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blahblah
Gym climber
Boulder
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What about the new revelations about atmospheric water vapor?
OMFG
And did you here about the abundance of ice blocking ships in Sweden this year? The most in 20 years!!!!
YOU ARE
Maybe the warming cycle is over and it's cooling.
AN IDIOT!
The most in 20 years????? Would you consider that an extreme weather event? Or only if it supports your theory of global cooling?
That's what I can render from the data.
Oh, damn, that is funny!!!
Mild-mannered ST poster merely questions the significance of an apparently unusual cold weather event -> he's an IDIOT.
Obama references unusual weather event as an example of GCC -> he's our brilliant leader and anyone who questions his logic is an IDIOT (of the fukin variety, no less).
Heads I win, tails you lose can be a fun game for the "heads", but the only "tails" who keep playing it are IDIOTS.
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corniss chopper
Mountain climber
san jose, ca
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Al Gore wrote,
“The heavy snowfalls this month have been used as fodder for
ridicule by those who argue that global warming is a myth,
yet scientists have long pointed out that warmer global temperatures
have been increasing the rate of evaporation from the oceans,
putting significantly more moisture into the atmosphere
— thus causing heavier downfalls of both rain and snow in particular regions, including the Northeastern United States.”
So Al Gore reverses his theory of AGW ie dire predictions of droughts and more deserts to this new Al Gore theory of more rain and snow.
very interesting
http://www.climategate.com/
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Chiloe
Trad climber
Lee, NH
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bluering:
And did you here about the abundance of ice blocking ships in Sweden this year? The most in 20 years!!!!
A glance at the map for March 3 shows ice covering more area than usual in the Baltic Sea (that's near Sweden), southern Bering Sea, and Barents Sea NE of Murmansk.
But wait, sea ice covers less area than usual farther N in the Barents Sea, off some parts of East Greenland, in the Sea of Okhotsk, and east of Canada in the Davis Strait, Labrador Sea, Cabot Strait, and Gulf of St. Lawrence.
To see the big picture through all these place-to-place variations, or even to know about them, is the job being done every day by those scientists bluey hates but doesn't read. Their work is shared with the rest of us, also daily, at sites like NSIDC. There, we can learn that the total northern sea ice extent right now remains well below the 1970-2000 average.
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Chiloe
Trad climber
Lee, NH
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CC:
So Al Gore reverses his theory of AGW ie dire predictions of droughts and more deserts to this new Al Gore theory of more rain and snow.
CC, you're missing the weather/climate thing in just about every post. It's not rocket science!
And anyway, none of these are Al Gore's theories. Unlike SuperTopo's hard right he's been listening to scientists.
But can you find one scientist who predicted more rain everywhere, or more drought everywhere?
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Chiloe
Trad climber
Lee, NH
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Here's a sea-level graph for JimE and all you other Downeasters. The upper curve shows data from Eastport, not far from the seacliffs of Acadia National Park. Thermal expansion of warming sea water, together with new fresh water from melting icesheets, explains most of the trend.
In the future it's likely to rise farther, as much as 2 feet before the end of this century according to recent EPA warnings (some icesheet researchers think more). The state of Maine has built the 2-foot warning into their coastal development laws.
Does a 2-foot rise matter, if you're 3 feet above the water? Peter Slovinsky, senior geologist with the Maine Geological Survey, points out one reason that it does: even a 1-foot rise in sea level can change a 100-year storm into a 10-year storm.
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d-know
Trad climber
electric lady land
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GOclimb
Trad climber
Boston, MA
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Mar 11, 2010 - 01:31pm PT
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Blahblah wrote: Obama references unusual weather event as an example of GCC -> he's our brilliant leader and anyone who questions his logic is an IDIOT (of the fukin variety, no less).
Heads I win, tails you lose can be a fun game for the "heads", but the only "tails" who keep playing it are IDIOTS.
Maybe that's the game you (and some on the left, as well) are playing, but homey don't play that game. I question *everyone's* logic, whether they're friend or foe. Obama gets no blank check from me, and he's both said and done things I disagree with.
But this business of him supposedly using a double standard is truly silly.
The logic is simple. Here is his point: "Some claim that recent snowstorms in the mid-atlantic area are a good argument against the Global Climate change theory, a theory I happen to believe. But whether I'm right or wrong, the fact is that the current weather is actually *consistent* with the predictions. So using it as evidence that the theory is wrong is invalid."
Let's take another example.
Let's say that I claimed that the supertopo for the Nose is wrong. Supertopo claims that it's 35 pitches, but I say it's really 44, and in defense of my argument, I say I know a guy who just got down, and he says he did it in 44 pitches.
You scratch your head, and think about it. You remember doing the nose and using the supertopo route, and it seemed pretty damn accurate to you. So you go back and look at the topo. You find that if you do the right combination of variations, all of them listed on the topo, you can come up with exactly 44 pitches.
So you come back and say: "No, I think the supertopo is actually still valid, and the most common way to do the nose will be in 35 pitches, but it *can* be done in 44, and Supertopo shows how to do it."
GO
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blahblah
Gym climber
Boulder
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Mar 11, 2010 - 02:02pm PT
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GOClimb,
I submit that you are not accurately paraphrasing Obama and that your paraphrase would be much closer to what he said if you change the word *consistent* to the word *example*. After all, *example* is the word he used.
