vary with the economy. I'm not sure how we do that. I know the arguments for the split roll, but that hardly ameliorates the unfairness of disparate tax bills depending upon when property was acquired. Throwing out Prop 13 (for which I voted, mea culpa), though, would kick untold numbers of people on fixed incomes out of their homes.
Tough problems, and no simple solutions. And yes, I voted for Arnold, and would do so again, given the same options available.
Damn John, great post.
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Delhi Dog
Trad climber
Good Question...
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"that's not a bad living wage, dude."
Do the math Blue.
That ain't a living wage...
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dirtbag
climber
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Especially in California.
It's a slap in the face.
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Chaz
Trad climber
greater Boss Angeles area
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I'd quit and find a different job if I were dis-respected like that.
Even the greeter at WalMart makes more than minimum wage.
I'll bet not one state employee quits as a result of this though. They've had all their self-respect beaten out of them apparently.
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Brokedownclimber
Trad climber
Douglas, WY
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The problem with a state like Cali is the "cradle-to-grave' Nanny-Statist approach to things. The people really need to consider electing some serious CPA types to the legislature and start cutting back on "non-essential" spending. Just how many "middle manager" types are really needed to be "administrating" things. How many services are really "essential?"
Folks here might ask how essential is Miles Standish up at CRSP, and the actual answer would piss off most people: he generates NON TAX REVENUE for the State of California. That's why we always have lots more "law enforcement" than we really seem to need. (See the thread by Clint!)
How is it that anytime the voters actually DO something by the initiative process, the Socialist Justices of the Supreme Court always nullify it. Answer: get a Governator that isn't a closet Socialist to appoint some better judicial minds.
By now you're all asking "what's a dumb hick from Wyoming doing commenting on our 'progressive' state of Cali?" Answer: I lived in Santa Cruz until 1976 and saw Cali politics first hand for 6 years while I lived there.
There seems to be a State Department of Everything. You name it, and the State seems to have an interest in it.
End of Diatribe!
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August West
Trad climber
Where the wind blows strange
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Did you vote for a grade "B" movie star as Governeator or not? Who did you vote for. Post up, admit it. Be Honest for once. The Terminator got a large slice of the popular vote. If you voted for him, you got what you asked for. "Hurray Democracy".
As if we had voted for the "other guy" things would somehow be magically better?
I voted to recall Davis, and I still stand by that decision. For his replacement, it was hard not to vote for the porn star, but I actually voted for the green candidate.
I don't see that the Terminator has been any worse than any of the others. Cali's political system is very dysfunctional. One politician can not turn it around. Especially with the 2/3 supermajority to raise taxes/pass a budget and all the ballot measures that fix most of the spending. And republicans whose entire vocabulary seems to be no. The state's constitution needs rewriting.
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apogee
climber
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"that's not a bad living wage, dude."
bluering, your ideologic ignorance is showing again.
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dirtbag
climber
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I don't see that the Terminator has been any worse than any of the others. Cali's political system is very dysfunctional. One politician can not turn it around. Especially with the 2/3 supermajority to raise taxes/pass a budget and all the ballot measures that fix most of the spending. And republicans whose entire vocabulary seems to be no. The state's constitution needs rewriting.
word
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HighDesertDJ
Trad climber
Arid-zona
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bluering said that's not a bad living wage, dude.
That's $15,000 a year full time. That's not a bad living wage for someone living at their parent's house, maybe.
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Brokedownclimber
Trad climber
Douglas, WY
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The main proble with "raising taxes" is the political pressure from all the special interest groups to give THEM more of the benefits. As long as there are politicians, the problems remain.
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Splater
climber
Grey Matter
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quote: "Throwing out Prop 13 (for which I voted, mea culpa), though, would kick untold numbers of people on fixed incomes out of their homes."
No it wouldn't.
That is the myth of prop 13.
They can either get a roommate, a reverse mortgage or a loan from their heirs, or buck up just like ordinary taxpayers elsewhere who don't have special loopholes.
Or maybe they would like to move now, but have held onto that old house just because of the warping incentive of the tax loophole.
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