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TGT
Social climber
So Cal
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The House has always controlled the budget process.
Not even Washington could.
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, CA
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The Dimocrats ran everything for two years.
That's when Dems controlled ALL houses of Congress and the exec branch. Yet, it mush be the fault of Repubs....
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, CA
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Another mushy memory
Do you deny this? That Dems controlled COngress and the exec branch?
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, CA
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Your guys went hog wild for a few years and, voila, All Fuked UP
Maybe you need to change partys - liberals will accept guys like you if you admit you're wrong.
Reality has a well known liberal bias -
Colbert
So how long before you guys can fix our errors? How much money? What policies?
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HighDesertDJ
Trad climber
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http://www.nytimes.com/2011/08/06/business/us-debt-downgraded-by-sp.html?_r=1&hp
S.&P. Downgrades U.S. Long-Term Debt
WASHINGTON – Standard & Poor’s removed the United States government from its list of risk-free borrowers on Friday night, citing concern about the rising burden of federal debt.
The rating on the country’s long-term debt was lowered one notch, from AAA to AA+, with a negative outlook.
The ratings agency had threatened the downgrade if the government did not act to reduce the federal debt by at least $4 trillion over the next decade. Earlier this week, Congress instead passed a plan to reduce the debt by at least $2.1 trillion.
Two other ratings agencies, Moody’s and Fitch, both have said that they have no immediate plan to downgrade the country’s credit rating, giving the government more time to make progress on debt reduction. The split verdict limits the impact of the S.&P. downgrade as many consequences would be set off only by a reduction by at least two agencies.
Treasury Department officials said that the S.&P. announcement was delayed after Treasury found a serious mathematical error in a draft of the downgrade announcement, which was provided to the government earlier Friday afternoon. The officials said that the ratings agency inadvertently added $2 trillion to its projection of the federal debt, significantly overstating the problem confronting the government.
Treasury said that S.&P. conceded the problem after about an hour of discussion.
The company did not return a call for comment.
Cheney to Treasury: "Deficits don't matter"
Former Treasury Secretary Paul O'Neill was told "deficits don't matter" when he warned of a looming fiscal crisis.
O'Neill, fired in a shakeup of Bush's economic team in December 2002, raised objections to a new round of tax cuts and said the president balked at his more aggressive plan to combat corporate crime after a string of accounting scandals because of opposition from "the corporate crowd," a key constituency.
O'Neill said he tried to warn Vice President Dick Cheney that growing budget deficits-expected to top $500 billion this fiscal year alone-posed a threat to the economy. Cheney cut him off. "You know, Paul, Reagan proved deficits don't matter," he said, according to excerpts. Cheney continued: "We won the midterms (congressional elections). This is our due." A month later, Cheney told the Treasury secretary he was fired.
And in a bit of good news, despite recent numbers that the economy was tanking, job numbers are up.
http://www.nytimes.com/2011/08/06/business/economy/us-posts-solid-job-gains-amid-fears.html?hp
The United States economy continues on a wobbly course, but there was a collective sigh of relief on Friday as the government reported that employers added 117,000 jobs last month, slightly more than expected.
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HighDesertDJ
Trad climber
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bluering retorted So 1.5 Trillion in one dose would have worked? How do you know that? How do they? They were only a year apart.
I wonder if the opposite strategy would have worked better. We can both put the hindsight goggles on...
Um...not really. As I stated (and you quoted) they argued from the beginning. That's means foresight not hindsight. And your entire argument is and continues to be hindsight post after post after post. You are literally arguing against your own arguments.
Donald asked Why did unemployment increase then. If X amount was printed and/or borrowed and then released by Washington bureucrats why didn't unemployment decrease accordingly?
The rate of job loss DID decrease and then eventually changed back to job growth. The problem is that it takes a simply insane amount of growth to bounce back from the staggering amount of job loss that was incurred over such a short period of time.
Aug 2008: -84,000
Sep 2008: -159,000
Oct 2008: -240,000 <---- Market collapse
Nov 2008: -533,000
Dec 2008: -524,000
Jan 2009: -598,000 <---- Obama inaugurated
Feb 2009: -651,000
Mar 2009: -663,000 <---- ARRA (Stimulus) starts
Apr 2009: -539,000
May 2009: -345,000
Jun 2009: -467,000
Jul 2009: -247,000
Aug 2009: -216,000
Source: Bureau of Labor Statistics
That's 5.266 million jobs lost in 1 year. It will take a pretty impressive boom to recover from that in anything that we would consider "short order." Setting the benchmark at "reducing unemployment within the next year" requires ignoring the reality of how huge a crash this was.
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TGT
Social climber
So Cal
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The damage started in 1974 with the establishment of Baseline Budgeting by a Democrat congress that guaranteed a 7-8% growth in the Federal government every year..
Not that the Repubs did something about it during the few short years since then that they had the opportunity to.
That's their big failing.
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Bob D'A
Trad climber
Taos, NM
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Fat wrote: Bush did make mistakes, but none of the magnitude that Obama is making. Obama will go down as the worst president ever, even surpassing Jimmy Carter.
Another dumb sh#t republican trying to rewrite history.
History already has its five worst presidents and they aren't named Carter or Obama.
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rottingjohnny
Sport climber
mammoth lakes ca
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Fattah...you said bush f*#ked up 2 years into his first term...did you vote for him a 2nd time like the rest of the moron republidicks..?
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apogee
climber
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"Standard & Poor’s removed the United States government from its list of risk-free borrowers on Friday night, citing concern about the rising burden of federal debt."
