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Blowboarder
Boulder climber
Back in the mix
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Apr 14, 2007 - 11:36am PT
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This thread made for some good reading.
Odub, I'm impressed, not just with NAR but your other work too. Solid effort for a "hobby".
Brachboner, man I wish I could find that link, I need a good suc.., I mean, thanks for shedding some light on the situation, interesting to hear from someone actually there.
And please tell me that lawyers first name isn't Tom.
EDIT: haha Dingus, so easy to play the virtue card isn't it.
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Odub
Trad climber
Cincy, Ohio
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Apr 14, 2007 - 04:23pm PT
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Nope, not Tom. And thanks for the good words.
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healyje
Trad climber
Portland, Oregon
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Apr 14, 2007 - 04:32pm PT
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brochbonar,
The technical details of the event or how the content generated during it were used is fairly irrelevant. The bottomline really revolves around a simple set of facts and outcomes:
1) It was a high profile public formation. It's their license plate - it doesn't get more high profile than that. It was equivalent to climbing on the Old Man on Cannon when it was still up.
2) The video gear present and the content generated speak clearly that commercial interests played at least some role in the intent and motivation for the climb.
3) There was immediate local access fallout, there is now an Arches CMP on the table, and the AF and other troops had to martialed to manage the fallout.
4) Other NPS and State Parks are likely now in the process or reviewing their CMP's in the wake of this incident. The incident did not build trust with the "tools", quite the contrary. I'm a state away and work with the "tools" at a small state park and even I had to field questions about "what was up with that...?".
In the end, it was simply an unfortunate personal decision, and some folks might reasonably be expected to consider it an ill-considered and unnecessary one given the fallout. We all make mistakes - lord knows I've made my share - take the heat and deal; no lawyers are necessary.
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andanother
climber
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Apr 14, 2007 - 04:35pm PT
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healyje,
yeah. that's why I called him an idiot. He doesn't quite get the point of the whole thing. He is just another hero worshipper that furthers Deans ego.
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HighDesertDJ
Trad climber
Arid-zona
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Apr 14, 2007 - 04:42pm PT
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Golf clap healyje!
Andanother: Easy there dude. Sounds to me like he's a friend of Dean's who was on an adventure with him in good fun and with good intent. Now he's trying to inject a little of another point of view into a thread/topic that has turned into a major bitch-n-bash. I agree with all of healyje's well articulated points, but none of this makes RockBoner (haha Ron...very funny!) a jerk or a sycophant. It doesn't make Dean a bad person either.
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Hardman Knott
Gym climber
Muir Woods National Monument, Mill Valley, Ca
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Apr 14, 2007 - 04:43pm PT
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Loyal sub-men are knott easy to come by - Dean should be grateful.
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Hardman Knott
Gym climber
Muir Woods National Monument, Mill Valley, Ca
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Apr 14, 2007 - 05:24pm PT
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I bet you can, sub-man...
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andanother
climber
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Apr 14, 2007 - 05:28pm PT
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oooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooh!!!!!!!!!!!!
Can I tell him? Can I? Can I?
I want to meet Dean SSSSSSSOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO bad! I think he is dreamy!
When I explain to him how lucky he is to have sub-boys like brokeboner and A. Crowley, it will just make his ego even bigger!
I can't wait to see what sort of outrageous, attention seeking things he does then! It's gonna be awesome!
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Sparky
Trad climber
vagabon movin on
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Apr 14, 2007 - 05:40pm PT
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"The mountains for me are about chasing after freedom and following impulses,” he said. “I’m not for rules, taking away freedom.”
-DP
....but obviously for actions taking away freedom.
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NateC
Mountain climber
Las Vegas, NV
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Apr 14, 2007 - 06:02pm PT
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"Hardman not,
You should explain all this to Dean, really.
I can arrange that."
Crowley, am I misunderstanding your tone or have this post and previous ones that you made insinuated that Dean would take things on in a pugilistic manner?
