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k-man
Gym climber
SCruz
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Sep 23, 2010 - 05:58pm PT
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"Both the U.S. and U.K governments have declassified reports on unidentified objects."
Indeed, this is recent. The Mexican incident was in 2004, before the US and UK declassified much.
So why so quick to call 120 military personnel "crazy?"
Keep watching the news. It's my belief that you will see more reports being declassified.
Take a look at the UFO book I linked to. There's some pretty amazing stuff in that book. Oh, but that's right, anybody who sees something they cannot explain must be crazy. I forgot.
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graniteclimber
Trad climber
Nowhere
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Sep 23, 2010 - 06:25pm PT
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Oh, but that's right, anybody who sees something they cannot explain must be crazy. I forgot.
No, people see things that they cannot explain all the time, but not everyone concocts crazy, illogical explanations in an attempt to explain them.
Is this a cloud or a giant alien bunny rabbit?
I see a cloud, but by the time Klimmer gets done digitally enhancing it, he'll have this.
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Klimmer
Mountain climber
San Diego
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Topic Author's Reply - Sep 23, 2010 - 06:50pm PT
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Everyone has a part to play . . .
1. 1953 CIA Robertson Panel – The CIA 1953 Robertson Panel imposed a virtual truth embargo on the UFFO/ET presence, prohibiting public discourse on UFO/ET in government, media, academia, education, science and mandating ridicule and social oppression of UFO/ET proponents. One source states, “The extremely high numbers of UFO reports in 1952 disturbed both the Air Force and the Central Intelligence Agency (CIA). Both groups felt that an enemy nation could deliberately flood the U.S. with false UFO reports, causing mass panic and allowing them to launch a sneak attack. On September 24, 1952, the CIA's Office of Scientific Intelligence (OSI) issued a memorandum to Walter B. Smith, the CIA's director. The memo stated that ‘the flying saucer situation . . . have national security implications . . . [in] the public concern with the phenomena . . . lies the potential for he touching-off of mass hysteria and panic’.”
REPORT OF SCIENTIFIC ADVISORY PANEL ON UNIDENTIFIED FLYING OBJECTS CONVENED BY OFFICE OF SCIENTIFIC INTELLIGENCE, CIA January 14 - 18, 1953
(The Durant report of the Robertson Panel proceedings)
http://www.cufon.org/cufon/robert.htm
GC,
By your admission, boy I must have some amazing powers. I'm just posting stereograms, not doctoring or digitally alternating anything. We see in 3D, it gives us much more information, depth of field, etc. Learn something new. Stereograms are pretty cool. Wow, I can just make up this stuff. Huh? Really? No, just asking questions and trying to figure it out.
You play your part so well, "mandating ridicule and social oppression of UFO/ET proponents." All you have are ad hominem attacks. Nothing else. Empty. Why?
By the way, do you get dental and medical coverage with your CIA operative job?
Huh? What? Oh, you don't work for the CIA you say? So you are carrying out their mandate for free, and you're not getting paid for it? Geeeeeeees. Wrong career. You could do what you already do for the CIA: ad hominem attacks, spread disinfo, ridicule and oppression, etc., and get paid the big bucks!
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healyje
Trad climber
Portland, Oregon
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Sep 23, 2010 - 07:37pm PT
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K-man, as someone who's done a passing amount photogrammetry I'd say one look at the bottom reflections in the second photo in combination with their position relative to the horizon should be a big clue as to what they are. And that is verified by some nice forensic photogrammetry.
Again, the odds of any single alien civilization developing a means of time travel is infinitesimal. That they would develop it coincident to and detecting the existence of humans on Earth is even smaller. That they would invest the overwhelming level of planetary resources into a trip here for no real gain smaller still.
Also, to account for the near endless variety of UFO sightings, each essentially with a fairly unique 'craft', would require a belief that we're a virtual Times Square for thousands of alien civilizations. At exactly what point does common sense, basic logic, and elemental physics kick in and you understand humans are at once fictionally creative, delusional, greedy, and lunatic and always have been.
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Tony Bird
climber
Northridge, CA
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Sep 23, 2010 - 08:27pm PT
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healyje apparently has little knowledge of ufo phenomena, although i would agree with part of his logic. i've broached the subject with klimmer before, but he wants to believe what he wants to believe, and i must say that i often admire his enthusiasm and willingness to brave ST scorn.
an alternative explanation to the ufo stuff actually follows some of granite's reasoning: we don't know what it is, but let's not jump to the conclusion of extraterrestial. i've cited john keel's book several times in this vein. there are reliable witnesses to extraordinary phenomena, but the phenomena always seem to fail in their promise. the 20th century, with its breakthroughs in astronomy, speculates about extraterrestial civilization. during the 19th century, it was still angels and the intervention of the divine. keel says that ufo "flaps" at that time gave rise to both the jehovah witness and seventh day adventist sects. obviously phenomenal, paranormal happenings, with human hopes for an apocalyptic new age projected therein. somehow, this stuff never delivers.