But even using your paraphrasing, it would still have been a stupid and misleading point, even if not absolutely wrong. Would it not have been more accurate to say that the local weather on any given day does not prove or disprove any theory of GCC, and in fact that the local weather on any given day would be *consistent* with just about any theory of GCC, from no change to huge change?
To put in another way, Obama was trying to rebut the contention that cold weather in Washington DC at a particular time shows that GCC isn't happening. Shouldn't he have rebutted that point by explaining that pointing to local, daily weather is not the way to analyze GCC instead of pointing to local, daily weather somewhere else?
It seems to me that Obama's use of the local weather to make any point related to GCC shows he's fairly clueless, at least in that regard. He's obviously a smart guy so I think he would be better served if his supporters try to educate him when he goofs rather than to twist his words to try to defend him at all costs.
I had a hard time linking your pitch-count analogy to this issue. No worries, maybe that's my fault rather than it being a poor analogy. But to use it, I would say that arguing about how many pitches a long climb *is* (as if it's a single, immutable number) would tell me that the people doing the arguing have a fundamental misunderstanding as to what they're talking about. To the extent I see the relevance of your analogy, I'd say Obama would be a guy sitting there arguing whether a long climb is 37 or 44 pitches, rather than being a smart guy who would take a step back and see that the premise of the argument is dumb.
That's my concern about Obama, which is why I think this is important.
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Chiloe
Trad climber
Lee, NH
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Mar 11, 2010 - 05:06pm PT
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Bookworm, as someone who after making hundreds of posts on the topic recently revealed he had no clue even what "global warming" means, you should take a break from pretending to understand this stuff you cut-and-paste, or from pretending you care whether it's honest.
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TGT
Social climber
So Cal
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Mar 12, 2010 - 02:16pm PT
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That has me laughing out loud
You don't have a clue how it works, do ya.
Or, was that satire?
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Chiloe
Trad climber
Lee, NH
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Mar 12, 2010 - 05:37pm PT
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Most of the data I've seen point to greater warming trends at high latitudes, especially northern and Arctic. Also, greater warming in winter, at least over North America.
Warmer nights are one part of that, but I don't have those data handy.
This winter, f'rinstance, it was colder than usual across much of the US in December and again in February. But in terms of the global average (NASA GISTEMP), this winter has been historically warm:
November 2009, #1
December 2009, #3
January 2010, #2
February 2010, #2
How's that work? Well if you look at the maps you'd see that the Arctic air chilling the US this winter did not leave behind a vacuum when it left the Arctic -- it was replaced there by warmer air from the south. So while politicians and pundits in DC buffooned about "global cooling," northern Canada was much warmer than usual.
Who cares if the Arctic warms up? We will. See
"ice albedo feedback"
"Siberian Shelf clathrates"
"thermohaline circulation"
"permafrost carbon storage"
"ice sheet dynamics"
"polar circulation index"
and so forth.
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Chiloe
Trad climber
Lee, NH
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Mar 13, 2010 - 08:26am PT
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bookworm already cut & pasted a link to that blog, CC. It wasn't true when he posted it either.
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blahblah
Gym climber
Boulder
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Mar 18, 2010 - 01:31pm PT
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I put this in another thread but it's probably more appropriate here:
Just read respected Denver columnist Mike Rosen's story today that indicates that the AGW house-of-cards is tumbling down and the liberals are already abandoning that issue and moving onto new ones.
He doesn't get into the science much but he's a very highly regarded "public intellectual" type and so I assume he can back up whatever he's saying.
http://www.denverpost.com/rosen
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Chiloe
Trad climber
Lee, NH
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Mar 18, 2010 - 02:47pm PT
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No, out there in the real world, the ice is still melting.
I'm at a meeting of several hundred Arctic scientists right now. Just about all of them are seeing rapid change.
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blahblah
Gym climber
Boulder
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Mar 18, 2010 - 03:23pm PT
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Me too. Had some real nice weather the past few days (got in come after work pitches in Boulder Canyon yesterday), big storm coming in tomorrow. Lots of "rapid change."
Guess I know about as much as the eggheads, haha.
If you're smart, you'll jump off the AGW bandwagon before it's too late and find something else to complain about and get public funding to "study" :)
I've been listening to Rosen for a long time; he is almost always right and makes fools out of the callers who argue with him. Why don't you call him and debate him if you think he's wrong? Just post on this thread before you do so b/c I want to listen and good laugh out of it.
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Chiloe
Trad climber
Lee, NH
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Mar 18, 2010 - 03:30pm PT
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blahblah, I feel like my IQ drops a point each time I read one of your posts. And I've got no extra to give up.
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blahblah
Gym climber
Boulder
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Mar 18, 2010 - 04:34pm PT
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Wes--back at 'cha on the idiot thing.
I don't mean "James Rosen," whoever that is, I mean Mike Rosen, the well-known and respected columnist for the Denver Post (the only major newspaper in Denver, which is not exactly known as a bastion of conservatism). He also has a morning talk show (850 AM) and he's had some national exposure such as sitting in for Rush when Rush is on vacation.
If you'd have clicked on the link I provided, you may have learned something. But apparently you're too busy *assuming* other people are idiots to consider the possibility that MAYBE YOU'RE THE BIGGEST IDIOT HERE!
I challenged Chiloe to call up Mike and debate him--seemed to shut that windbag up right quick.
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