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coward
Trad climber
Boulder, Wyoming
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Aug 29, 2008 - 02:54pm PT
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Flashlight,
Don't call the "left" hypocrites! It's clearly the Republican party that has flip-flopped on this issue. Making a big deal out of Obama's supposed lack of experience, and then tapping Palin, this complete unknown pageant queen as VP. Her best accomplishment - staying in Alaska and looking half-decent.
Also, there goes any notion that the McCain campaign is not in bed with Big Oil. ANWR, watch out! So much for staying ahead of the energy debate.
McCain is clearly one of the very dumbest politicians ever to run for President. It's a miracle that his entourage has carried him so far. Fattrad, congratulations!!!
For the record: I have always believed that there is no position on earth that could possibly prepare you for the office of the POTUS. Presidents just pick it up as they go along, every time, even the dumber ones. I don't think it makes sense to expect that someone has to occupy any one office before becoming president.
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Flashlight
climber
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Aug 29, 2008 - 02:57pm PT
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Coward, I was referring to those on the left in this thread.
By the way Patrick, I just discovered some dirt on Bob Barr that makes me unable to vote for him...back to the drawing board.
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Nefarius
Big Wall climber
Fresno, CA
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Aug 29, 2008 - 03:00pm PT
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toomey - that's pretty classic Lois for you.
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Jaybro
Social climber
wuz real!
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Aug 29, 2008 - 03:01pm PT
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Why, do you think,McSame threw in the towel?
weird.
Sis, you dont really think us hilary supporters are going to vote mc Cain Now, do you? Bet Obama gets the family spyork vote, as well!
this election is over.
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Shimanilami
Trad climber
San Jose, CA
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Aug 29, 2008 - 03:02pm PT
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If you'd already made up your mind who you were voting for, then Palin won't make any difference. But the "undecideds" out there have got to be thinking, "WTF?"
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bob d'antonio
Trad climber
Taos, NM
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Aug 29, 2008 - 03:04pm PT
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Toomey wrote: not sure what planet you live on. this "cultured gent" who "honors" woman divorced his wife for a younger model with cash and later called that one a "trollop" and a "kunt" in public.
Don't forget she banked his career with her family money.
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Norton
Social climber
the Wastelands
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Aug 29, 2008 - 03:08pm PT
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Barack Obama Campaign Spokesman Bill Burton responds to John McCain's choice of Alaska Governor Sarah Palin as his running mate:
"Today, John McCain put the former mayor of a town of 9,000 with zero foreign policy experience a heartbeat away from the presidency. Governor Palin shares John McCain's commitment to overturning Roe v. Wade, the agenda of Big Oil and continuing George Bush's failed economic policies -- that's not the change we need, it's just more of the same."
Sen. Chuck Schumer says:
"After the great success of the Democratic convention, the choice of Sarah Palin is surely a Hail Mary pass. It is a real roll of the dice and shows how John McCain, Karl Rove et al realize what a strong position the Obama-Biden team and Democrats in general are in in this election. Certainly the choice of Palin puts to rest any argument about inexperience on the Democratic team and while Palin is a fine person, her lack of experience makes the thought of her assuming the presidency troubling. I particularly look forward to the Biden-Palin debate in Missouri."
Rep. Rahm Emanuel:
"Is this really who the Republican Party wants to be one heartbeat away from the Presidency? Given Sarah Palin's lack of experience on every front and on nearly every issue, this Vice Presidential pick doesn't show judgment: it shows political panic."
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coward
Trad climber
Boulder, Wyoming
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Aug 29, 2008 - 03:11pm PT
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Hey Fattrad,
Another minor policy adjustment in the 11th hour by your buddy McCain...I guess he's not so opposed to drilling in Alaska. They goin' to f**k that place up if they go all the way! Woo hoo!!
But it's ok, because being wilderness and all, no one lives there, so who really cares? Same with off-shore drilling - although you can guarantee it won't be within sight of McSame's nice spread in La Joya.
But it's ok. McCain will not go all the way, and you will look like an ass for saying you're the future emperor of Yosemite for nine months.
McCain's a jackass.