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healyje
Trad climber
Portland, Oregon
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Sep 23, 2010 - 08:34pm PT
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I have no doubt there are millions of alien civilizations and that there have probably have been hundreds of millions of them over the history of the universe. What I doubt is that few if any have ever had any indication they weren't alone as an advanced species, that few if any have ever made two-way contact with another species by any means, and that none have time-traveled beyond their own solar system, and that we humans haven't inhabited the Earth long enough to be detected let alone 'visited'.
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Hawkeye
climber
State of Mine
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Sep 23, 2010 - 09:29pm PT
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i dont know, i was just talking to captain Kirk about this and he told me lots of Klingon stories...
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Tony Bird
climber
Northridge, CA
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Sep 23, 2010 - 09:31pm PT
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"the latest" (these things seem to change every 10 years or so) from leading evolutionary scientists portrays life as very serendipitous. lots of coincidences have given us what we have here, the sorts of things that just don't happen easily in your average star system. simon conway-morris of cambridge says maybe one life planet per galaxy--a lot lonelier universe than h.g. wells or george lucas prepared us for.
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WBraun
climber
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Sep 23, 2010 - 09:59pm PT
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There are living entities on every planet in the entire cosmic creation.
Just because some of you dip sh'its can't see them you deny.
A few specks of dip sh'it deniers on this planet don't change,
cold, hard facts ......
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healyje
Trad climber
Portland, Oregon
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Sep 23, 2010 - 10:03pm PT
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A few specks of dip sh'it deniers on this planet don't change,
cold, hard facts ......
And neither will a few specks of dip sh'it delusioneers.
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WBraun
climber
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Sep 23, 2010 - 10:15pm PT
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You guys liked that didn't you.
hahaha
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Karl Baba
Trad climber
Yosemite, Ca
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Sep 24, 2010 - 01:33am PT
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Joe writes
Again, the time and distances involved amounts to time travel. i.e. At the time anyone would even consider coming here humans likely wouldn't have existed on the planet. Our radio signature only has a 70 light year radius with powerful signals probably half that. The idea that we've been visited once is outlandish. The idea we're visited all the time by different alien races lunatic...
Based on your assumptions, this is true. But what is the difference between angels and aliens? Maybe it's not so much as we'd guess. This physical dimension may not be the only plane of existence. Our assumptions about the limitations of physics are based on a thousand years of basic science while others may have had millions of years to evolve deeper.
Alledgedly, the reason the aliens are opposed to nukes versus our other many ways of murdering each other is that nuke explosions have an effect on the subtle dimension they live in. Also explain how they can not be detected in many case
Just putting those thoughts out there. I don't know what the real truth is
Peace
Karl
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Klimmer
Mountain climber
San Diego
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Topic Author's Reply - Sep 24, 2010 - 01:49am PT
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As I have said before, the story of "Apollo 20" is involved, complex, and a mixture of truth and disinformation.
There truly is something there on the Moon that is massive that we have discovered. All the official images from NASA say so. A massive ship that is approx. 5km long and almost 1km in width. Did I say massive? It is in 3D detail in both stereopair images from Apollo 15 and 17. Same exact massive structure.
The stereopair from "Apollo 20" shows the same exact structure, and the same exact Lunar surface. Too many exact matches between both. I do think it is a wrecked massive extraterrestrial fallen angel spaceship. "The Good Book" talks about the Heavenly Hosts being created before the Universe and that they were witnesses to Creation. The Watchers have been here for a very long time (billions of years). Those that fell (33% of the Sons of God), some mated with Earthly women and also taught mankind many things we should not have ever known such as War, among many other things we shouldn't have been taught. Some things we were taught were good, such as reading and writing. Read the Book of Enoch for the complete story.
The following stereopair images from CDR William Rutledge "retiredafb" film that was posted, supposively showing up close detail of the ship as shot through a telescope camera mount on the LEM are fake. I have said this before. When I put them into stereopairs I can see that they are fake even better. At the top of 2 of the stereopairs you can see a helix shaped large spring structure in good 3D detail. This must be support or some other structure in use with the massive model.
It looks to be a massive model shot in a studio with artificial light. When I say massive model, this thing must be about 20 feet in length or so. In one of the stereo pairs below you can see a slightly lit diagnal line. In the stereopair in 3D this looks like the front of someone standing in the background. At least it does to me. If this is true, then like I said this model of the ship is massive.
Who would do this? Who would take the time and have the resources and money to do this? Why would they want to make such a huge detailed model of this structure on the Moon? Someone obviously cares greatly about this massive ship on the Moon to go to the trouble and detail to make such a massive model. I don't think someone would do this just for a Youtube or Revver video hoax.
