Climate Change skeptics? [ot]

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anita514

Gym climber
Great White North
Oct 3, 2013 - 10:31pm PT
+1 for arctic char
I am partial to sea bass and halibut as well
rick sumner

Trad climber
reno, nevada/ wasilla alaska
Oct 3, 2013 - 10:52pm PT
Are you like a little fish Anita? Did you catch the Sea Bass in Baja?
Wade Icey

Trad climber
www.alohashirtrescue.com
Oct 4, 2013 - 01:04am PT
No source and once again you are pulling that one outta yur ass as is RILEDUP about the Cod all being gone.

rick sumner

Trad climber
reno, nevada/ wasilla alaska
Oct 4, 2013 - 01:18am PT
Fortmental that second graph of yours shows the the missing heat going down the drain, just like the high preist Trenberth has been chasing it into the deep. deep blue. Anyway, i posted an article a few weeks back about a natural phenomenom, huge south Antlantic ocean whirlpools compared to blackholes, that just might just be a vehicle for the missing heat to catch a ride for its transit to the deep drink.
Reilly

Mountain climber
The Other Monrovia- CA
Oct 4, 2013 - 01:32am PT
BITD fishermen just used baskets to scoop the cod out of the North Sea.
Then when they had screwed the pooch in the North Sea they had to start
going to the Gulf of St Lawrence. When that dried up they had to go
to the Grand Banks. Now...
Dr.Sprock

Boulder climber
I'm James Brown, Bi-atch!
Oct 4, 2013 - 01:37am PT
I Am The Walrus.

Dr.Sprock

Boulder climber
I'm James Brown, Bi-atch!
Oct 4, 2013 - 02:14am PT
but if it is damaged,

what would you do to fix it mr genuis?

tell 10 billion people to quit driving and not to take a shower?

Planet of Doom.

raymond phule

climber
Oct 4, 2013 - 03:25am PT

-Pay some $50-100K outta pocket expenses and then cut out that kidney, lung and heart as well based on a diagnoses that is less than 100% certainty.

-Invade a sovereign Nation based on less than 100% certainty that they have and are going to use WMD's.


-Allow a FED Judge authorize a Warrant to have DEA/ATF SWAT invade YOUR home based on less than 100% certainty YOU may have automatic weapons and a large stash of ammo stored in it.

And so on...

Got it.

Yes, of course do you really think otherwise?

So the medical white coat doctor that you see tell you. I believe there is a problem with your liver. It is a 95% chance that you will die in one year if you don't get a transplant. You are not going to get a new liver because it is not 100% certainty that you actually need one? You take the large risk of dying in one year instead of paying for the transplant?
anita514

Gym climber
Great White North
Oct 4, 2013 - 06:38am PT
Are you like a little fish Anita? Did you catch the Sea Bass in Baja?


I have no idea what you are talking about.


everyone knows it's all the stupid newfies that fished all the cod. and now there are none left and all the poor seals are starving. SAVE THE SEALS.
Chiloe

Trad climber
Lee, NH
Oct 4, 2013 - 09:49am PT
Here's a paper that uses 18th century records of codfish harvests to model period biomass.

Nice catch by Fortmental. The collaboration between fisheries biologist Andy Rosenberg, environmental historian Jeff Bolster et al. is a stellar illustration of interdisciplinary frontier research. Their conclusion: cod biomass on the Scotian Shelf by 2005 amounted to about 4% of its 1852 level. There's no paywall at the link above, you can check out this paper for yourself.

Managing the remnants of the ocean’s resources is a critical issue worldwide, but evidence for what constitutes a healthy fish population remains controversial. Here, we use historical sources to understand ecosystem trends and establish a biomass estimate for a key marine species prior to the industrialization of fishing. Declining trajectories have been described for predatory fishes and complex coral reef systems globally, but few numerical estimates of past abundance exist. We combined historical research methods and population modeling to estimate the biomass of cod on Canada’s Scotian Shelf in 1852. Mid 19th-century New England fishing logs offer geographically specific daily catch records, describing fleet activity on fishing grounds with negligible incentive to falsify records. Combined with ancillary fishery documents, these logs provide a solid, reliable basis for stock assessment. Based on these data we estimate a biomass for cod of 1.26 x 106 mt in 1852 – compared with less than 5 x 104 mt of total biomass today. In the current policy debate about rebuilding depleted fisheries and restoring marine ecosystems, it is important to recognize that fisheries for key commercial species like cod were far more productive in the past. As we attempt to rebuild these fisheries, our decisions should reflect real and realistic goals for management, not just recently observed catch levels.
anita514

Gym climber
Great White North
Oct 4, 2013 - 09:53am PT
it's snowing here. take that, global warming as#@&%es!
Chiloe

Trad climber
Lee, NH
Oct 4, 2013 - 10:06am PT
I've done some work on human dimensions of the crises in Atlantic cod and herring fisheries, including Newfoundland. Here is an overview paper (also not paywalled) summarizing some conclusions across a number of case studies, from Newfoundland to Norway. It includes notes on the interaction between overfishing and climate.