If I'm understanding you correctly, does Dean know that you are volunteering him for such a confrontation?
Climbing ability doesn't mean sh#t when you're getting your nose broken.
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Gene
climber
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Apr 14, 2007 - 06:22pm PT
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My name is .... and I represent Mr. Dean Potter. It has come to my client’s attention that…
Sounds like Mr. Esq. has an attorney-client relationship with DP. He presents himself as having the authority to speak for DP.
I received a call today from Deans attorney, claiming that Dean knew nothing of the Cease and Desist, and that he was merely acting in Deans behalf.
Mr. Esq. is gonna go far in his chosen profession, ya think?
I just sold my client's house, car and possessions, and cashed in his trust fund without his approval or knowledge, but I was merely acting in his behalf.
Yeah. That's the ticket.
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cintune
climber
Penn's Woods
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Apr 14, 2007 - 06:31pm PT
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Boys, boys, settle down. You know, I don't think I'm the only one who feels that if he had bagged it on the sly, with no one finding out until months or years later, and then only through rumors that didn't generate a mini-media feeding frenzy, it would have been perfectly cool. As it is, though, it turned ugly fast and is bound to stay that way now, especially if it results in new regs that make it a federal case to climb a rock. First rule of monument bagging is you don't spray about your monument bagging. So, excuse me, I'm going to go have a... uh... picnic, at Devil's Den. Probably forget to take my camera, too.
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Hardman Knott
Gym climber
Muir Woods National Monument, Mill Valley, Ca
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Apr 14, 2007 - 07:04pm PT
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Matthew Moron, aka A. Crowley, wrote:
Hardman wanted the opportunity earlier, and clearly had strong feelings about the issue considering he was also tempted to run over Dean with his car.
Get your nose outta Dean's ass, and show where I said that, you delusional sub-man.
Nobody said anything like that (in this or any other thread that I've seen).
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jstan
climber
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Apr 14, 2007 - 07:22pm PT
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If I may:
None of this is real. Once the adrenals are pumping, tunnel vision takes over. The best course is to do something real. Right away go out on any street, road, climbing area and pick up trash for a mile. Then call the group working to support your favorite climbing area and ask how you may help.
When you sit down to dinner it will hit you. You had a hell of a good day.
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scooter
climber
B loop site 15
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Apr 14, 2007 - 09:19pm PT
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sounds like some of the brawler dorks around here need to put together some of the visicous hex numb-chucks and maybe even some carabiner brass knuckles and the moves everyone has been dreamin' up behind there computer screens, I have been hearing so much about on the internet. I think as opposed to sushifest, it should be a brawlfest. That would be way more fun for me than talking about George Bush and haveing a good cry together all while sucking $20.00 soy beans from there husk. I bet the crowd would be pretty small. Crimpergirl would win by default being the only one to actually show. Being bummed that she did not get to stick the hex numb-chucks up andanothers ass and the 'biner knuckles up crowleys pee hole, she would be forced to go to the valley and wait out dean at the base of the nose. All the while waiting to spring into action and cut off his left hand, she believes in sharia law, for the arch ascent. That is the only way he will learn, we need to take away his ability to climb all the time. Oh, wait that is what we are already trying to do, I forgot.
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brochbonar
Social climber
boulder
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Apr 14, 2007 - 10:40pm PT
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Lovegasoline wrote;
Brad, the Delicate Arch event wasn’t the actions of a lone individual. It took the coordinated efforts of a few people to bring it off and disseminate it. You are unique on Supertaco as you were a party to the event. We’ve all heard so many opinions from folks on the consuming end of this, I’m curious what your position is as a member of the team?
Your above quoted post reads like a 100% defense of your actions and also of your judgment, but I do not want to misinterpret what you wrote, how you think, or what your motivations are. I’m assuming that you supported the premises of the Delicate Arch climb or you wouldn’t have participated in it. Do you still stand behind it now or do you regret it in any way?