The Apollo 20 mission was USAF. They would have the resources to do this. They would be interested in this technology, material research, and the history of these ETs and would want to replicate what they found for further science research purposes. The military often makes massive models of ships, planes, jets, rockets, space shuttles etc. for mock-up research purposes. Why wouldn't they do it for ET technology and crafts discovered?
I think a purposefully planned disclosure is happening (with a small "d") and they are knitting a story together that is part real and part fake. It gives them great cover. I honestly think that CDR William Rutledge is being allowed to leak this. They know who he is. They know where he is. He can not do this alone. If the USAF did not want him to do this he would be taken out with predjudice in a heart-beat. I think some "white hats" in the Armed Forces are helping disclosure along and coming clean. Also it is a "pysops" experiment. Let the people figure it out. Let's see if they can do it. And how will they handle it when they do figure it out? They (those that know the truth) already have many of the answers and the technology. They get to control this game in a big way, and play with us as a cat plays with a mouse. It must be fun for them in some sick demented kind of way.
But they keep forgetting that many of us already know how the story ends. I read the Good Book. Those with GOD win. Those against GOD lose. The deceivers are themselves deceived.
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Klimmer
Mountain climber
San Diego
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Topic Author's Reply - Sep 24, 2010 - 02:05am PT
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Posted before:
Here is a great resource for stereoscopes . . .
http://ascscientific.com/stereos.html
I have the Sokkia Pocket Stereoscope.
This stereoscope looks affordable and useable for many applications. I think I'm going to purchase this for my use . . .
The PokeScope® 3D Viewer
A Modern Stereoscope
and Stereoscopic Software
http://www.pokescope.com/
"The PokeScope is a revolutionary stereographic image viewer that employs prisms, rather than lenses, and "full masking windows" around each stereo image to allow viewing of all types printed or computer displayed stereo images. The PokeScope is held up to your eyes and images are generally viewed from a distance of 1.5 - 2 feet. Images can be viewed from a wide range of angles and precise image alignment is not as critical as with other stereoscopes."
I'm aware some people have a difficult time viewing in 3D. Some can not at all. However, most people can. Hours of 3D viewing will give you a headache. Hazard of the profession. Be careful.
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healyje
Trad climber
Portland, Oregon
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Sep 24, 2010 - 03:04am PT
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Alledgedly, the reason the aliens are opposed to nukes versus our other many ways of murdering each other is that nuke explosions have an effect on the subtle dimension they live in. Also explain how they can not be detected in many case
Karl, it's frankly quite hard to take that seriously. And why would beings from another dimension need a physical 'saucer' from this dimension? And where would this other dimension exist?
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healyje
Trad climber
Portland, Oregon
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Sep 24, 2010 - 03:33am PT
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Klimmer ever seen a Saturn rocket launch. Short of a nuclear bomb it's one of the world's more powerful events. Pretty amazing someone could light three of those babies off with no one noticing. Apollo 20 - never happened. Those photos are wonderful fakes. Don't you think we'd have at least re-tasked Hubble for a peek at that baby by now? And you can bet lunar missions would never have stopped if there was even the slightest chance there was advanced technology on the moon that might have enhanced our ability to throw rocks at one another. In fact, I can insure you there would be an enormous Hilton and Seven Flags park up there by now as cover for the on-going operation.
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graniteclimber
Trad climber
Nowhere
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Sep 24, 2010 - 03:48am PT
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Klimmer's 10:49 post above is proof of just how fantastically delusional he is. According to him, even evidence that the pics showing his "spaceship" are faked are "proof" that the spaceship is real. What a nutcase!
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Karl Baba
Trad climber
Yosemite, Ca
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Sep 24, 2010 - 04:14am PT
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Joe writes
Karl, it's frankly quite hard to take that seriously. And why would beings from another dimension need a physical 'saucer' from this dimension? And where would this other dimension exist?
Believe or disbelieve whatever you like. It hardly matters for either of us, as if Aliens show, they show, and if they don't, whatever, we deal with life anyway.
But think about it. There are other unseen dimensions we know well about. The electromagetic spectrum as radiowaves, gamma waves, Microwaves, infrared light and all kinds of energy that we can't see but that can carry information. The parameter's of being alive are beyond our assumptions. We already know that Nuclear explosions have an enormous impact across the electromagnetic spectrum. We can see the borealis under certain conditions but not on others, we assume these craft are physical but they reportedly defy our expectations of physical laws. Some may be, some may not be. Surely there are piles of lie, hocus-pocus and maybe disinformation about this out there. Hard to know what's up
Peace
Karl
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graniteclimber
Trad climber
Nowhere
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Sep 24, 2010 - 04:43am PT
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The electromagnetic spectrum and the aurora borealis exist in our dimensions.
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