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corniss chopper
Mountain climber
san jose, ca
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Sep 14, 2009 - 09:52pm PT
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Curt
Interesting/ Took a look at this article and as usual Joe hides
the meat towards the end.
"It's hard to know for sure what doctors mean when they speak about a public option, says Dr. James Rohack, president of the AMA.
"Because when I say public option, or you say public option, it means different things to different people, kind of like the Rorschach ink blot test — when you look at it, to some people it means one thing, to other people it means the other thing."
Good find. Demo's how perception is drunk driving the debate.
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Curt
Boulder climber
Gilbert, AZ
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Sep 14, 2009 - 10:00pm PT
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Hey corniss,
I find it interesting that the only one in that study having a perception problem with what a "public option" means, is the president of the AMA--an organization that has taken a position against such an option. Also, if he is truly confused as to what a "public option" might eventually mean, how can he already be on the record as opposing it?
Curt
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corniss chopper
Mountain climber
san jose, ca
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Sep 14, 2009 - 10:01pm PT
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radical - since Beck is doing the job CNN , CBS, ABC, etc are not doing why the interest in sacking him? (rhetorical question)
Going after the messenger because of his message is so medieval.
Change the channel if you don't like it.
Curt -We'd need to hear how the question was asked to know for sure. Pollsters can be tricky going back to re-ask a question to see if opinions have changed during the long series of poll questions. Cleverly phrased questions can lead to answers you might not generally make.
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Gary
climber
Desolation Basin, Calif.
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Sep 14, 2009 - 10:15pm PT
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Why are the Republicans so wrong on everything? Just spend some time with thr freepers at freerepublic.com to find out.
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Bob D'A
Trad climber
Boulder, CO
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Sep 14, 2009 - 10:23pm PT
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Corniss wrote: Rumors coming out of DC are that the Whitehouse
has gone into a bunker mentality.
That all that you posts is rumors and hearsay.
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TGT
Social climber
So Cal
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Sep 14, 2009 - 10:46pm PT
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CABLE NEWS RACE
FRI., SEPT 11, 2009
FOXNEWS O'REILLY 3,212,000
FOXNEWS HANNITY 2,644,000
FOXNEWS BECK 2,544,000
FOXNEWS BAIER 1,968,000
FOXNEWS SHEP 1,705,000
MSNBC OLBERMANN 1,067,000
MSNBC MADDOW 948,000
CNN BLITZER 889,000
CNN KING 875,000
Monday's numbers ought to be interesting
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shut up and pull
climber
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Sep 14, 2009 - 10:51pm PT
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From Powerline -- the best center-right blog out there:
Do you have to be smarter to run a dry cleaning shop than to be President? In some respects, yes. If you are a dry cleaner and the numbers don't add up, you go broke. If you are President (or a Congressman) and the numbers don't add up, you just tax or borrow more money. No one has ever said that Barack Obama is a numbers guy; in fact, his ignorance of mathematics is just one facet of his ignorance of business and economics.
Obama lards his speeches with statistical factoids, but they are frequently wrong. For example: he loves to tell audiences that Denmark obtains "20 percent of [its] electricity through wind power." Sure, Denmark is a flat, windy place, but it still isn't true. The Institute for Energy Research explains:
The report finds that in 2006 scarcely five percent of the nation's electricity demand was met by wind. And over the past five years, the average is less than 10 percent -- despite Denmark having 'carpeted' its land with the machines. ...
The upshot? The Danes retain the title of world's most prolific wind producer, and President Obama cites their experience as a path to be followed. The cost? Danish ratepayers are forced to pay the highest utility rates in Europe.
All told, each new wind job created by the government costs Danish taxpayers between 600,000-900,000 krone a year, roughly equivalent to $90,000-$140,000 USD.
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apogee
climber
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Sep 14, 2009 - 10:52pm PT
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What's your point, TGT? That a whole lot of people are stupid enough to watch FauxNews? We already know that- most of them were stoooopid enough to elect Shrub not just once, but twice.
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Norton
Social climber
the Wastelands
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Sep 14, 2009 - 10:54pm PT
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who cares about cable news shows
The REAL action is the networks, ABC, NBC, CBS
They get 27 MILLION viewers a night on their news combined.
That almost TEN TIMES what all right wing FOX FAKE NEWS gets.
Long live liberally biased NETWORK NEWS !!!!
The ONLY reason Obama kicked McCain's ass was because of
the liberal bias in MSM. NO OTHER REASON.
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Curt
Boulder climber
Gilbert, AZ
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Sep 14, 2009 - 10:57pm PT
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"...Curt -We'd need to hear how the question was asked to know for sure. Pollsters can be tricky going back to re-ask a question to see if opinions have changed during the long series of poll questions. Cleverly phrased questions can lead to answers you might not generally make..."
