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TradIsGood
Happy and Healthy climber
the Gunks end of the country
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Apr 17, 2007 - 10:02am PT
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Trusty, I guess Crimpie would agree with you on the right to "bare arms". Seems there are plenty of photos on this site to back that up.
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Toker Villain
Big Wall climber
Toquerville, Utah
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Topic Author's Reply - Apr 17, 2007 - 10:03am PT
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9mm don't work as well in grigris anyway.
Healy, read Kleck.
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paganmonkeyboy
Trad climber
the blighted lands of hatu
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Apr 17, 2007 - 10:16am PT
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"I see 2 or 3 violent gun assualts a day in this town of 100,000 people in Southern, Texas. Probably 1 out of 3 die."
What's the demographic involved ? I'm going to go out on a limb and say drugs, poverty, racial or other tensions ? Removing guns won't remove *any* of that - just make it harder to shoot people...
Symptoms are not problems. They are merely symptoms...
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TradIsGood
Happy and Healthy climber
the Gunks end of the country
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Apr 17, 2007 - 10:38am PT
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I am with Dingus. There should be a "Minimum Wage" for sex.
Maybe exemptions for the disadvantaged to get it at Wal*mart though.
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paganmonkeyboy
Trad climber
the blighted lands of hatu
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Apr 17, 2007 - 10:56am PT
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Dingus -
I think this is a symptom of the way we have been doing business...
There is probably not enough time or space here to get into it at this moment, but I see this as part and parcel to the bigger whole picture...I see a decline in personal responsibility, moral values, a lack of appreciation for life and the lives of everyone around us, under increasing pressure from market forces most of us will never comprehend much less get on top of...add a culture that was raised by violent television while at the same time teaching us that men never cry...there is more, but I've been trying to stay off the forum during work so I will have to post later if anyone wants to read it...
Your kid is at home, watching tv - Is he watching people make love, or people f*#k and shoot at each other ? Is this what happens when you give the people what they want ?
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Toker Villain
Big Wall climber
Toquerville, Utah
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Topic Author's Reply - Apr 17, 2007 - 11:11am PT
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Good one PMB.
And, Dingus,
not to be a wise-ass but I too was intrigued with the "cheap" sex comment.
Do you know something I don't?
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Toker Villain
Big Wall climber
Toquerville, Utah
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Topic Author's Reply - Apr 17, 2007 - 11:40am PT
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In my case, a very broad hand.
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paganmonkeyboy
Trad climber
the blighted lands of hatu
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Apr 17, 2007 - 12:00pm PT
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correlation != causation though...don't oversimplify the point I am trying to make please...
devil's advocate question fattrad : how many people with badges do you know also keep a planter in the glove box ? pardon the drift, but if we are talking guns and the authority to carry one, this is also a legitimate question...
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tradmanclimbs
Ice climber
Pomfert VT
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Apr 17, 2007 - 12:30pm PT
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My experience with CCW is that your chances of actualy useing it to save a life are far outweighed by your chances of screwing up due to stress or relationship crap or whatever. In short you are many times more likly to taste gun oil or waste that evil Bitch/Bastard in your life than you ever are to save the day and be a hero. One of the guys I used to shoot IPSC with got wasted with his own gun by the pissed off wife while he was sleeping... Guy was hell on wheels with a pistol too. Oh well..
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Crimpergirl
Social climber
Hell on earth wondering what I did to deserve it
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Apr 17, 2007 - 02:34pm PT
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Jody: Please notice the use of the word "my" in the statement. Given that I was talking about MY colleagues, I stand by the statement. To make the leap that I am generalizing to all humans is erroneous.
"I certainly wouldn't want any of my colleagues, students or administrators with one either. The stories I could of Ph.D.s flailing their gangly arms at one another in a "fight" over the STUPIEST things..."
I'm fairly certain that you don't know my colleagues. However, I could be mistaken, and if so, you are welcome to your opinion about them.
As far as police officers at banks, I guess my brother (when he was still a police officer) was the only one who has ever worked an extra job at a bank in uniform.
