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Gene
climber
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Jan 26, 2012 - 06:45pm PT
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Philo,
Certified Torre?
Typos happen. Dude may not be a native English speaker. I don't know. But harping on a person/post when the context is clear adds nothing to the discussion but only increases animosity.
Peace,
g
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Kimbo
Trad climber
seattle
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Jan 26, 2012 - 06:47pm PT
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@ philo:
iPhone autofill.
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Gene
climber
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Jan 26, 2012 - 06:52pm PT
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Philo,
Lighting up 48 minutes early :) Just reacting cuz you tweaked another for an English booboo.
g
Feeling better now. Thanks!
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philo
Trad climber
Somewhere halfway over the rainbow
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Jan 26, 2012 - 06:53pm PT
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g
:)
p
me too, I groc ya.
Fats
( . Y . )
Keep posts on topic and quit spreading your rhetoric and provocation everywhere. You're desperate. No one cares.
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Kimbo
Trad climber
seattle
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Jan 26, 2012 - 07:07pm PT
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and, to further previous thoughts:
the idea of presenting oneself with a challenge can certainly be an admirable aim, and no doubt a boltless ethic furthers this.
but who's domain is this type of sublimative contrivance?
historically, that of the idle class, the bourgeoisie.
anything that would increase participation of the proletariat would truly be the path of the revolutionary vanguard, as opposed to the fetishized and discriminatory pseudo-ethics of the statist counter-revolutionaries imposing their will in a quite arbitrary fashion (read: k&K and their 5 additional bolts ).
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bhilden
Trad climber
Mountain View, CA
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Jan 26, 2012 - 07:52pm PT
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What I find interesting about this thread is that everyone has become so entrenched in defending their own opinion about the affair that when the protagonists publish their account of what happened and why they did it there is very little discussion, if any, about what they wrote.
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nature
climber
Aridzona for now Denver.... here I come...
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Jan 26, 2012 - 07:58pm PT
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bhilden - was just about to respond cuz I just finished reading it.
and after reading it - more props to these young men.
and yeah, what thread is this. I actually had to scroll up to figure out this wasn't a political thread. whodathunk considering how much of a dick fatty is being.... ahhhhgain...
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Toker Villain
Big Wall climber
Toquerville, Utah
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Jan 26, 2012 - 08:14pm PT
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It is really just an argument over whether climbing is art or sport.
The problem is that it can be both or either.
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Gene
climber
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Jan 26, 2012 - 08:31pm PT
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What happened to the vole bashies?
They were volecanized and turned into climbing shoe rubber.
g
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Hardman Knott
Gym climber
Muir Woods National Monument, Mill Valley, Ca
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Jan 26, 2012 - 09:02pm PT
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Please keep the politard nonsense out of this thread.
It is excruciatingly boring (as always), and extraordinarily irrelevant to the discussion.
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nature
climber
Aridzona for now Denver.... here I come...
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Jan 26, 2012 - 09:11pm PT
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They were volecanized and turned into climbing shoe rubber.
locker has a new product?!?!?!
I'm SO In!
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Mighty Hiker
climber
Vancouver, B.C.
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Jan 26, 2012 - 11:18pm PT
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I wonder what donini will have to say abou all this? Is he off fishing, or?
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nature
climber
Aridzona for now Denver.... here I come...
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Jan 26, 2012 - 11:42pm PT
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to be fair the cables were put in by "fair means".
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Kimbo
Trad climber
seattle
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Jan 26, 2012 - 11:49pm PT
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//Please keep the politard nonsense out of this thread. //
i would suggest that the entire thread is inherently political, from its initial post to the present.
i would also suggest, to continue with the overt political aspects, that everyone who harbors strong feelings let those feelings be known to the companies that sponsor the two climbers in question (whether you are for or against their actions).
instead of simply wallowing in the effete bathos that online forums can at times sink into, letting the companies know your feelings allows every poster here to engage in the political process (direct action), thereby affecting the course of history (involvement in the vanguard).
surely if the companies sponsoring (financially supporting) climbers draw lines in the sand regarding said companies' expectations regarding the behaviour of their climbers, those climbers will engage in perhaps a little more self-reflection when contemplating their next vanguard action.
