Discussion Topic |
|
This thread has been locked |
WBraun
climber
|
|
|
Nov 21, 2010 - 03:20pm PT
|
So ... there ya have it, the Russians speak, and confirm a missile.
It's all over now, finished!
The Russians have a fat lady and will now sing.
We will now move on to solving 911 and the moon ....
|
|
monolith
climber
Berkeley, CA
|
|
|
Nov 21, 2010 - 03:37pm PT
|
So does that mean the missile was carrying an EMP device Klimmer?
|
|
Tony Bird
climber
Northridge, CA
|
|
|
Nov 21, 2010 - 03:41pm PT
|
it's hard to trust russians with opera. much better at ballet.
here's my point on the chemtrails or, if you will, exaggerated contrails. you're going to link me to one of the debunking pages which have grown up over the past year, and i'm going to tell you up front why i don't buy their chopped-up science.
do me a small favor and take a look towards the end of klimmer's recent chemtrail thread:
http://www.supertopo.com/climbing/thread.php?topic_id=1286602&tn=240
some guy named abenda showed up there--who knows, maybe another disinformation artist trying to counterspin this whole mess--talking about geoengineering. as i posted in that thread a short time previous to that, secret geoengineering could actually make some sense as a drastically urgent measure to shore up the ozone hole, something you'd never be able to get noisy environmental organizations to agree about. from where i sit, i stopped hearing all about the terrible ozone hole about the time the chemtrail activity picked up. just look at that last photo monolith posted there. is there any other conceivable explanation for that ridiculous criss-crossed air traffic? maybe the eccentric quadrillionaire who runs the world is scottish and prefers to see plaid skies?
clouds form at dew point, which is a function of temperature, pressure and humidity. clear air means we're above dew point. push any of those factors across the line and the invisible water vapor jumps right out of its gaseous state onto tiny, invisible dust bits, turning to liquid, reflecting light, becoming a cloud or fog.
once upon a time, chemtrails/exaggerated contrails never existed, not the hint of one. i've asked this question several times on ST, which is full of oldtimers like myself, some even older, who have been outdoor people all their lives and lived gloriously under the beautiful sky and should have some memory either to back me up or differ with me. i'd welcome either one. i raised it with healyje on that chemtrail thread, but he has not deigned to answer. i'll bet he can't. i'll bet no one remembers skies like this before 20 years ago, maybe not even before 10-15 years ago.
BITD the contrail would form and then disappear a short time later. the scientific explanation of that? the jet thrust hits the air pretty hard, then immediately behind the thrust there's a burble, a drop in pressure, and the cloud forms. the heat of the exhaust would tend to work against cloud formation, but the drop in pressure is so great that a cloud forms in spite of the heat. and it stays there for a short while, the plane passes, and the atmosphere returns fairly quickly to its previous state, above the dew point, and the sky clears. you still see normal contrails. you'll see them in the same skies with chemtrails. explain that.
the anti-chemtrail people argue that the disturbance is such that the clouds just keep forming and forming, filling the skies. the chemtrails people will counter that what produces this is the injection of aluminum and boron compounds. why? ha, let's not get into that here, let's just talk about whether we're looking at the product of normal dew point science with the atmosphere somehow disturbed as never seen before, or whether something secret is going on.
perhaps another argument for you normalists would be that the skies are so damned full of soot from the intense air traffic of the past 20 years that the contrails just get going that way. funny how that never became an environmental issue.
either way, it would be pretty easy to prove this out with some credible sampling, which doesn't seem to be taking place. much safer to spend your time folding tin hats. stoop too far and you could lose an argument.
there has been anecdotal news coverage of this, including a los angeles television station which interviewed residents of running springs who felt they were reacting allergically to a day of particularly intense activity.
|
|
raymond phule
climber
|
|
|
Nov 21, 2010 - 03:55pm PT
|
Tony, I have a short question.
Why is it that chemtrails only seems to exist when there is a lot of humidity at high altitude?
|
|
Tony Bird
climber
Northridge, CA
|
|
|
Nov 21, 2010 - 04:06pm PT
|
not having a humidity gauge up there, i wouldn't be able to answer that. i assume you do, or believe those who tell you so. but if that's all true, explain how they end so abruptly, which is how the subject got into this thread.
|
|
raymond phule
climber
|
|
|
Nov 21, 2010 - 04:17pm PT
|
"not having a humidity gauge up there, i wouldn't be able to answer that. i assume you do,"
The existent of usual cirrus clouds is a sign of humidity. The knowledge of fronts approaching is another sign. It is of course also possibly to look at forecast soundings or real soundings to determine the humidity.