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k-man
Gym climber
SCruz
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Aug 29, 2008 - 03:12pm PT
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A maverick picks a maverick!
Remind me, how is McCain a maverick?
And Fatty, I think I was on that same call. I just don't believe she's
Michelle's secret lesbian lover.
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, Ca.
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Aug 29, 2008 - 03:15pm PT
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She was a successful businesswoman, then a successful mayor, then a successful governor...seems the logical next step is a higher office. And she doesn't tow the party-line.
This should be a interesting election.
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Jaybro
Social climber
wuz real!
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Aug 29, 2008 - 03:29pm PT
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Very, Perot...
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Dick_Lugar
Trad climber
Indiana (the other Mideast)
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Aug 29, 2008 - 03:33pm PT
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That was the best response Burton came up with for the Obama team? Plus he spotted her about 2,300 citizens of Wasilla. The population is 6,715 according to their homepage. Fire him!
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Matt
Trad climber
primordial soup
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Aug 29, 2008 - 03:33pm PT
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Jeez, what a load of assnine posts-
Elcapguy was about the only one making a single rational comment.
My favorite part of this pick is the multiple beautiful ironies-
*Obama is apparently too inexperienced for the job, but a man as likely not to finish his term as McCain actually choose a person AT LEAST an unworldly as gW? There are stories on the web about her misleading her husband (albeit innocently) and spending the day driving to a mall and lining up to see Ivana Trump at a makeup counter, later stating that Alaska is so starved for any sort of culture or excitment that Ivana Trump was a genuine happening. This woman is going to deal with Iran? With Chavez? With Putin? This woman is going to be able to operate in Washington without being totally dependent upon party insiders and lobbyists as close advisers, leading her around and explaining EVERYTHING to her? (It makes a parody of how uninformed, how out of touch, and how ill prepared so many Americans have finally come to see gW as being).
*McCain wants to run against Bush and his policies, but if his health falters and she becomes the POTUS, it would obviously be Karl Rove and the rest of the GOP power brokers who would continue to run the country (heck that is probably their plan).
*The party which has always opposed affirmative action just gave a plum position to someone whe doesn't deserve it! You cannot say with a straight face that McCain would have tapped her if she were a man, no way, she brings nothing but votes from the religious right, unless you think she will attract women (obviously some people think so).
*The Hillary Vote: You people don't seem to understand the Hillary voters at all
--Republicans have long HATED the Clintons. All republicans hate both Clintons, it's one of the reasons so many Democrats voted against her in the primary. She is a divisive figure, and for some reason she has always inspired a stronger reaction from the "Dark Side" than from the good guys (who can say why?).
--Hillary voters are pro-choice, period. Hillary voters are not uninformed voters. Womens' issues are their glue. This woman is avidly anti-abortion, a darling of the religios right, and her selection indicates very clearly what kind of appointments McCain would make for the Supreme Court- which would DOOM womens' issues on several fronts, far from limited to abortion rights.
--Hillary voters are all about her experience. Choosing a women just for the sake of not having a penis diminishes Hillary Clinton's experience.
Democrats have ralied around Obama because he articulately demonstrates his sound judgement, that's how he escapes the claims of inexperience, he counters the experience card with the judgement card.
This woman, at the very best, can only articulate her general agreement with existing Bush administration policies.
Economic policies?
Is she going to offer McCain real and actual advice or expertise on national and global economic issues? Of course not- she will have nothing but meat and potatoes talking points, enough to make the base shout her name, but that's it, nothing more.
Social policies?
She will think Bush was too liberal.
She will offer what Huckabee offered to the evangelical voters (which is why she was the woman chosen and not Hutchinson)
National Security?
She will be saying whatever she is coached to say.
I predict she will parrott what McCain says and say that he was a war hero and what he says is beyond even discussion.
You just had Pat Buchanan and other conservatives suggesting that Obama showeed that he is no liberal- before November comes the wolves will eat the R ticket alive.
True conservatives, and there are MANY prominent conservative thinkers who have openly expressed disgust and dismay at the direction of what they view as a broken Republican party under the Neocons, will revolt and vote for Obama.
McCain is the new Dukakis
(and I didn't even know how right I was about that until today)
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, Ca.
