Discussion Topic |
|
This thread has been locked |
TradEddie
Trad climber
Philadelphia, PA
|
|
How to get law abiding gun owners to turn in weapons that have no compelling civilian purpose?
Declare any rifle greater than .22 cal, with a detachable magazine capable of holding more than five rounds to be a weapon of war, and possession of such a weapon outside of one's primary residence will be considered an overt act of war against the people and government of the United States.
The constitution provides a remedy for treason.
More than willing to offer exceptions for registered, vetted individuals similar to that which exists for full-auto weapons today, but with the addition of regular psychological assessment. Absolute prohibition for any person taking any legal or illegal psychoactive drugs, or any diagnosis of mental illness in the preceding five years.
TE
|
|
jonnyrig
climber
|
|
M.B.- well, thats a nice start. It does not, would not address all the causes of violence and/or suicide by gun. I agree with much of what you said there, just not that it would stem the tide, so to speak.
Face it bro, either you start figuring out some options for the least restrictive measures that have a chance at reducing incidents, or just pony up and admit that you yourself have fallen victim to the stupid "us vs them" mentality that grips our forlorn nation. "you libbyp" all but openly proclaims it right there.
Theres a damn good chance that some control is coming, like it or not. Now choose- viable, least restrictive solution, or stick your head in the sand and practice mumbling the phrase "I dont understand..." like the majority of victims who thought vigilance and awareness was sufficient?
T.E.- Good luck with that. Eyeroll.
|
|
healyje
Trad climber
Portland, Oregon
|
|
So the answer is mo' guns and turn schools into bullet-proof, fob-driven, high-alert lockdowns. Got it. Let sanity prevail.
|
|
blahblah
Gym climber
Boulder
|
|
How to get law abiding gun owners to turn in weapons that have no compelling civilian purpose?
Declare any rifle greater than .22 cal, . . .
OK time for a little civics lesson. They used to teach this stuff in school, but maybe now that's changed and civics had been replaced with "multiculturalism" or something.
The government cannot (validly) simply "declare" something contrary to the Constitution and go with that.
The Constitution is the "Supreme Law of the Land."
Whatever "declaration" that the above poster had in mind is contrary to the Constitution and would have no valid legal effect.
Sorry libs but your only choices are a constitutional amendment (not gonna happen) or, more realistically, voting fore more lib presidents who will continue to pack the court with liberal hacks who may well decide to "interpret" the 2nd Amendment in such a way as to render it a "dead letter."
|
|
TGT
Social climber
So Cal
|
|
The perps used a 22 cal weapon.
Granted, not rimfire.
22 cal rimfire is the caliber of choice for organized crime assassins.
Very concealable and not very loud.
|
|
healyje
Trad climber
Portland, Oregon
|
|
I've repeatedly explained that there is a very principled and bright line between weapons of personal defense and WMDs. Don't pretend that my position is a slippery slope.
How principled and how is 'Mass' determined? I'd personally describe an AR-15 as a WMD in the hands of someone who really knows how to use one.
Whatever "declaration" that the above poster had in mind is contrary to the Constitution and would have no valid legal effect.
Last I checked, the Constitution was pretty mum on caliber, muzzle velocity and firing rate. I further suspect if an AR-15 were demonstrated before the first congress it would have instantly been categorized a WMD and illegal for any but organized militia to possess.
Gotta have an evolving, dynamic Constitution for anything but the guns of the day to be legal now. In fact, I can scarcely believe literalists / fossilists would argue otherwise.
|
|
TGT
Social climber
So Cal
|
|
In the confined space of a conference room a 22 rimfire would have been just as or even more lethal.
223 rifle rounds make neat in and out holes. 22LR enter and bounce around in the body cavities tearing everything up.
|
|
mucci
Trad climber
The pitch of Bagalaar above you
|
|
In my home state of Missouri, everybody is packing.
Everybody.
Moms, grandmas, uncles, teachers.
Concealed on person and in vehicles.
I mean EVERYBODY.
Makes you think twice about which place to attempt a mass shooting.
I wonder why every mass shooting happens where there are no guns...
Ponder that.
|
|
zBrown
Ice climber
|
|
In my home state of Missouri, everybody is packing.
If true, your mass shooting is coming down (or up) the pike. Be patient.
|
|
Norton
Social climber
|
|
I wonder why every mass shooting happens where there are no guns...
did not have to ponder of that very long at all
I thought of the one place where there are lots and lots of guns and trained people
and the 2009 US ARMY BASE AT FORT HOOD came to mind
where one man only killed 13 people and injured another 30
that was easy
|
|
blahblah
Gym climber
Boulder
|
|
Gotta have an evolving, dynamic Constitution for anything but the guns of the day to be legal now. In fact, I can scarcely believe literalists / fossilists would argue otherwise. \
Wrong.
