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sempervirens
climber
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Feb 27, 2017 - 06:51pm PT
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Nah, there is so much more power and control to be had with a shallow dip.
I'm gonna agree with Gnome about the above. If you go too low your feet are usually too spread out and your body weight isn't above the middle of the skis. Also it's likely you'll have too much weight on the back ski; in which case you're in the back seat. If you're in the back seat your front ski isn't doing its job, it's unweighted and kinda flailing around, also when in back seat it's difficult to do the next turn cause the weighted tails are sticking into snow and don't want to turn easily, especially on steep slopes. Your weight should be equally distributed on both skis at all times. That's easier said than done, of course, especially in bumps or anytime you're skiing aggressively. Also, if your feet are spread apart too far you risk having the uphill ski crossing behind the downhill foot, I did this yesterday on Scott Chute at Alpine Meadows. Not pretty, but it helped build character. Admittedly, that is just my mistake but it can't happen if I keep my feet under me.
The heel of uphill boot should be below your butt, not way back behind you. Check it out on pp. 10 and 11 of Allen & Mike's Really Coo Tele Tips.
you can see a fake-a-tele turn a mile away, they keep their front leg straight, which means they aren't weighting the back leg and just doing an alpine turn on their front ski and letting the back ski go along for the ride.
I agree with that also. You shouldn't have a straight front leg, and it's common for beginning tele skiers to do that. If you keep that forward pressure of shin on boot it helps keep skis under you. I've been doing lunges, stationary bike, and the invisible chair to help make all this technique possible. I have a ways to go but the strengthening has made a great difference.
Look at photos of Isa and the woman in blue & white. They are often low but their feet are below the butt, and knees are close together. Compare to Craig Fry's photo, which is a cool photo and looks like a great run, and you can see the space between skier's knees. Close that gap and you have more power, better balance, ready to snap into next turn 'cause the uphill ski doesn't have as far forward to travel.
...yeah, I probably got too much time on my hands, ha, ha.
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tradmanclimbs
Ice climber
Pomfert VT
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Feb 28, 2017 - 03:14am PT
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jim for the win!
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Cragar
climber
MSLA - MT
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Feb 28, 2017 - 08:29am PT
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I found AT to be far physically easier but I also blew out both knees with fixed heels so go figger.
I hear this. Man, both! Hope they've gotten stronger after fixing? I'll use my DynaFit sh1taqua for touring and getting around, but if I am on a chair DHing all day, there will be no heel blockage. I parallel more on my NTN than any other binding and even just that little micro-bounce of the heel feels better than blockage. Last year was the first I tried Alpine and the locked heel felt very awkward and I hated the feel of the what I feel is thee most boring turn one can do, reminds me of English cooking, or boogie boarding v. surfing. When I go BC it is almost always easy mellow descending, I do it for the travel, views and solitude; I just want an easy ski for traveling.
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perswig
climber
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Feb 28, 2017 - 10:35am PT
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I just want an easy ski for traveling.
Yep, mobility always seems more 'free' with freeheel, in that I can manage the little kids' yardsales, tuck 'em into a wedge on steep bits, pull them out of tree wells w/o as much rigamarole. I also seemed to skin better with neutral Targas and blown T2s than I seem to do with tech bindings. Go figure.
I need to ski more.
Dale
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tradmanclimbs
Ice climber
Pomfert VT
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Feb 28, 2017 - 03:23pm PT
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skinned the little ski hill near my cabin after work today. perfect corn snow 3 weeks too early but still pretty fun. I was flying down the hill at about my top speed and bambi was flyiing accross the wide open hill at her top speed. very cool. she passed about 20ft in front of me. we both timed it perfectly.
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Urmas
Social climber
Sierra Eastside
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Feb 28, 2017 - 03:54pm PT
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Look at photos of Isa and the woman in blue & white. They are often low but their feet are below the butt, and knees are close together. Compare to Craig Fry's photo, which is a cool photo and looks like a great run, and you can see the space between skier's knees. Close that gap and you have more power, better balance, ready to snap into next turn 'cause the uphill ski doesn't have as far forward to travel.
I agree with Sempervirens here. Isa is clearly a very powerful skier. She skillfully utilizes a very large range of flexion and extension, without getting overly spread out. That's awesome. I only question how often it is functional to go that low. If the guys dig it, however, more power to her!
If you stay low, you can't project the center of mass very far into the new turn, and if on the other hand you use the full range of flexion and extension, it seems you would be working too hard. A taller stance allows the CM to move aggressively into the new turn, with relatively little effort. I'm all about making it easier these days!