Has your opinion of it changed at all in the interval of time between the actual climb and the current public reception? If yes, how so?
Response:
The only thing I regret is that we did not make a clearer statement at the time. I really believe that if Dean was able to say what needed to be said at the time to respond to all the sh#t, that things would have been better. One of his former sponsors panicked, and effectively gagged him, insisting that the only statement made be through their official channels…then they proceeded to botch it royally.
I also regret giving it to FOX news for free. After it blew up, some other folks came along and offered lots of money, but we did not take it out of respect for Dean’s relationship with Those Who Shall Not Be Named. In the end, it was useless to try to placate them. I should have taken the money and sprayed the footage to hell and back.
The end result would be the same, and I would have some money now.
I don’t really care if you people get to legally climb in Arches anyway. You should just poach the place. Its way more fun.
I also wish we would have climbed Balanced Rock before we were on the Tools Radar.
That thing looks sick.
Let it be known that these sentiments are mine. I do not speak for Dean.
peace,
Brad
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healyje
Trad climber
Portland, Oregon
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Apr 15, 2007 - 12:57am PT
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"I don’t really care if you people get to legally climb in Arches anyway. You should just poach the place. Its way more fun."
I'm sure the locals appreciate your helpful advice. And people wonder why there are access problems...
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Lost Arrow
Trad climber
The North Ridge of the San Fernando
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Apr 15, 2007 - 01:19am PT
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What was the rating of the Potter Route?
Jeff
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Matt
Trad climber
places you shouldn't talk about in polite company
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Apr 15, 2007 - 02:21am PT
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brad-
no offense, but you come adross like you are about 14.
are you seriously trying to blame the sponsor? what a joke.
why would you idiots film it and pass on the film?
lemme clue you in to one little factoid that seems to escape that inflated head of yours: if you hadn't sprayed about mr. potter climbing DA, nobody would have been beating down the door to buy the vid, cause nobody would have been the wiser! ya see, that's how real people poach sh#t all the time, it's just that we don't go do it so we can boast about it, we just want to do it, so we find a way to get it done and get away w/ it.
if you as#@&%es are really all about being somebody's MF'ing hero (or some her's sidekick) or some sh#t like that, well you are apparently missing the bigger picture (which seems pretty apparent here), that being nobody is terribly impressed with your collective brain power, and everybody pretty much thinks that the need to publicize such an event was in itself an idiotic and self-serving act of blatant self promotion by a person or group who are/were so used to such self promotion that even now it doesn't seem (to you) like it was all that bad of an idea.
edit-
i am questioning if this brad poster isn't just a clever troll, seems too ridiculous to be real. the sponsor screwed it all up? please...
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brochbonar
Social climber
boulder
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Apr 15, 2007 - 04:25am PT
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Internet humor never works.
Its wierd how you can just say whatever on here, and people buy it. The above post was intended to be a parody of the sort of dude I have been made out to be. I guess the only person that laughed was me...while I was writing it.
Look fellas, the truth is much less scandalous, and exactly what you would guess. It was a sophmoric stunt that got out of hand. Mistakes snowballed, and it sucked. Still does.
If you are angry at me, that is fair. But please be sure that your anger is because of your core beliefs, not just because it is fun to be pissed off.
Good climbing days with friends are among the best things life. If one person has a diminished experience because of restrictions placed upon them due my actions, That is very bad and wrong. I get it, and I am sorry.
If you want to come up to me and give me a piece of your mind, that is okay too.
In fact, my cell phone number is 303-919-3222. No joke.
I am willing to be accountable for my actions, as best I can anyway.
I still believe that Dean has been strung up unfairly.
I still belive that NPS as a whole is vindictive towards climbers, and largely incompitent.
The staff at Arches seems to be better than in most parks. I think they may listen to ideas while drafting the plan...I know they are talking with the rangers at the Black Canyon, and they have an "okay" plan there.
So if you care, give them you input.
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