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hamish f
Social climber
squamish
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Jun 14, 2012 - 12:06pm PT
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Just so we have it straight:
We don't want a gondola because it won't make money and it'll rust away on the hillside.
We don't want a gondola because it will make money and noone should be able to profit within a class A Park; well, except climbing guides.
We believe it's not a Squamish topic but one for all residents of B.C. and everyone in the Province should have an equal voice.
We've seen the numbers and they aren't very substantial at all, so we'd like to throw away the voting process.
Hmmmmm.
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Ghost
climber
A long way from where I started
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Jun 14, 2012 - 12:18pm PT
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Hamish, you forgot the most important reason of all:
"Because the bible says so!"
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hamish f
Social climber
squamish
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Jun 14, 2012 - 12:32pm PT
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Oh ya., leasing an easement through the Park. Yes, that is a bummer; I think we all agree on that. But perhaps we will all benefit in the long run if the development works out and we gain another Park up top, the Shannon Basin Park, as I mentioned in post 202, Apr.03.
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Mighty Hiker
climber
Vancouver, B.C.
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Jun 14, 2012 - 01:21pm PT
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HF, you've forgotten that:
a) FOSC has been quite clear that it doesn't oppose a gondola on Goat Ridge, which if anything appears to be a superior location. We've never said we're opposed to a gondola, period.
b) The government as well as citizens is obliged to comply with the law, and it hasn't. That law requires an open process, independent review, thorough consideration of alternatives, and publishing information about the process and documents on BC Parks' website.
Remember that the rule of law is a cornerstone of every liberal democracy. The government has to play by the rules, too.
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hamish f
Social climber
squamish
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Jun 14, 2012 - 02:37pm PT
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I haven't forgotten anything. I'd much rather see the gondola to the west of town, so as to force the tourists toward downtown. You may have a nicer spot in mind a few klicks to the south but are you going to raise the difference in construction costs?
As far as a see-through, translucent, transparent, public process goes, I don't see the developers have failed in that area. Sure, they haven't installed a kiosk halfway up the Chief trail with a complaint box but they were at this, in a public manner, eight months before you decided to get involved.
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Todd Eastman
climber
Bellingham, WA
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Jun 14, 2012 - 02:52pm PT
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The developers presented their plans locally in Squamish and Britannia Beach, but with both BC Crown Land and BC Parks also players in the project, a more extensive public process might be warranted.
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hamish f
Social climber
squamish
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Jun 14, 2012 - 02:55pm PT
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And this would affect the outcome in which way exactly?
I suppose they could've presented their proposal in Pemberton and Port Moody, or Whistler and West Vancouver, or Port McNiel and Quesnel. Where do you draw the line? Terrace?
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Mighty Hiker
climber
Vancouver, B.C.
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Jun 14, 2012 - 02:59pm PT
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Consulting with existing users of one of the most heavily-used provincial parks, just for starters. Why wouldn't BC Parks have a booth at the base for several weekends, presenting objective information about the proposal (in context of the requirements of the policy), and requesting comments? Better still, at the first summit, from which hikers and climbers can see what's proposed?
Sorry, a local, fragmented, captive process only embarrasses the government and Squamish. If they think the proposal is so great, be truly public about it.
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Tricouni
Mountain climber
Vancouver
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Jun 14, 2012 - 03:14pm PT
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As far as a see-through, translucent, transparent, public process goes, I don't see the developers have failed in that area. Sure, they haven't installed a kiosk halfway up the Chief trail with a complaint box but they were at this, in a public manner, eight months before you decided to get involved.
The developers are free to present whatever proposals they want, when they want, and where they want. I have no real problems with the developers. The point is that the law requires that PARKS have an open, transparent process, and they've failed miserably to do so.
I've requested the environmental impact statement prepared by the developers from both the developers and parks. The developers haven't answered me (their choice, fair enough) and Parks hasn't supplied it, either.