"or believe those who tell you so."
What can I say about comments like this?
"but if that's all true, explain how they end so abruptly, which is how the subject got into this thread."
I don't know what you mean but the humidity at altitude changes quit a lot and can change very abruptly.
This chemtrail conspiracy is probably the most stupid conspiracy I have heard about. The first premise in regard to the existence of chemtrails is just wrong in regard to basic meteorology (sorry forgot that all meteorologist, meteorological text book writers and forecasts are obviously involved in the conspiracy...)
|
|
Tony Bird
climber
Northridge, CA
|
|
|
Nov 21, 2010 - 04:54pm PT
|
you're not answering the questions, just phulishly ridiculing them, attempting to place yourself on a plateau so far above us all that your mere scorn will suffice. great strategy, unfortunately so overused on ST that no one cringes from it any more.
"can change very abruptly"? are we looking at the same postings by monolith, immediately above? are you proposing that humidity varies in a wild overlay of wet and dry noodles to produce all that onning and offing? sounds like fantasyland to me.
so, shouldn't chemtrails mostly be appearing in cirrus skies? but one of their specialties is filling up the clear, clear blue.
i'd like to see some 40-year-old photos of chemtrail-filled skies, laid down by 707s. not worried about that, however. as we all know in these information wars, ask, and it shall be given unto you.
|
|
monolith
climber
Berkeley, CA
|
|
|
Nov 21, 2010 - 05:10pm PT
|
Oh Tony, you have much to learn.
Here's a WW2 vid of contrails from bombers. Were we spraying back then?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wfOrez6q7WM
Check out at 42 seconds. Watch the contrail sputter, then at 48 they've stopped completely.
Can we put this sudden stopping contrail crap to bed now?
^^^^^^^Look Tony, the contrails have suddenly stopped^^^^^^^^
|
|
MisterAnswers
Social climber
Ark on the Moon
|
|
|
Nov 21, 2010 - 05:10pm PT
|
Question: Do clouds, which turn out to have alot in common with contrails, dissipate on short time scales?
Answer: Of course not.
Question: Has Del Cross discovered a very important fact?
Answer: Yes! I told you that Klimmer was bluffing! Now the question of why he would make up an easily refutable (I guess for Tony Bird that would be "rephootable") fact is far too deep for me. Perhaps when he comes clean, he will explain.
|
|
cintune
climber
the Moon and Antarctica
|
|
|
Nov 21, 2010 - 05:12pm PT
|
|
|
monolith
climber
Berkeley, CA
|
|
|
Nov 21, 2010 - 05:17pm PT
|
I've viewed Klimmers color 3d with the glasses on the Massive Ark thread. Complete crap.
Yet I've used the glasses on other color 3d images and they work amazingly well.
|
|
Klimmer
Mountain climber
San Diego
|
|
|
Nov 21, 2010 - 05:20pm PT
|
I did look at them. The stereograms had essentially no 3D quality to them at all. The visual cues were coming primarily from nearby clouds.
I was expecting the 3D effect to be pronounced but instead it is completely lacking.
The stereograms are totally unconvincing.
Del Cross,
You are a liar to say the 3D effect is completely lacking. You debunk yourself.
There is plenty of 3D effect, and yes you can tell the exhaust/vapor plume direction easily.
Of course the Cirrus clouds help. They are clearly in front of the exhaust/vapor plume and this is easily seen in 3D. And yes they certainly add to the depth perception. You can clearly see the top of the exhaust/vapor plume receeding away from the Cirrus cloud. The base of the plume is closer to the bottom Cirrus cloud and the top of the plume is much further away from the top Cirrus cloud. This wouldn't be true if the plume was coming toward the observer.
Thanks for seeing the Cirrus clouds do indeed help. Yes, you saw that because of the 3D effect.
The upclose stereograms are even more incredible. For a jet to follow that exhaust/vapor plume, it would have had to be going straight up clock-wise spiraling, and then radically climbing to the W - WNW at a very steep angle away from the coast. Boy, must have been a wild ride for the passengers. They must have felt like they were on the Space Shuttle (sarcasm).
