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John Moosie
climber
Beautiful California
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Sep 28, 2011 - 03:54pm PT
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I added this edit above..
My friend Darren Bohan lost his life on 9/11. Should he have lost his life because he decided to become an accountant?
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Bob D'A
Trad climber
Taos, NM
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Sep 28, 2011 - 03:56pm PT
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In Fat, Lois, bookworm and Crack world it's the teachers, police, fireman, mailman, factory worker, restaurant worker, street cleaner, trash man, mechanic, factory worker, union worker and baby boomers who are the problem not the hedge fund managers, bankers or corporations.
Pretty sick in the head when you think about it.
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Degaine
climber
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Sep 28, 2011 - 04:02pm PT
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LEB wrote:
It is like you are saying the individual has nothing to do with it.
And it's like you are saying that all you have to do is work hard to succeed.
LEB wrote:
Of course, it was a bit easier for me because I was lucky enough to have parents who paid for me to go to college.
Bingo. So you agree that no one does it on their own. Not even the smartest, hardest working, richest of the rich. At some point they were helped by others.
LEB wrote:
It is a combination of favorable circumstances AND personal effort.
Please point to where anyone, even Karl, has stated the contrary.
LEB wrote:
You sound like you believe everyone was born with a silver spoon in his or her mouth.
Please point to where Karl or any one else stated this.
LEB wrote:
Don't we make choices? Don't we have any role in our prosperity?
Of course we do. I however find it ironic that individuals on the right, even from this very forum, were lauding on and on in the 2003-2007 period about the greatness of the American worker, his/her skills, how hard he/she worked, and the superiority of the American economy back when unemployment was even below what the US economy needed to continue humming along.
Yet now all of a sudden, when these very same people are out of work, they're somehow deadbeats who apparently don't know what it takes to work hard.
Why is that?
And those companies who made a fortune off the backs of those very same people, in many cases by committing fraud (read companies like Goldman Sachs or Magnétar to name two of many) got off scott free, and somehow succeed in convincing people like you that the person without at job is a deadbeat who's looking for a free handout.
Again, why is that?
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John Moosie
climber
Beautiful California
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Sep 28, 2011 - 04:05pm PT
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Thank you Degaine. I started to lose my head there for a minute but your wise post helped me regain my center.
Thanks man..
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Bob D'A
Trad climber
Taos, NM
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Sep 28, 2011 - 04:06pm PT
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Where is the Bush stimulus money??
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John Moosie
climber
Beautiful California
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Sep 28, 2011 - 04:08pm PT
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You're looking for fairness and equitably, it never happens,
What a sad way to look at life.
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HighTraverse
Trad climber
Bay Area
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Sep 28, 2011 - 04:08pm PT
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LEB
you said nothing in reply to my two direct questions to you.
I rest my case.
I didn't claim Huffpost is impartial. However, that article is pretty straightforward reporting. Perhaps you have a hard time understanding what you read. Or do you just have a problem with liberal political actions being reported?'
Moosie: well said!
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Bob D'A
Trad climber
Taos, NM
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Sep 28, 2011 - 04:17pm PT
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Fat wrote: Some do rise to the top with zero help, I'll just name two that pop in my head:
Colin Powell - Parents were sharecroppers
Clarence Thomas - Parents were janitors
Bullsh#t, both of those people benefits in some way from the government.
Especially Thomas and his wife, both should be in jail.
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John Moosie
climber
Beautiful California
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Sep 28, 2011 - 04:18pm PT
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Some do rise to the top with zero help, I'll just name two that pop in my head:
Colin Powell - Parents were sharecroppers
He started his education in public schools. You want to close those schools.
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Degaine
climber
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Sep 28, 2011 - 04:25pm PT
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fattrad wrote:
Degaine,
Some do rise to the top with zero help, I'll just name two that pop in my head:
Colin Powell - Parents were sharecroppers
Clarence Thomas - Parents were janitors
No one to care for them as newborns? No teachers to teach them? No roof over their head or anyone to feed them?
You don't think at some point some officer took Powell under their wing?
No one does it on their own. No one.
Anyone who says otherwise will also likely try to sell you ocean front property in Arizona.
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Bob D'A
Trad climber
Taos, NM
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Sep 28, 2011 - 04:25pm PT
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Fat wrote: Those people just don't understand what Wall St. does.
Coming from a guy who lives in some one basement. Hilarious!
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Degaine
climber
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Sep 28, 2011 - 04:27pm PT
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Hey John,
I'm flattered and it's nothin'.
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John Moosie
climber
Beautiful California
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Sep 28, 2011 - 04:27pm PT
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Colin Powell - Parents were sharecroppers
He was born in Harlem. Lot of crops grown in Harlem?
The teachers union is out of balance. Your solution is to gut schools by creating a voucher program instead of finding a way to balance the unions.
One problem with how powerful that union has gotten is that it is difficult to fire poor teachers. You have to go to court and the union knows that you wont because it would hurt the county financially. So they don't take the risk.