The operative word in the 2nd Amendment is "arms."
It is not "arms that are currently in existence." (And even in the 18th Century, it was apparent that arms were a whole heck of a lot more effective than in previous eras--do you think the Founders were so foolish as to think innovation would for some reason stop when the Bill of Rights was enacted?)
There is no legitimate interpretation of "arms" to be "arms that happen to exist right now."
I know the libs love this "living Constitution" stuff so they can get their sodomite marriage and stop the death penalty, but it's really two different things.
|
|
madbolter1
Big Wall climber
Denver, CO
|
|
Theres a damn good chance that some control is coming, like it or not.
Oh, I have NO doubt of it. CONTROL is what the government is about, and "we the people" just can't hand it over fast enough.
I'll bemoan it and roll my eyes. In the end, I expect to be dead before it turns into full-blown Minority Report. But, sans the supernatural BS, Minority Report is what's coming.
|
|
mucci
Trad climber
The pitch of Bagalaar above you
|
|
Sure, in places where you cannot legally carry weapons concealed.
Norton, it was a grenade dude, what a stupid example.
|
|
madbolter1
Big Wall climber
Denver, CO
|
|
So the answer is mo' guns and turn schools into bullet-proof, fob-driven, high-alert lockdowns. Got it. Let sanity prevail.
I WISH that sanity would prevail.
You guys aren't serious about the kids. You, like the media, USE these incidents for your own agenda and then talk about "safety measures" that you have NO reason to think will have any positive effect.
Then you justify that stupidity with some variant of the "if it can save even one life" line.
In fact, you KNOW (and it's been very publicly admitted) that all of the proposed gun-control measures would have had NO effect on the outcomes of the vast majority of these shootings, and that it's a crap-shoot as to whether there would have been any effect on the minority.
But, you know, "we've gotta do something," even if we're targeting ENTIRELY the wrong demographic.
And now our Obumbalator in Chief is crying for a "watch list" that will circumvent due process of law. Get on the list (no trial, no NOTHING but just some bureaucrat putting you there), and you lose your rights.
Yeahhhhhhh... we're not even trying to HIDE that we're a full-blown police state at this point.
"Keep us safe, Big Brother! Pleeeeaaasssee! Keep us safe!"
Makes me sick.
|
|
fear
Ice climber
hartford, ct
|
|
I wonder why every mass shooting happens where there are no guns...
did not have to ponder of that very long at all
I thought of the one place where there are lots and lots of guns and trained people
and the 2009 US ARMY BASE AT FORT HOOD came to mind
where one man only killed 13 people and injured another 30
that was easy
Actually they're completely disarmed there, except for MP's, which kinda shocked me too.
I mean, if police at police station carry guns all day......
Making sure everyone at a military base at least has a sidearm would seem to make sense.
But the simple fact is, you are your own first responder, nobody else. It's a matter of timing. There's no way for anyone to respond to sudden violence like that except those directly involved and targeted or someone in the immediate vicinity.
|
|
madbolter1
Big Wall climber
Denver, CO
|
|
Stupid graphic, Norton.
Actually, Reagan didn't die.
Actually, gun-toting good-guys ENDED the incident almost as fast as it started.
I WISH that armed teachers (or any armed good-guy) had been present to stop these school incidents JUST as they get started.
No COP can respond to these incidents as fast as having the good guys with guns PRESENT, which is what your graphic really denotes.
But, ya know, just keep spinnin' the facts to suit your gun-grabbing agenda.
We just gotta become France!
|
|
madbolter1
Big Wall climber
Denver, CO
|
|
No, the difference NOW is that the POTUS is actually flat-out saying that people just ON a watchlist are denied rights, and that without ANY due process.
|
|
Lorenzo
Trad climber
Portland Oregon
|
|
Actually, the Regan graphic isn't fair.
Half those guys had full auto Uzis strapped under their coats.
|
|
Lorenzo
Trad climber
Portland Oregon
|
|
No, the difference NOW is that the POTUS is actually flat-out saying that people just ON a watchlist are denied rights, and that without ANY due process.
You do get that the watch list and no fly list ( instituted during the Bush administration) are without due process and unconstitutional, right?
|
|
|
SuperTopo on the Web
|
Let us know!