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mika
Big Wall climber
Zurich, switzerland
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Jan 27, 2012 - 05:44am PT
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Well enzolino,
When I climbed Torre by the compressor route in 1991, I was at first not quite happy with the large bolt traverse, but due to a lot of falling ice blocks it came in handy to get out of the sun as fast as possible. The bolt traverse leaded to the shade and came in handy. The bolt ladder leading to the top of the Icetower was strange indeed, for the most obvious climbing would have been between the Icetower and Torre itself, but many bolts were under the ice. At the headwall many of the bolts were also under the ice so it was nice to clip one after a longer section of thin ice. The compressor was handy to stand on, because in the headwall there was not much to stand on. All in all, definetly not a ferrata, but that depended much on the conditions, wind snow and ice. In perfect conditions defenity sections with too many bolts. And with global warming we are mooving towards better conditions. And at the belaypoints from Maestri hauling the compressor, gasoline etc. many bolts in strange places, but makes sense if one is hauling 1000+ kg.
Not to forget is that the compressor route was established in a time were no friends and other modern climbing gizmo or the two bolt choppers, had been born jet.
In a democratic way the climbers came to the strange result not to chopp the climb. So what we see today is the result of a climbing Ghadhafi i.e. Kennedy and a climbing Sadam Hussein i.e. Kruk who do not care about democracy. So why dont the move to Syria.
mike
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enzolino
climber
Galgenen, Switzerland
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Jan 27, 2012 - 06:06am PT
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Well enzolino,
When I climbed Torre by the compressor route in 1991, I was at first not quite happy with the large bolt traverse, but due to a lot of falling ice blocks it came in handy to get out of the sun as fast as possible. The bolt traverse leaded to the shade and came in handy. The bolt ladder leading to the top of the Icetower was strange indeed, for the most obvious climbing would have been between the Icetower and Torre itself, but many bolts were under the ice. At the headwall many of the bolts were also under the ice so it was nice to clip one after a longer section of thin ice. The compressor was handy to stand on, because in the headwall there was not much to stand on. All in all, definetly not a ferrata, but that depended much on the conditions, wind snow and ice. In perfect conditions defenity sections with too many bolts. And with global warming we are mooving towards better conditions. And at the belaypoints from Maestri hauling the compressor, gasoline etc. many bolts in strange places, but makes sense if one is hauling 1000+ kg.
Not to forget is that the compressor route was established in a time were no friends and other modern climbing gizmo or the two bolt choppers, had been born jet.
In a democratic way the climbers came to the strange result not to chopp the climb. So what we see today is the result of a climbing Ghadhafi i.e. Kennedy and a climbing Sadam Hussein i.e. Kruk who do care about democracy. So why dont the move to Syria.
mike Thanks Mike,
great post!
I wonder what some K&K supporter would think about your "climbing_Gheddafi_Kennedy" and "climbing_Hussein_Kruk" association ... :-)))
You raised a good point.
One is the hauling of the compressor+fuel+all_the_rest.
Another fact, which is often overlooked, is the Maestri's first attempt in the austral winter in 1970 with the compressor, when they stayed 54 days on the wall! And to haul up such a compressor, in winter, on Cerro Torre I think is a challenge within the challenge.
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jaaan
Trad climber
Chamonix, France
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Jan 27, 2012 - 06:24am PT
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And to haul up such a compressor, in winter, on Cerro Torre I think is a challenge within the challenge.
And to get it started every day. Hell, my car won't start once it drops under freezing.
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Drugo Lebowsky
Ice climber
Treviso
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Jan 27, 2012 - 06:52am PT
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cambia macchina!
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healyje
Trad climber
Portland, Oregon
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Jan 27, 2012 - 07:41am PT
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One is the hauling of the compressor+fuel+all_the_rest.
...
And to haul up such a compressor, in winter, on Cerro Torre I think is a challenge within the challenge.
It's not a 'challenge' - the length of time, the sheer amount of material to be hauled, and the subsequent bolt clusters to do it were all an indicator of just how ridiculously ill-advised the whole venture was in practice, let alone in concept.
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