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tradmanclimbs
Ice climber
Pomfert VT
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Feb 28, 2017 - 04:12pm PT
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you have to see her in motion to believe it. that mid eightys video does not do her justice . the newer gear and perhaps 30 more years to perfect it... She never did go for the T1s though. Mostly T3s and then T2s for her 50th bday. If its not steep she parelles. when it gets steep she starts the telle short swing and its that deep every turn and I have seen her do top to bottom on Outer Limits in the monster bumps so fast that it looks like an olympic bump skier and if you don't know her you don't even realize that she is on pins untill she gets close. it is insanly smooth. She claims it takes less effort the way she does it......
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G_Gnome
Trad climber
Cali
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Feb 28, 2017 - 04:21pm PT
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Craig, I would agree that when I get in trouble I really hunker down. But if I am skiing aggressively, especially in the bumps, knees tight together, pushing hard on both skis and staying fairly shallow is really fast and allows much faster transitioning from one turn to the next. And pull and drive around your poles just like when paralleling.
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F
climber
away from the ground
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Yeah, that is Asahidake. Pretty cool spot.
Chicks that wear knee pads on the wrong side of their pants are a (tele) turn on.
Getting that low is not neccesary no matter what gear you have. Stiffer boots equals higher stance equals energy saved. Welcome to 2017.
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WBraun
climber
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How many Dr F's are there here?
Nice style on your boards there shredding on those steep slopes ......
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ydpl8s
Trad climber
Santa Monica, California
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Old blue Karhu's with Voile bindings. I was always better at the stand-up/balance/3-pin/pseudo parallel than the telemark. Easier on the knees.
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Cragar
climber
MSLA - MT
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TUA stands for...
'Two a' season, as in 2 pairs per season. I always thought the Valmonte X was their best ski. T-mark was better served by Atomic and other 'Austrian' skis IMHO.
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Cragar
climber
MSLA - MT
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I bet eh! That would hella suck, Did it break along the angled joint directly underfoot? I never understood that, an engineering mistake on the TUA's behalf. That was where my Toute Niege broke.
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Urmas
Social climber
Sierra Eastside
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Thanks for the kind and flattering words, New World Order 2!
There are various approaches to Telemark skiing, fortunately. Some folks are very strong and ski amazingly with a lot of up and down, or just low and scissoring. With my background as an Alpine instructor, I simply adapted functional Alpine skiing mechanics to the Telemark. To put my approach into a nutshell; I believe the best skiers are those who can store energy into the skis, and release it at the proper moment. In other words, the equipment works hard so you don't have to.
Wish i could get out with y'all, and compare notes. Talking about it just doesn't get it!
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F
climber
away from the ground
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I believe the best skiers are those who can store energy into the skis, and release it at the proper moment. In other words, the equipment works hard so you don't have to.
Ski fast, stay HIGH...
If your knee is on the ski, you just bottomed out your suspension.
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Urmas
Social climber
Sierra Eastside
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That's right, F. If the knee is on the ski there is very little edging (tipping or angulating) possible. Edging creates pressure, and pressure loads up the ski. That's why a taller stance allows the equipment to work better.
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tradmanclimbs
Ice climber
Pomfert VT
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This is a shot I took for Telemark ski magazine of Isa and her daughter Nina. Isa is in the back. you guys can diss her low style all you want but I would bet $$$ that none of you could match her turn for turn free sking and you would definatly get smoked in gates ;) A few weeks ago one of her fellow swiss ski instructors was giving Isa a hard time about haveing an out dated style. She burned him right off the hill. He tried to hang with her for a bit and gave up. Ski school directer saw the whole thing and complemented her in front of everyone ;) extra sweet as she is the oldest instructer in the school.
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Charlie D.
Trad climber
Western Slope, Tahoe Sierra
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DMT, we have similar roots as I suspected....
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drF
Trad climber
usa
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I was part of the leading edge of the new wave tele with phat skis, plastic boots and cable bindings with risers.
Bwahhaha.....ya sure ya were. Fry's world...gag
I'm the real Dr. F not the fake dr f
Muahahaaha...the always fake #realDrF#
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Brandon-
climber
The Granite State.
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I only have a couple of photos documenting that I did, indeed, tele ski for a few years. I learned in NH, dialed in 'teli heli's' at Mt Sunapee. Ripped Tuckerman Ravine. Taught freeheel skiing at Steamboat, and quit it all because alpine skiing is better for jumping off of stuff and going upside down. Backflips on tele skis are easy enough in the park, but on the mountain a fixed heel just makes life easier.
My only photos, Mammoth '97. My Crispi Pro Comp boots were the best out there at the time, I think.
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