So, Hamish, how can I make an unbiased decision as to what impact the thing will have on the park without this data? Or do you feel that I have no right to the data? Or do you feel that I should just trust parks and proposers to do the right thing?
Glenn
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hamish f
Social climber
squamish
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Jun 14, 2012 - 03:15pm PT
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Fast forward to your little shelter up on the south summit staffed with someone to point out where you'd see the gondola travelling. Sure, there will be x amount of people that can't stand the thought of a gondola being in their viewscape, even though they're looking down on the local autobahn. But aside from that overly-pickey group, what is really going to be solved? The colour of the gondola cars? I believe Tami offerred to paint all sorts of rats and various other wildlife scenes on the outsides of the gondola cars. It'll be the Wild Kingdom in motion.
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Mighty Hiker
climber
Vancouver, B.C.
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Jun 14, 2012 - 03:20pm PT
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Will there be banana slugs painted on the trams? Maybe some old growth devil's club?
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hamish f
Social climber
squamish
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Jun 14, 2012 - 03:31pm PT
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O.k. Glenn, fair enough. But why exactly do you need to make a decision regarding the impact to the Park? Yesterday you were saying it's not a popularity contest and it shouldn't be a matter of who votes which way.
I'm not sure about the legalities of Parks handing out environmental impact reports to every Joe Public that asks for one but it wouldn't surprise me if it's like so many avenues of the Gov't.... complicated. These Parks guys have a lot of work to do, and a lot of coffee to drink. Then there's making the coffee, that takes time...
Anders,I'm sure Tami will paint most anything you fancy on there, as long as she gets to submit an invoice.
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Mighty Hiker
climber
Vancouver, B.C.
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Jun 14, 2012 - 03:37pm PT
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The government's policy requires that the environmental impact statement be posted to the B.C. Parks' website. At least as of yesterday, it hadn't been. Although the statement relates only to the strip of land that would be taken from the Park, and impacts on it - there's no overall assessment of the impacts on the Park and area, as you'd expect.
http://www.env.gov.bc.ca/bcparks/planning/bound_adj_policy.html
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hamish f
Social climber
squamish
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Jun 14, 2012 - 03:51pm PT
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Obviously a rainy day on the coast.
Let's see, environmental impact on a strip of sidehill brought on by a gondola. We better get a study on that. Well we'll have quite a few stumps, some grease drippings around the tower bases, some pads made from re-bar and concrete, and there must be more, I'm sure. As the gondola cabins won't come with built in bathrooms, I can't see any sewage related impacts. Best do a study.
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RyanD
climber
Squamish
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Jun 14, 2012 - 05:21pm PT
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Sounds like someone is missing their special Kay.
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hamish f
Social climber
squamish
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Jun 14, 2012 - 05:41pm PT
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Agreed; it's like his laptop short circuited. That or he's off climbing.
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Hoser
climber
vancouver
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Jun 14, 2012 - 06:42pm PT
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So if its jobs for the locals, would you be paying me to be going to this brothel then ? Otherwise I dont get it, would it be some form of punishment?
Kinda works with the current gondola plan though, you know a crappy idea based on how things work in high priced cities.
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hamish f
Social climber
squamish
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Jun 14, 2012 - 06:46pm PT
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Ouchy.
Wasn't it Bruce MacDonald that wanted to put your brothel up at the top of the gondola? You two need to collaborate on a location.
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YesToCarrots
climber
Squamish, BC
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Jun 14, 2012 - 06:57pm PT
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Wasn't it Bruce MacDonald that wanted to put your brothel up at the top of the gondola? You two need to collaborate on a location.
Now you're getting somewhere, feasibility-wise. But how will you reconcile this with the delicate sensibilities of small children, old people, disabled people, overweight people, less-than-toned people, etc. etc.? After all, this is the demographic to which the nice man in charge is supposed to be pitching.
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Hoser
climber
vancouver
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Jun 14, 2012 - 07:05pm PT
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Besides the children I think you just illustrated a typical brothel clientele
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