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tradmanclimbs
Ice climber
Pomfert VT
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Apr 17, 2007 - 03:51pm PT
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F*#k you Jody. I am not some wimpy greeni. I own guns, I hunt and I spent some serious time on the professional combat pistol comp circuit. I can personaly f*#king gaurentee you that if your job does not involve law enforcement and you are just another yahoo who likes to carry cocked and locked 24/7 with some ridicuous fantasy about stopping something like the tradgedy in VA that your chances of ever being at the right place at the right time to intervene in that shooting and be a hero are just about zilch as in zreo like I am getting a no here.... If you are not in law enforcement and you carry 24/7 you are a whole lot more likly to have an accidental discharge (100% chance of that) get pissed off at your spouse /exlover etc. experience road rage, just generally f*#k up get drunk and shoot something or someone you shouldn't or maby even eat your own gun... gaurenf*#kenteed that all of that stuff will happen long before you ever get a chance to be John wayne and save the day/ get the girl etc.... just the way it is. Like I said one of the best pistol shots I knew on the circuit got wasted with his own gun by his wife while sleeping . Another one of the guys on the comp circuit here in VT doubble tapped his ex girls new squeeze right between the lookers.. ye haa we are really rockin now!!!. Know pleanty of guys who have flirted with suicide and a few who did the deed. Never heard of anyone I know ever foiling a bank job or saveing the day in any way. That does not mean that I don't belive in useing a firearm for self defense. I do strognly believe though that walking arround code orange all the time is not good for your mental health.... I have had a gun come in handy on a few ocasions protecting my home from unreasonble drunks but that is a whole lot different than cruising the streets cocked, locked and looking to be Clint Eastwood......
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Ouch!
climber
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Apr 17, 2007 - 03:55pm PT
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WBraun
climber
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Apr 17, 2007 - 04:00pm PT
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Hey Tradman ....
Jody is law enforcement, California's finest, CHP, state trooper.
Whooops, on your part .......
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Ouch!
climber
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Apr 17, 2007 - 04:26pm PT
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I'm glad my school teachers were not packing heat. I would not have made it through second grade.
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tradmanclimbs
Ice climber
Pomfert VT
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Apr 17, 2007 - 04:30pm PT
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Jody. I said in my experience. I carryed for a lot of years and never once had a real need for that piece out on the street. Maby if i lived in a big city that would be different?? All you have to do though is watch the news or read it. you got accidental shootrings , you got muder, suicide all that stuff. It's pretty darn rare to ever hear about a justifyed self defense shooting. We had a guy here in VT waste a kid for steeling beer and and he got away with it. Lost his buisness and his reputation so he could be a tough guy but he stayed out of jail. Guy just a few weeks ago killed his best friend while drunk and pissed off, a month or so before that another guy killed his best friend with an AD. I may not have the stats all lined up for you but it ain't that hard to see. About 15 years ago we had a self defense shooting that was pretty richous. But hey, were a small rural state. That one was actually prety cool.. Ex hubby doing the high speed chase on I-91 with a shotgun blasting out the window at the woman and her new sqeeze.. they pull of at a gas station where they knew the owner had a pistol behind the counter, new squuze runs in the store grabs the piece, runs back out and wastes the ex hubby while he is pulling down on them with the shotgun. .44 mag did the trick. So yea there is a time and place for it but it is pretty darn rare.. all this stuff happened within 100 miles of my house in a small quiet state. Maby you got a bunch of your own storys about how carrying a gun saved someones life. Or maby you just have the same old sordid domestic disputes that everyone else has.. ex wife, new Bf and maby the kids wasted, then the shmuck eats the gun.....
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Crimpergirl
Social climber
Hell on earth wondering what I did to deserve it
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Apr 17, 2007 - 04:34pm PT
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No joke Jody! My co-workers (most of 'em) are, um, interesting. About two months ago, one colleague's wife found his departmental "hit list." No lie! We are assured that his psychiatrist adjusted his medication and they removed guns from his home and he no longer wants to kill some of us. I'm reassured. Ha! I do make sure to say hello to him every time I see him. When he finally goes on his rampage, I hope he looks at me and thinks "wait, she was nice to me."
In the Houston area, police routinely work extra jobs in uniform while armed (banks, jewelry stores, etc.). While my brother did not have to face a robbery where folks were killed, other officers in town have. And some have been killed (not surprisingly). Fascinating how different cities can be.
[begin tangent] One officer who worked an extra job at my mom's jewelry store for years now sits on death row in Texas. Seems he had his wife offed. (The two he hired to murder her also sit on death row). You would think he would have been a bit more careful about it, but he made a lot of rookie mistakes. Think he still has his "I'm innocent" website up on the web somewhere - Robert Fratta is his name. He so wanted to adopt one of my parrots.
[end tangent]
Strange world.
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tradmanclimbs
Ice climber
Pomfert VT
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Apr 17, 2007 - 04:37pm PT
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Fatty you are a Cop. Notice I excluded LEF from my little triad. You really think that every shmuck with a gun shold be cocked, locked and out on the street with all their personal problems, addictions, egos, mental illness, hyper tension and whatever other crap they are carrying arround???
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tradmanclimbs
Ice climber
Pomfert VT
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Apr 17, 2007 - 04:41pm PT
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Then again even cops get pissed and whack people or eat their guns on occasion........
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Crimpergirl
Social climber
Hell on earth wondering what I did to deserve it
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Apr 17, 2007 - 04:41pm PT
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Oh, and btw Jody, nice to see you posting again.
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