Answer: Yes! I told you that Klimmer was bluffing! Now the question of why he would make up an easily refutable (I guess for Tony Bird that would be "rephootable") fact is far too deep for me. Perhaps when he comes clean, he will explain.
Mr. A,
Yea, sure I am Mr. A. I'm making it aaaaaaaallllllllll up. (sarcasm)
I've viewed Klimmers color 3d with the glasses on the Massive Ark thread. Complete crap.
Yet I've used the glasses on other color 3d images and they work amazingly well.
Mono,
Yea, sure they are. Uh, huh. (sarcasm)
Boy you guys are desperate. Like I said, don't forget, don't eat any Turkey for Thanksgiving, Cannabalism is a sin.
|
|
monolith
climber
Berkeley, CA
|
|
|
Nov 21, 2010 - 05:30pm PT
|
Better enjoy the turkey Klimmer, it will be a good break from all that crow.
|
|
healyje
Trad climber
Portland, Oregon
|
|
|
Nov 21, 2010 - 05:31pm PT
|
A regular Einstein on calculations, but totally unable to plot 250 on the sat pic...
|
|
Klimmer
Mountain climber
San Diego
|
|
|
Nov 21, 2010 - 05:45pm PT
|
Cragman,
I doubt you have faith in Christ, because you sure don't act like it. Why do you participate in name calling and personal attacks? That isn't Christ like.
As Jesus said, "You will know them by their fruit."
I try to argue facts, and I try deperately not to make it about the person or to use ad hominem attacks. (Ok, I admit I called them Turkeys. My bad. A moment of weakness.)
I will not apologize for someone who is lying and misrepresenting the truth and spreading disinfo, and then calling them on it.
|
|
healyje
Trad climber
Portland, Oregon
|
|
|
Nov 21, 2010 - 06:03pm PT
|
Hint - the sun set south of your missile track, not north of it.
|
|
WBraun
climber
|
|
|
Nov 21, 2010 - 07:21pm PT
|
Why would you want to mess with another mans vice?
|
|
healyje
Trad climber
Portland, Oregon
|
|
|
Nov 21, 2010 - 07:55pm PT
|
Hint#2 - the sun couldn't have provided this illumination on Klimmer's northern NW 'missile' track with a 250 solar azimuth.
It could have provided exactly this illumination to the more southern commercial flight contrail in the same sat pics.
|
|
Klimmer
Mountain climber
San Diego
|
|
|
Nov 21, 2010 - 08:17pm PT
|
Cragman,
I wouldn't mind meeting you, I'm up in Bishop often, have a second home up there.
Do you really think that you, me, your pastor, and my pastor are going to see eye to eye on much? That will be about as fun as needles in my eye.
We'll agree on the Trinity, Salvation through the Grace of GOD, the Blood of Jesus Christ, Our Lord and Savior, and many other good news issues, but hardly anything else.
Does your pastor like to talk and study about Revelations and the End of Days? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eschatology
The NWO? 9-11 Truth? Aliens? Nephilim? Angels and Fallen Angels? Theistic Evolution? Bible Code? Mystery Babylon? etc. etc. etc.
Do you really think I can talk about these things with my pastor? Hardly. He is still a good man and I learn a great deal from him and everyone. But some topics are "The Secret Forbidden Knowledge," and are avoided like the plague in most Churches. Lol. You must know this.
There are those faithful Christians and some are indeed pastors, who do go further, go down the rabbit hole, they are not afraid, and they do not avoid the hard topics all mentioned above facing our times. And yes GOD's word talks about all of it. So if GOD's word talks about it, why can't we? We should. I'm pretty sure he wants us to know about all of it, because he put it in his word. He wants us to know. He doesn't want us to be fooled. "Without a vision my people perish."
And yes, I do read their books and studies:
PhD Chuck Missler
PhD Michael Heiser
David Flynn
Tim McHyde
PhD David Jeremiah
and many others . . .
So what about that mystery missile? Back on topic . . .
By the way, the event on 11-8-10 off of L.A., CA, either happened as many witnessed it, or it didn't.
This isn't a conspiracy. It is easily verified as a missile or jet. There is empirical evidence. Facts are facts. It is provable. No faith involved what-so-ever.
Now why would people want to lie about what the truth of the event was, is a whole other story. What are they hiding? Why would they do this? To avoid panic? It's not the act that gets you into trouble, but often it is the cover-up.
People should simply tell the truth, including governments.
|
|
|
SuperTopo on the Web
|
Let us know!