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Wade Icey
Trad climber
www.alohashirtrescue.com
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Oct 18, 2013 - 03:11pm PT
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Damn them Big Oil selfish Corporations. Doing absolutely nothing to find then implement viable and affordable solutions to the energy issue.
Not one frkn bit.
bullseye
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raymond phule
climber
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Oct 18, 2013 - 03:38pm PT
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Wonder how he figures that, since all the work done to clean USA air, unleaded gas etc etc hasnt been a blip on a graph for three decades of effort.
That one again... Why should unleaded gas result in less CO2 release than leaded gas?
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dave729
Trad climber
Western America
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Oct 18, 2013 - 04:32pm PT
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animal cruelty is against the law and should get the president 6mos and $10k fine for every animal that suffered.
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BASE104
Social climber
An Oil Field
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Oct 18, 2013 - 04:41pm PT
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We are finally using less oil. This is a for real affect of the higher mileage of the newer generations of vehicles. It is working. Even SUV's are getting pretty good mileage now.
I saw something pretty cool. I visited a small oil company in Kansas yesterday, and he bought a used windmill that was rebuilt and installed to run his office building.
It was a big sucker, about 100 feet high. He said it is about a wash on the economics, but even a wash reduces his coal fueled electricity use. He said that the electricity that he sells back to the grid is a fraction of what he pays THEM for the same amount of power. That is kind of a rip off, selling your excess back to the grid.
We had a chat about Sweden, where my son is going to school, and a place he had visited. They are big bicycle riders and can't believe that every member of a typical U.S. family owns their own car.
We really have turned into a gigantic consumer society. We could get by fine with less of nigh everything. Global Warming, population growth, emerging nations...we face a lot of problems as a species. If you have been watching politics, you can see how we are still a very tribal species.
We have a very hard time getting together and committing altruism as a common virtue. You can look at the greenest Americans, and they use more than a person from Bangladesh. It isn't all about poverty, either. We are tribal first, meaning that we break into groups who don't like each other, despite no real differences, and we are incapable of altruism on any meaningful scale.
Solution?
I have no idea. The only way that the human race will change is to get our asses stomped by something. Then we may begin to cooperate.
I'm no better than others. I just see a spade and call it a spade.
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rick sumner
Trad climber
reno, nevada/ wasilla alaska
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Oct 18, 2013 - 06:38pm PT
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Yes, you're right Base about tribalism and consumerism being two big problems with our current society, or lack thereof. People equate status ( social stratification) with conspicuous consumption. It's really quite disgusting. Ed keeps pushing a carbon tax and seems quite fixated on that and only that. Instead, a broad based tax on consumption combined with elimination or reduction of the income tax would have the effect of slowly turning the collective psyche away from rampant consumerism and more towards savings, which is in effect conservation. I think you missed the huge reduction of pollutants, and massive co2 reductions, achieved from the ongoing transition from coal to NG for power generation. Many commercial vehicle fleets are also transitioning from petrol to NG.
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monolith
climber
SF bay area
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Oct 19, 2013 - 11:04am PT
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Why would you say that Chief?
Are you still having problems with how averages work?
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Wade Icey
Trad climber
www.alohashirtrescue.com
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Oct 19, 2013 - 11:29am PT
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Wade Icey
Trad climber
www.alohashirtrescue.com
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Oct 19, 2013 - 11:39am PT
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nature
climber
Boulder, CO
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Oct 19, 2013 - 11:46am PT
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I was at a party last night with a lot of brilliant minds. movie directors, publishers... mostly these folks work on documentaries and part of the discussion was on GCC and ocean acidification. I contrast that discussion with the arguments that people like The Chuff are making and I just laugh.
The deniers will be insignificant soon enough.
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rick sumner
Trad climber
reno, nevada/ wasilla alaska
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Oct 19, 2013 - 12:59pm PT
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Mentalcase are those graphs all the better the global hysteria industry could do with 80 billion dollars of public money just since 2008? With that kind of cash why have they allowed five severe European winters in a row, the arctic ice cap to rebound, the latest ever measured start to spring in mid to high latitudes, 100,000;s of livestock deaths from hypothermia, cold temp records outpacing hot temp records nearly 2 to 1, the near cessation of twister turnings, the absolute absence of hurricanes, the torrential endings of droughts in one supposed permanent drought area after the other, an unusually low forest fire incident year, and this is largely in America. The rest of the globe is likewise acting counter to the CAGW hypothesis. Eighty billion dollars to manipulate data, what a waste, with that kind of cash they should have engineered conforming weather. Then you guys wouldn't have had to rollout phony graphs and sketchy papers interpreting mechanisms and trends, one after the other, to try to convince an ever shrinking audience of your hypothesis' relevance. Show results not paper.