Day-um. Funny how they announced this at 6 pm PST, well after the markets had closed for the weekend. Coincidence? I think not. 'Black Friday', meet Black Monday.
Has the S & P designated any other country as a 'risk-free borrower'?
Deficits don't matter. Nah.
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Ken M
Mountain climber
Los Angeles, Ca
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I see the scumbags have retreated. they've thrown their grenades into the heartland of the country, and crippled the small businesses of America. Now their master, celebrating in their OVERSEAS dachas, sipping their FOREIGN vodkas, couldn't be happier. Their pawns, who are as bad off as anyone else, but don't understand that they won't be getting anything out of it, think they are happy too.
They are celebrating the downfall of America! Why do they celebrate every bad report, every uptick in unemployment, every person who goes on a rampage? They want America torn apart, to be destroyed. Note that they characterize America as a product of "liberals"....something to be destroyed. You should NOT be allowed to live your lives. That is liberal. You should be told what to do. Achtung.
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apogee
climber
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"Why do they celebrate every bad report, every uptick in unemployment, every person who goes on a rampage? They want America torn apart, to be destroyed."
I don't quite buy that. I don't think they want America to be destroyed, but they are so crazy-psycho-fanatically driven to regain power over the political system that they will do or say anything that might help them get there.
The upshot is essentially the same, of course- a country driven into the ditch by selfish political and ideologic ambitions. It's really hard to understand how they can be for America, yet celebrate every negative development that comes to pass.
Hey, Repugs...didja hear? Unemployment was down this month? Is that good or bad?
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Ken M
Mountain climber
Los Angeles, Ca
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Wrong, Apogee. Because, America, as it is, today, is not what they consider America to be. It is America of Gays, Liberals, Abortionists, Illegals, Coloreds, Islamists, all of the above infiltrating the illegitimate socialist taken over govt.
America has been lost, in their view. It no longer exists.
This effigy needs to be torn down. And that is what they are doing. Be warned. The effort of the Tea Party "Patriots" in the debt ceiling battle, that resulted in the damage to the honor of our country and the reputation of our monetary system, which was the INTENTION...that was a LESSON TO BE LEARNED.
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Jingy
climber
Somewhere out there
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Ok, so the rich and the corporations have had their tax cuts, savings that have gone toward their bottom lines....
Weren't weren't we told that the rich needed to have lower taxes so that jobs could be created? The repubs called them "Job Creators"... Like little god-like figures as a group or collective.
Well that is a total sham since the dummies thought it up.
I say we get rid of all the repukes, send them to their own island, so that the rest of society can get to making the world a better place.
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Bob D'A
Trad climber
Taos, NM
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fat..you are the idiot..."Some commentators blame recent legislation — the stimulus bill and the financial rescues — for today’s record deficits. Yet those costs pale next to other policies enacted since 2001 that have swollen the deficit. Those other policies may be less conspicuous now, because many were enacted years ago and they have long since been absorbed into CBO’s and other organizations’ budget projections.
Just two policies dating from the Bush Administration — tax cuts and the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan — accounted for over $500 billion of the deficit in 2009 and will account for almost $7 trillion in deficits in 2009 through 2019, including the associated debt-service costs. [6] (The prescription drug benefit enacted in 2003 accounts for further substantial increases in deficits and debt, which we are unable to quantify due to data limitations.) These impacts easily dwarf the stimulus and financial rescues. Furthermore, unlike those temporary costs, these inherited policies (especially the tax cuts and the drug benefit) do not fade away as the economy recovers (see Figure 1).
http://www.cbpp.org/cms/index.cfm?fa=view&id=3036
Republicans...never putting the blame where it belongs.
Without the economic downturn and the fiscal policies of the previous Administration, the budget would be roughly in balance over the next decade. That would have put the nation on a much sounder footing to address the demographic challenges and the cost pressures in health care that darken the long-run fiscal outlook.[7]
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apogee
climber
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"There have been several instances since the mid 1990s in which I genuinely believed Republican politics couldn’t possibly get more blisteringly ridiculous. I was wrong; they just keep getting worse."
Why o why o why o why o why aren't these simple facts blisteringly obvious to the American public?
Either the majority of the public is really, really stooopid, or the Democrats are really, really stooopid when it comes to politics.
If the parties were flipped in that historic picture, the Repugs would have erased the Democratic Party from the face of the country.
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Bob D'A
Trad climber
Taos, NM
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fat...Without the economic downturn and the fiscal policies of the previous Administration, the budget would be roughly in balance over the next decade. That would have put the nation on a much sounder footing to address the demographic challenges and the cost pressures in health care that darken the long-run fiscal outlook.
You just don't know how to read do you??
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Jorroh
climber
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you keep saying the same thing over and over Fattrad, but its not true and repeating the lie will never make it true.
a) what was the total value of the banks losses due to mortgages going bad between 2005 and 2008. ( I'm being generous here)
b) what was the total value of bank losses due to derivatives going bad during the same period.
Ps heres a hint, the mortgage market was a few trillion, the derivatives market was around 600, thats right, 600 trillion.
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Jorroh
climber
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Good excuse Fattrad, you're not going to like the answers anyway. The sums lost due to mortgages going bad were piddling. But those losses, magnified through the derivatives that were based on them, were huge and caused the near collapse of the financial system.
So no, its not the fault of the guy who took out a second mortgage to buy a Harley. Why do you keep saying that?
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