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monolith
climber
state of being
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Jun 23, 2016 - 03:45pm PT
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would choose a bomb to do the most amount of destruction
Or, er, maybe he thought it was his best chance at not being caught after.
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Escopeta
Trad climber
Idaho
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Jun 23, 2016 - 04:43pm PT
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I bet if you did a sit-in and made it to the 15th minute, real change would happen.
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EdwardT
Trad climber
Retired
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Topic Author's Reply - Jun 23, 2016 - 04:59pm PT
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crankster
Not a Muslim...
No deaths. No injuries.
Oh, the humanity!
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Klimmer
Mountain climber
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Jun 23, 2016 - 05:41pm PT
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Just one trained responsible individual with a concealed carry gun permit could have taken him out. This is what we need to do. Arm up is the best deterrence and defense.
Terrorists will never listen to the law. It doesn't apply to them. Outlaw all guns and they will still get guns, and we won't have any to protect ourselves.
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healyje
Trad climber
Portland, Oregon
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Jun 24, 2016 - 12:25am PT
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You don't have any way to protect yourself even with a gun.
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rottingjohnny
Sport climber
Shetville , North of Los Angeles
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Jun 24, 2016 - 07:17am PT
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One trained person with a gun can take out a terrorist with an AR-15...? Seems like any shoot outs on TV involve 6 swat team guys and hundreds of rounds to take out one guy with an automatic rifle..?
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Reilly
Mountain climber
The Other Monrovia- CA
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Jun 24, 2016 - 07:23am PT
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I doubt many of those SWATTERS have the shooting skills of an average Marine grunt.
It's hard to shoot well with a box of donuts in yer lap. They get onto a SWAT team for the
pay and so they don't actually have to do any actual meaningful police work.
But we digress, sorry.
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Escopeta
Trad climber
Idaho
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Jun 24, 2016 - 07:23am PT
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The operative word is "trained".
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fear
Ice climber
hartford, ct
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Jun 24, 2016 - 08:05am PT
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The thing they keep glossing over is there was apparently an offduty cop there as a patron who forced the killer into the bathroom with a concealed PISTOL.
That guy needs to get the brass-balls award IMO. His name should be in lights.
Running into a dark nightclub with loud rifle shots, screaming, blood, and unknown number of assailants to confront someone with only a handgun is friggin' real hero territory.
But as a rule the patrol cops I've trained alongside for years are no different than average joes on the street in terms of skill. Sure there are some who have a personal hobby in shooting but most of 'em just qualify every 90 days shooting paper at 25 yards and go home. Emphasis is on safety and not shooting themselves or others by accident.
The SWAT guys are perhaps a little better but we're still not talking about Seal/Delta style training. They shoot a little more and mostly work on coordination during mock raids.
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High Fructose Corn Spirit
Gym climber
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Jun 24, 2016 - 08:10am PT
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the patrol cops I've trained alongside for years...
what is your occupation?
...
an offduty cop there as a patron who forced the killer into the bathroom
you're a little loose there, I think.
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High Fructose Corn Spirit
Gym climber
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Jun 24, 2016 - 08:13am PT
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Not a Muslim...
You caricature.
Another example of Radical Christianity
You caricature.
NBD, I guesss, everybody's doing it now. You
almost have to just to keep up.
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EdwardT
Trad climber
Retired
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Topic Author's Reply - Jun 24, 2016 - 08:37am PT
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Hyperbole is the new reality.
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Escopeta
Trad climber
Idaho
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Jun 24, 2016 - 08:52am PT
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The young FBI sniper kids show up too on the rifle range occasionally dragging their stuff along, same thing. These kids are cloverleafing targets in the 10 ring at 100 yards.
On one hand I can't blame the normal uninformed citizen for these kinds of statements since this is the stuff that our media (and fiction) is made of. So I should shrug it off.
But on the other hand, I realize that the people that hold these wild-eyed opinions are the one's voting away my rights with alarming regularity. Which is of increasingly greater interest to me.
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Reilly
Mountain climber
The Other Monrovia- CA
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Jun 24, 2016 - 09:08am PT
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Well, Couch, do indulge me, kindly, in a little of the excess hyperbole endemic to these
hallowed grounds. God forbid we should restrict ourselves to mean objectivity and, of
all horrors, even handedness!
The local coppers, from far around, come to 'my' range. I don't walk over to where they
merrily blast away, but let's just say Helen Keller could hear their lengthy and, IMHO,
undisciplined volleys, the likes of which would NOT be tolerated on a USMC range,
at least not by my old Gunny. How else can one fathom the plethora of police reports
that constantly detail how six officers unleashed 140 rounds on a guy with a knife?
OK, so maybe it was only 138. I know we can't all aspire to be Carlos Hathcock but I
don't see much in the way of embracing the 'One Shot-One Kill' ethos. Besides, I'm
paying for those rounds and I'm cheap!
Oh, and I'll take just about any Marine against any cop for fitness. How many cops could
survive 48 miles of marching in 54 hours?
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rottingjohnny
Sport climber
Shetville , North of Los Angeles
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Jun 24, 2016 - 09:21am PT
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Reilly....you are comparing donuts to MRE's...
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Escopeta
Trad climber
Idaho
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Jun 24, 2016 - 10:07am PT
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While we are on the topic I highly doubt that Marines would have stood around for 3 hours while a gunman was holed up in a club killing folk.
But, as you said we aren't comparing them fairly. I am merely pointing out the obvious.
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healyje
Trad climber
Portland, Oregon
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Jun 24, 2016 - 01:12pm PT
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Oh, the skillz...!!!!
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Brokedownclimber
Trad climber
Douglas, WY
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Jun 24, 2016 - 01:21pm PT
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Reilly-
And then there's the grunts who trained at Ft. Carson, chugging up Agony Hill with full field pack, M1 Garand, Steel pot, and then going down into The Valley of Death, only to chug back up Rattlesnake Ridge on the way back to post. Been there, done that.
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EdwardT
Trad climber
Retired
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Topic Author's Reply - Jun 24, 2016 - 01:45pm PT
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