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rottingjohnny
Sport climber
mammoth lakes ca
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Oct 19, 2013 - 01:16pm PT
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Rick...I liked the pictures of the houses you built but you ripped those off from the Pimp this House web site..Nice try...
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rick sumner
Trad climber
reno, nevada/ wasilla alaska
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Oct 19, 2013 - 01:43pm PT
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What the hell are you talking about oh rotten one. I've never posted any pictures of the hundreds of homes I've built or pictures of anything to do with my business. This thread is about AGW not home building.
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mechrist
Gym climber
South of Heaven
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Oct 19, 2013 - 02:51pm PT
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Wow, chuffer can't even read the graphs he posts. Seriously, I have a hard time believing ANYONE could be that stupid, even chuff nuts.
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rick sumner
Trad climber
reno, nevada/ wasilla alaska
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Oct 19, 2013 - 03:50pm PT
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Well Edward, first off CO2 should be taken off the pollutant list since it's efficacy as an atmospheric trap for IR doesn't work nearly as neatly as in the lab considering the multitudes of negative feedbacks, considered, unconsidered, unknown, that affect the real world. Earth is not Venus, nor could ever become in time scales less than geologic, since we are not subject to 60-70 % more solar radiation, have no where near the level of volcanism, have a very active water cycle that scrubs the atmosphere unlike Venus which never had oceans, have a major satellite, have a rapid rotation rate with a variable axial tilt which provides seasons, don't have a day length approaching year length, and because of all the above will never have an atmosphere of the density of Venus ( 92 X earth pressure). Atmospheric density, proximity to Sol, and extent of a water cycle have a much higher role in greenhouse conditions than the content of it's chemistry. So let's take this extreme scenario off the table along with anything else other than the reality of observation that points to a total rise of no more than 2 degrees. Along with this, let's get rid of your short sighted carbon tax as a remedy for an imagined problem that simply does not exist.
The above being said, let's get into the real problem of rampant consumerism psyche. The carrot of a consumption tax coupled with elimination of the punitive income tax is the most effective way to promote conservation. By conservation I am not talking about the extreme green vision but more in line with that espoused by Teddy Roosevelt. A very broad based consumption tax (sales tax)would encourage savings and responsibility for ones old age rather than borrowing from tomorrow to expend today, both monies and raw resources. Your carbon tax would only invite consumption bubbles in other realms you have not even imagined yet. And what is the reason for it anyway? Do you imagine that scientists that helped implement it through the CAGW farce would get a continuing and expanding cut of the pie in perpetuity? If so you are sadly mistaken. Science will never be allowed a coequal seat at the big government table, it is just a means to it's self serving ends and when the means becomes an inconvenience rather than a resource to be used for gaining more power would be shuffled to the sidelines if not defunded altogether.
Housing space heating and cooling efficiency, lighting, and appliance energy use has come a long ways in the last quarter century. Most states have adopted energy efficiency standards (BEE's) as the technologies have matured. The average home of today uses 60% less energy per Sq. Ft. than 25 years ago by some estimates. This adds up to a lot of consumption deferred since residential use is about 25% of the total usage. Up here in the great white north we pay great attention to sealing the buildings interior air/vapor barrier to as close as possible air tightness then mechanically ventilate via heat/air exchangers in balance to achieve the proscribed air changes per hour. We also superinsulate compared to the standard of the lower 48.
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mechrist
Gym climber
South of Heaven
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Oct 19, 2013 - 03:57pm PT
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This here is Jim Hansens write in 1999
Wow, fuking genius!
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mechrist
Gym climber
South of Heaven
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Oct 19, 2013 - 04:04pm PT
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You don't even know what you are showing, just regurgitation steven goddard's vomit. hahahahaaaa....
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mechrist
Gym climber
South of Heaven
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Oct 19, 2013 - 04:44pm PT
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You know that urban heat island you deniers thought was the answer to all your prayers? Before ya'll desperately latched onto sun spots, before any of you had even heard of Milankovitch cycles, and before your main emphasis turned to the presumed "failure" of model predictions. Kinda backfired on your stupid asses, now didn't it?
(1) incorporation of corrections for time-of-observation bias and station history adjustments in the United States based on Easterling et al. [1996a], (2) reclassification of rural, small-town, and urban stations in the United States, southern Canada, and northern Mexico based on satellite measurements of night light intensity [Imhoff et al., 1997], and (3) a more flexible urban adjustment than that employed by Hansen et al. [1999], including reliance on only unlit stations in the United States and rural stations in the rest of the world for determining long-term trends.
Knock yourself out, fuking idiot.
http://pubs.giss.nasa.gov/docs/2001/2001_Hansen_etal.pdf
(p.s. I know everything there is to know about submarines because I saw a picture once... derp!)
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mechrist
Gym climber
South of Heaven
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Oct 19, 2013 - 04:56pm PT
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dumbest fuk 3v4r
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