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philo
climber
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Topic Author's Reply - Dec 6, 2015 - 05:59pm PT
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Well be sure to get back to us about that.
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HighDesertDJ
Trad climber
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TGT posted A few million guns didn't kill anyone today.
Come on, guys. Why can't we focus on the guns that AREN'T killing people? 1.5 billion Muslims didn't kill anyone today and TGT would never allege that we should see them as a threat, right? Be reasonable!
TGT posted List of unsourced headlines about armed homed defense from November
According to the gun violence archive there is roughly one accidental shooting for each defensive use.
http://www.gunviolencearchive.org/past-tolls
I don't think that anyone is arguing that "no good" comes of gun ownership, it's that on net the societal harm far outstrips the good with out current regime.
Why is it that I have yet to see a single person on the "defense" side of this thread state even a simple acknowledgement that what we're doing isn't working? All I see is attempts to undermine the validity of the claims of harm, attacks on the character of the people calling for change and Orwellian claims of "people control" and other nuttiness. I can understand people voicing opposition to a proposal such as "outlaw all gun ownership under any conditions" because this would be a radical change, but how can you look at 12,000 gun deaths, 23,000 gun injuries, 24,000 suicides 1,600 accidental shootings and 300 mass shootings and think, "yeah, that seems about right?"
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fear
Ice climber
hartford, ct
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Because the focus should be on the behavior and it's causes, not the tool. So your premise is a false one.
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crankster
Trad climber
No. Tahoe
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Sorry, there is a reason they are known as gun nuts. Trying to talk reason with them is impossible.
What we are seeing in the US is the result of letting them have their way, not having the courage to take them on and their corporate sponsors (the massive gun lobby).
Voting Republicans out of office would be a good first step. Here's why:
Republican presidential candidate Sen. Marco Rubio (FL) defended his Thursday vote against denying guns to those on the no-fly list because the federal database "has a significant number of errors."
Rubio suggested on Sunday's episode of "State Of The Union" that the no-fly list is impeding too many law-abiding citizens from purchasing a gun.
"They shouldn't be used as a tool to impede 700,000 Americans or potential Americans -- people on that list from having access to be able to fully utilize their Second Amendment rights," Rubio told CNN's Jake Tapper.
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HighDesertDJ
Trad climber
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fear posted Because the focus should be on the behavior and it's causes, not the tool. So your premise is a false one.
So you're saying that Americans are just naturally homicidal? And that given our psychopathy our permissive gun laws aren't a problem?
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jonnyrig
climber
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There are plenty of people who claim no good comes from gun ownership. There are alsoplenty who advocate total disarmament. There are also plenty who own firearms that recognize a need for change, or at least that changes could be made that would be both effective and not violate rights. If you dont recognize them you should open your eyes a little.
Where we all differ is in our definition of acceptable restriction and our willingness to compromise.
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crankster
Trad climber
No. Tahoe
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Very good post, jrig.
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philo
climber
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Topic Author's Reply - Dec 7, 2015 - 07:00am PT
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overwatch
climber
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There are alsoplenty who advocate total disarmament.
This won't happen without another Civil War. I agree, good post, JRizzy
I would probably be called a "gun nut" by most of you although I don't worship them like some; it is a tool in the toolbox. I have a flak vest as a seat cover in my car.
I probably have more time behind the trigger in actual training than most here, to the tune of 1000's of hours with one of the original schools in the country. I have carried a gun for a living.
It needs to be much harder to get weapons, penalties for illegal possession increased, as well as for those that provide weapons for others to commit crimes, better mandatory training and actual psychological testing for would be permit holders. I would agree to just about anything short of confiscation
Maybe then "they" will leave our ammo alone?
Edit;
last line tongue in cheek. Another good post DJ
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HighDesertDJ
Trad climber
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There are plenty of people who claim no good comes from gun ownership. There are alsoplenty who advocate total disarmament. There are also plenty who own firearms that recognize a need for change, or at least that changes could be made that would be both effective and not violate rights. If you dont recognize them you should open your eyes a little.
Where we all differ is in our definition of acceptable restriction and our willingness to compromise.
Where is that conversation taking place? Sure there are random people who may say those things but there are no advocacy groups pushing for those changes. There is no proposed legislation to ban all guns. There are no gun rights groups calling for gun legislation reform or proposing solutions to our problem beyond "open carry for everyone" and "blame the mentally ill."
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High Fructose Corn Spirit
Gym climber
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From God Himself...
.....
fear wrote...
The Christian vs. Muslim meme has been intentionally inflamed again because it works. Divide and conquer...
ISIS is a Western invention. Created, trained, funded and run by parts of our own government with Israel, SA, and likely others lending a hand.
If that ain't just plain crazy what is.
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HighDesertDJ
Trad climber
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Everyone knows this is just Park Service propaganda to draw attention away from them dumping sewage in the rivers and killing all the bears.
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High Fructose Corn Spirit
Gym climber
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Brainwashed stoopid fool you are ....
Well, good morning "Dipshit".
"Werner is by several yardsticks the most solid person posting here, though you might need to know him beyond this thread to realize that."
Uh-huh.
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HighDesertDJ
Trad climber
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HFCS- That speech was almost certainly at the same weekly gathering that Trump and Sanders spoke. Attendance is mandatory. His statement, "we could end those Muslims," obviously is disgusting.
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WBraun
climber
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Check out that size of that attendance.
Yep and you are in it by posting that YouTube.
This proves you're an idiot .......
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HighDesertDJ
Trad climber
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And Werner just commented about it. Now's he's part of the conversation.
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High Fructose Corn Spirit
Gym climber
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hddj, it's all pretty depressing. On many levels.
Another: Imagine the number of accredited lawyers and eventually justices that that university unleashes over the years on the 21st century Am culture.
Thanks J Falwell.
It it any wonder our nation is so schizo (split/divided) on these many issues.
We've got to get the Abrahamic God out of the thinking, out of the mindset, out of the problem solving.
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overwatch
climber
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Interesting link, DBag.
I would also add to my post above, penalties for people that have guns stolen, or have in home negligent shootings, indicating a lack of responsibility in proper storage and securing of firearms.
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