Northwest Atlantic cod illustrate the negative synergy of environmental adversity coming atop overfishing. West Greenland stocks (first graph in Fig. 2) were reduced by peak overfishing in the early to mid-1960s. The fall after this peak coincided with the abrupt arrival in 1969–1970 of a pulse of cold, fresh Arctic water (see Fig. 1). Although warmer conditions eventually returned to West Greenland, they were punctuated by further episodes related to circulation changes and Greenland ice-sheet attrition (Belkin et al., 1998; Belkin, 2000) that created conditions off West Greenland periodically too cold for local spawning. Moreover, wind and North Atlantic Oscillation (NAO) related shifts in flow of the Irminger Current resulted in fewer cod being imported from Icelandic waters (Buch, 2000; Buch et al., 2003). After a small terminal spike in fishing between 1988 and 1990 (mainly exploiting a 1984 cohort arriving from Iceland), Atlantic cod virtually disappeared from West Greenland. Several other demersal species had declined steeply as well (Ratz, 1992, 1999). After cod declined, northern shrimp (Pandulus borealis) became more abundant, a trophic-level shift consistent with Pauly et al.’s (1998) description of “fishing down food webs.” An emerging shrimp fishery took the place of cod as Greenland’s economic staple (Hamilton et al., 2000, 2003; Rasmussen and Hamilton, 2001).

The 1990s collapse of Newfoundland’s cod fishery (second, third and a share of the fourth graph in Fig. 2) followed a similar pattern of overfishing compounded by adverse climate, near-disappearance of the dominant species, then a new ecological and economic prominence for crustaceans. Biological analyses point to overfishing, first by international fleets in the postwar years, then after 1977 mainly by Canadian vessels, as the primary cause of the cod collapse (Hutchings and Myers, 1995; Sinclair and Murawski, 1997). Cod stocks eroded to historically low levels in the mid-1970s, and made no more than a partial recovery before the Canadian effort ramped up. Climate added to the resumed fisheries pressure in the late 1980s and early 1990s, when unusually cold, icy waters off east, north and northwest Newfoundland (Drinkwater, 2002) reflected some of the same NAO/circulation anomalies that beset the final years of Greenland’s cod fishery. Cod abundance, size-at-age and catches all began falling after the mid-1980s peak in catches that Palmer and Sinclair’s (1997) northwest Newfoundland fishermen described as their “glory years.”
raymond phule

climber
Oct 4, 2013 - 10:19am PT

Ah, who the fk ever mentioned anything about large scaled fishing???
Everyone except you on this thread? I know that everything is about but I don't even believe that you started the conversation about cod.
Chiloe

Trad climber
Lee, NH
Oct 4, 2013 - 10:22am PT
There's a small museum not far from where I live that has photos and historical notes about cod fishing off the Isles of Shoals. Those "cod as large as a man" tales from the old days aren't false.

Gadus morhua evolved with lifespans of 50 years or more, adapted to the changeable North Atlantic. Large, older fish are more robust in cold conditions, able to hunker down in deep water and wait years if needed between spawning. Their offspring have higher survival rates as well. By removing almost all of the large, older fish, so few cod survive more than 5 years, fishing pressure took away a key adaptation to their environment.
raymond phule

climber
Oct 4, 2013 - 10:28am PT
CHOOOOOOOOF.....!!!!!


The COD are NOT gone. Nor has MAN fished them ALL to extinction.

Yes, we know that and we also know that the world wide code population is much less now than it was in the past and the the cod fishing industry is gone in many places.
Gary

Social climber
Desolation Basin, Calif.
Oct 4, 2013 - 10:49am PT
Those Norwegians may be catching huge cod, but their catch is nothing compared to the catch The Chief has reeled in in this thread.

Hey Anita, in your new avatar photo, you don't seem to have a lardoass. What gives?
anita514

Gym climber
Great White North
Oct 4, 2013 - 10:57am PT
uhh the Chief, in your video it says "Mainlanders". Mainlanders are not the same as Newfies........................................ dummy.

Gary: well, since the Chef really hurt my feelings a week ago, I hit the gym hardcore and shed my lardoass in record time.
anita514

Gym climber
Great White North
Oct 4, 2013 - 11:49am PT
LOUD NOISES !!!!
!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
^^^^^^^^^^^
Gary

Social climber
Desolation Basin, Calif.
Oct 4, 2013 - 11:50am PT
Batten was a mischievous troll, but never mean or malicious.

RIP Juan de Fuca.

edit: a good climber, too.
Chiloe

Trad climber
Lee, NH
Oct 4, 2013 - 11:54am PT
Batten was a mischievous troll, but never mean or malicious.
RIP Juan de Fuca.


Yes, RIP. He also was intelligent and often creative. Thanks for the reminder.
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