We have created a system where a county has to go up against a state wide entity. What we could do to help balance that is start a state sponsored fund that counties could apply to when they want to get rid of a lousy teacher.
Do that enough times and the union would stop protecting poor teachers.
But no.. you would rather try to destroy the union or destroy the school system with vouchers.
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apogee
climber
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Sep 28, 2011 - 04:29pm PT
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"so LEB I've got a direct question for you. Why don't you ever debate my direct challenges to what you say?"
Because Lois is like most of the other Repug-droids here on ST- little/no attempts at actual dialogue, &/or diversion, &/or ad hominems. Lois is somewhat less guilty of this than most, I'd have to say.
In any case, that's just the way they are. Best advice: if you are looking for a shallow-minded, yet entertaining rant-fest, choose those guys. If you're looking for an engaging discussion, avoid them, and choose the others. Both the Repug-droids and the rational Repubs have their place- as long as your expectations are aligned, it's all good. Works for me, anyway.
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Bob D'A
Trad climber
Taos, NM
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Sep 28, 2011 - 04:30pm PT
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Fat...Thomas was raised by his grandparents...his father left the family when he was two.
How did Thomas pay to go Yale law school?
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Bob D'A
Trad climber
Taos, NM
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Sep 28, 2011 - 04:32pm PT
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fat..you really are a dumb fuk...Colin Powell...The son of Jamaican immigrants Luther and Maud Powell, Colin was raised in the South Bronx.
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Bob D'A
Trad climber
Taos, NM
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Sep 28, 2011 - 04:36pm PT
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Where is the Bush stimulus money???
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John Moosie
climber
Beautiful California
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Sep 28, 2011 - 04:39pm PT
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I couldn't care less if you got the parents mixed up.
the fact that you want to gut our school system with a voucher program simply because the unions are out of balance is the real problem.
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apogee
climber
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Sep 28, 2011 - 04:43pm PT
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The Truth-O-Meter Says:
Perry: "The first round of stimulus ... it created zero jobs."
Rick Perry on Monday, September 12th, 2011 in the CNN-Tea Party Express debate
Rick Perry says the 2009 stimulus 'created zero jobs'
Pants on Fire!
Texas Gov. Rick Perry criticized President Barack Obama's new jobs plan during a Republican presidential debate Sept. 12, 2011, saying his previous effort "created zero jobs."
WOLF BLITZER: "Gov. Perry, the president in his new plan has a lot of tax cuts, payroll tax cuts, middle-class tax cuts, tax credits for hiring veterans, tax credits for hiring long-term unemployed people. Are those things you would support?"
RICK PERRY: "And he's going to pay for them all with raising your taxes. That is the issue. He had $800 billion worth of stimulus in the first round of stimulus. It created zero jobs, $400-plus billion dollars in this package. And I can do the math on that one. Half of zero jobs is going to be zero jobs."
PolitiFact has regularly checked job claims about the American Recovery and Reinvestment Act of 2009, so this one caught our ears.
Zero?
Republican Sen. Scott Brown of Massachusetts said in February 2010 that the stimulus bill "didn't create one new job." He earned a Pants on Fire.
Florida Republican Gov. Rick Scott said in September 2010 during his successful campaign for governor that the stimulus bill had "not created one private sector job." We smelled smoke. (We even found Billy Weston, a Florida Republican who personally credited the stimulus for his new job with a private Riviera Beach pharmaceutical manufacturer.)
So, what's the evidence?
The White House has posted on its stimulus website a listing of jobs funded by the stimulus, breaking it down by state and congressional district. Just for the quarter April 1 to June 20, 2011, the country had a reported 555,029 full-time equivalent jobs funded by the Recovery Act.
As our colleagues at PolitiFact Virginia have pointed out, in a report released March 18, 2011, the president’s Council of Economic Advisers estimated that between 2.5 million and 3.6 million jobs were created or saved by the stimulus through the fourth quarter of 2010.
Separately, the council’s report cited four independent analyses by the Congressional Budget Office and three private economic analysis companies. Here’s what the groups found:
• CBO: Between 1.3 million and 3.6 million jobs saved or created.
• IHS/Global Insight: 2.45 million jobs saved or created.
• Macroeconomic Advisers: 2.3 million jobs saved or created.
• Moody’s Economy.com: 2.5 million jobs saved or created.
Note the language "created or saved," which means not every one of those more than a million jobs count as "created," as Perry said.
But certainly more than zero. Ask Billy Weston.
Perry said "the first round of stimulus ... created zero jobs." We say Pants on Fire.
http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/statements/2011/sep/12/rick-perry/rick-perry-says-2009-stimulus-created-zero-jobs/
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John Moosie
climber
Beautiful California
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Sep 28, 2011 - 04:45pm PT
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PANTS OF FIRE !!!!
hahaha.. good one Apogee.
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