This wasn't FOX News or MSNBC. This was a peer-reviewed study published in the New England Journal of Medicine--and the methodology was clearly stated. To claim that systematic bias was somehow involved smacks of desperation and a stubborn refusal to accept the clearly stated outcome.
Curt
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Karl Baba
Trad climber
Yosemite, Ca
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Sep 14, 2009 - 10:59pm PT
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Know this: Politics has become a science and poliical science is a changing field where it's practical applications use the tools and theory of high levels of advertising and public opinion and attitude polling to play on peoples weaknesses and bias.
Sadly, to me, it has become clear that the GOP and it's friends have decided that attempting to destroy Obama is more in their interest than cooperating in getting things done in a compromise manner (and Obama has tried hard to govern from the center and reach out)
To that end, it's clear that the message going to to latch into people's fear is that
1. Obama is different than you, and threatens your ways. They don't come right out and say "He's black" but never fail to use his "islamic" middle name, suggest he's not a real american, and emphasize discredited controversy about his birth. There is all kinds of inuendo about Obama that's a veiled substitute for what focus groups have shown will stick "He not for us or one of us" It's near racism and works because of racism. Largo is right all along.
2. The socialist label is the chicken little cry with little or no substance. Obama isn't governing so different than Clinton or even Bush. Plain fear and division tactics.
Honest patriots and conservative who don't wish to belong to an extremist party should distance themselves from this continued downfall of the honor of the GOP and embrace positive change they can work with.
PEace
Karl
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Karl Baba
Trad climber
Yosemite, Ca
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Sep 14, 2009 - 11:01pm PT
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Corniss wrote: "Rumors coming out of DC are that the Whitehouse
has gone into a bunker mentality. "
Stupid Fox news "somebody said" BS
The guy has given a number of major speeches this week alone! Remember when Bush almost never spoke?
Peace
Karl
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Russ Walling
Gym climber
Poofter's Froth, Wyoming
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Sep 14, 2009 - 11:03pm PT
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How did you pinkos end up so far off the rails?
DEATH PANEL NOW!!!!1111666
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John Moosie
climber
Beautiful California
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Sep 14, 2009 - 11:04pm PT
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What Fatty wrote,
"You're working under the assumption that every person who gets cancer should get treatment, the free market would tell you that not all will/should." Fattrad..
Russ, here is another Death Panel member for you.
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Norton
Social climber
the Wastelands
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Sep 14, 2009 - 11:08pm PT
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Karl gets it right.
NO major Republican has the balls to denounce the extreme right
wing.
We even have dumbass "birthers" posting here on this thread.
No forum Republican has come out strongly against all the
ignorant, hateful rhetoric of the extreme right wing.
They STILL don't get WHY they keep losing elections.
So let's quit telling them. Don't educate them anymore.
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John Moosie
climber
Beautiful California
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Sep 14, 2009 - 11:09pm PT
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"You're working under the assumption that every person who gets cancer should get treatment, the free market would tell you that not all will/should." Fattrad..
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Norton
Social climber
the Wastelands
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Sep 14, 2009 - 11:17pm PT
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Oh stop the "free market" crap.
The only markets that are truly free are the pure electronic
trading markets.
Why would anyone listen to Fattrad talk about markets.
He and his clients are SHORT for three weeks now and losing
money. They have no stop loss in place.
The Obama BULL MARKET is killing Fatty.
Fatty has NO credibility as regards markets. HE IS WRONG.
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corniss chopper
Mountain climber
san jose, ca
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Sep 14, 2009 - 11:17pm PT
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Norton - still people are curious about the strangest things.
Like what was the doctors name that delivered our first
afro-American President?
He should be famous, and a bit of a celebrity. Always good for business.
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apogee
climber
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Sep 14, 2009 - 11:20pm PT
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Jeepers, cchopper, your idiocy knows no bounds.
Edit: Are you sure you aren't Juan?
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Largo
Sport climber
The Big Wide Open Face
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Sep 14, 2009 - 11:27pm PT
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When I said to cut the budget on some of those things I was being facetious. Sorry if someone misinterpreted my drift.
And I ain't no pinko nor yet a socialist as it is normally defined. Interesting note: My oldest daughter was a foreign exchange student in Gustrow, in the former East Germany, and the German family visited us one time in Venezuela, a few Christmas' ago. Chavez was just kicking his Castroesque socialismo into gear and the German family said, word for word, "Socialism doesn't work. WE know." Meaning they knew, without a shadow of a doubt, that old style socialism does not work.
However a new, enlightened socialism, one driven by a regulated free market, will someday be the most stable system going. Folks who read this thread in 100 years will call me a soothsayer - mark my words.
But the hot item of contention is that the far right is actually a watered down white supremacy group. Wonder what that makes the far left?
Now get to posting, bitches. A hundred to go . . .
JL
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