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Aug 29, 2008 - 03:41pm PT
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"True conservatives, and there are MANY prominent conservative thinkers who have openly expressed disgust and dismay at the direction of what they view as a broken Republican party under the Neocons, will revolt and vote for Obama."
talk about assinine statements....
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Mighty Hiker
Social climber
Vancouver, B.C.
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Aug 29, 2008 - 03:42pm PT
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Having successfully predicted - yesterday - that McCain would pick a woman (see the "Obama speaks now" thread), I will venture another prediction. That is that the choice of Palin (and Biden) won't make much real difference. The reason being that in terms of determining the result of an election, the choice of vice-president rarely if ever makes a quantifiable difference. Historically, the vice-presidential nominees' job has been to deliver her or his home state. Which both Biden and Palin seem able to do.
Since World War II, the only v-p nominee who made a greater difference was probably Lyndon Johnson. The electoral manipulations of his friends may have secured Texas, and so the election, for the Democrats. Bush's brother Jeb did a similar trick in 2000, but wasn't a v-p nominee.
Things like ability to step in as president SHOULD be an important criteria for the v-p nominees, but aren't.
Overall, McCain's nomination of Palin will be seen as a tactic, a transparently self-serving tactic, that makes little difference, even symbolically. And perhaps an attempt to rain on Obama's parade - though they may not have had much option but to announce the choice today.
It had escaped my notice that the Republicans had any real interest in women's rights, or indeed in anyone but the wealthy elite. Rhetoric and cheap symbolic gestures aside, that is.
I wonder what Geraldine Ferraro and Fritz Mondale have to say about this? After all, the Democrats nominated a woman v-p 24 years ago - though the Republicans may be more than 24 years behind when it comes to women's rights.
Anyway, enough silliness. Sorry to bore you, but let's talk about important things for a change. What do you think of the candidates' and parties' positions on the environment? The economy? Health care? The economy? Foreign policy? The economy? Education? The economy? Erosion of civil liberties? Unemployment? Globalization? The economy? Taxation and the deficit? Cleaning up the messes left by Bush et al - who is now a conspicuously lame duck? The military-political-industrial complex? The economy?
A hurricane or tropical storm hitting New Orleans in the next few days, and causing any damage or fatalities, would undoubtedly rain on the Republican parade.
Obama would never have chosen Hillary Clinton for vice-president. No need for two alpha dogs in the pack, let alone three. And the Republicans would have claimed that it would really be the Clinton presidency redux, with Bill pulling the strings.
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Matt
Trad climber
primordial soup
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Aug 29, 2008 - 04:09pm PT
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bluering wrote:
(1st quoting me)
"True conservatives, and there are MANY prominent conservative thinkers who have openly expressed disgust and dismay at the direction of what they view as a broken Republican party under the Neocons, will revolt and vote for Obama."
talk about assinine statements....
oh really?
http://www.amconmag.com/article/2008/mar/24/0003/
dipsh#t
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Jaybro
Social climber
wuz real!
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Aug 29, 2008 - 04:17pm PT
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For some reason, and I don't really understand it, McCain appears to have taken one for the team. WTF? He had a lot of support. Like the repub platform in '92 that was completely unelectible, but seemed to say something on paper, maybe? makes you wonder what they have hatching for '12, doesn't it?
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Wade Icey
Trad climber
www.alohashirtrescue.com
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Aug 29, 2008 - 04:22pm PT
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maybe the name calling should be left to the pros.
someone upthread suggested 'cancellation' voting. Interesting concept.
I'm writing in Anders. We need more Americans like him.
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Mighty Hiker
Social climber
Vancouver, B.C.
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Aug 29, 2008 - 04:23pm PT
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Bush and Quayle in 1992 were entirely re-electable, if Perot hadn't taken away enough votes to elect Clinton.
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, Ca.
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Aug 29, 2008 - 04:24pm PT
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Matt, if I would have posted that you probably would have called me a, well...something.
Every conservative I know is ecstatic about this choice, including every conservative here. The article is clearly full of crap.
Quit trusting everything you read online, ask the 'real' conservatives. Seems that article is talking about neo-cons.
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