Discussion Topic |
|
This thread has been locked |
Licky
Social climber
California
|
|
|
Topic Author's Reply - May 30, 2005 - 07:56pm PT
|
I just heard an interesting story about a couple of guys from Yosemite that had attempted to go to Chamonix only to get hung up in a bordello in Bourdeux and ended up refocusing their attention to the point of spending everything they had.
Anyone heard story?
|
|
chainsaw
Trad climber
CA
|
|
Well I guess some folks dont understand what I mean. One person said that erasing history will cause young people to idolize these "strung out" climbers. Just the opposite, fool. The kids already idolize them, not necessarily a good thing or my fault. But since Lynn Hill and John Long are huge icons in climbing, to portray them as drug dealers and addicts is definately encouraging kids to try that path. Very likely the people involved may have never done any of the things you assume. Ugly rumors are not history. But if one of my kids trys pot or gets hurt because of your stupid book..... Again I say, write a book about what YOU did and expose yourself, not others. Are you a climber or just a muckraker? Or a con artist looking to get leverage against people I care about? Do the climbing community a favor: LEAVE.
|
|
chainsaw
Trad climber
CA
|
|
Dear Licky, Your knowlege of the details of this "incident" suggests that you were involved with organized crime which has no statute of limitations. Furtheremore, your assets gained by criminal acts can be seized by the federal government at any time, without trial, indefinately after the fact. Also, your income tax evasion will lead to the same. Are you ready to answer alot of questions? Keep it up bud, we're keeping tabs on you. PS: watch out Largo, you're getting worked!
|
|
can't say
Social climber
Pasadena CA
|
|
chainsaw you sound like a tool..are you?
|
|
chainsaw
Trad climber
CA
|
|
Hey Ballorama, your reply makes my point for me. If you think modern contemporaries will find reason in your argument that "pot took the edge off the acid" then spout on. And I'm not impressed that you have been in the valley for 30 years. That just means that you are still living in the 70's. I think I know who you are and you look like you have a lot of mileage. Drugs have messed up your mind. Who knows what you could have been if you hadnt wasted your life getting high. Are you really even experiencing climbing? Drugged out and anesthetized, I doubt you have the courage to climb without the cruch. What do your wife and kids think of your drug habit? Or did you miss out on that part of life, getting high instead. Rock on Ballorama, honestly I can relate to your sentiment having been a drugged out looser myself some 17 years ago. Funny thing is I grew up and got sober. I feel really sorry for you. But keep on promoting Licky's stupid ideas. Your support does him more damage than my criticism ever could.
|
|
ricardo
Gym climber
San Francisco, CA
|
|
actually chainsaw sounds more like a born-again ..
.. dude needs some help..
|
|
shakey legs
Trad climber
san diego ca
|
|
The staute of limitations on felony drug charges is three years. If there are murder charges then there is no statute of limitation. If you have concerns about your situation please feel free to call me at (619) 743-0121 or email me directly. I am a criminal defense Lawyer. My primary practise is Federal drug crimes in southern California.
David
|
|
chainsaw
Trad climber
CA
|
|
maybe I am a tool. The fact is licky can publish whatever he wants. Total hypocracy it is for some to wave the first ammendment at me. I never said he couldnt write these things. I merely expressed my and others opinions and frustration. Evidently those who have minority opinions are not allowed to speak them by your version of the constitution. I am brave enough to speak my mind regardless of what you think. I am not a sheep who follows people he is scared of. I have my own opinions and I am not afraid to be the only one to oppose lickys stupid book. And shame on this Pam lady for trying to profit from her husbands death. In my tradition, the dead are left in peace.
|
|
climberweenie
Trad climber
San Jose, CA
|
|
chainsaw: "But if one of my kids trys pot or gets hurt because of your stupid book....."
sounds like you have more serious parenting issues if your kids are so fragile as to be tempted by such a book into doing stupid stuff. there are plenty of more compelling opportunities in their faces every day than a book about some old dudes they don't care about. then again, if the book is about you, you have some 'splaining to do! hard to walk the 'do as I say not as I do' rope as a parent.
spend more time building relationships with them and helping them form a strong independent identity, rather than trying to stop the creation of every temptation in the world. if your parenting is in any way similar to your forum exhortations, you are probably setting your kids up to lack judgment skills that they will need when presented with the very situations you are concerned about.
|
|
Licky
Social climber
California
|
|
|
Topic Author's Reply - Jun 1, 2005 - 09:47pm PT
|
Chainsaw, if you are the guy that fell into the lake, seems to me you might want to shed some light regarding the events. Especially if it will help end the rumors that continue to float around.
You are welcomed to call, email, or post what you know.
Thank you in advance.
|
|
Licky
Social climber
California
|
|
|
Topic Author's Reply - Jun 1, 2005 - 10:02pm PT
|
Yeah, I figured, but you have to give me credit for being such a nice guy.
|
|
Watusi
Social climber
Joshua Tree, CA
|
|
Geez!!! I remember some Whipping Headaches from that stuff!!! Reeking of fuel, but damn cheap!
|
|
Ballaroama
Trad climber
so.cal
|
|
Whatever chainsaw, yawn. I could care less what you think of me and I'll bet you don't know who I am. Do you really care? I love the part about the wife and kids, yeah, if you don't have a family your a looser. Go preach somewhere else jackass.
edit: just tried to call Rob Trelford - aka chainsaw, and the schmuck hung up on me. With a little research I found he is a coach for USA climbing and the bad influence on the kids he coaches maybe has something to do with his worry about the book.
Piss off Rob. Saw a photo of you on the web and can assure you we have never met. I am in the Valley right now if you wish to talk. Come on up and see me!
But with the idiotic slander you spewed my direction is pretty funny stuff. So all your slander must be directed at the person you assume me to be. I haven't consumed any recreational drugs for more than a decade Rob and for someone that coaches children you should be ashamed of yourself for spewing divisive garbage that increases the chances of your of your students becoming idiots like you. Rob Mr.USA CLIMBING, you should hold yourself to a higher standard when you preach your pathetic gospel. For the guy that posted something about "hero's" your blather is really funny because some of these hero's of yours were big time drug addicts as opposed to myself.
|
|
WBraun
climber
|
|
Yea there were some chainsaws up at that lake.
Chainsaw was that one crazy mofu-cker waving that saw around when he accidentally sawed half his head open. Guys came running over and had to stuff his brains back in and use a speedy stitcher to sew him back up, as the story goes.
He never quite was the same after that ......
|
|
Ballaroama
Trad climber
so.cal
|
|
Chainsaw is Rob Trelford from USA climbing so his ranting about "were watching you" is very interesting. Is USA climbing a Law Enforcement agency Rob? Just wondering if you teach those gym rats to be rats???? You suck Rob and though I haven't met you like you think, I know know who you are now and I can't wait to have a word with you in person. Piss off coach bitch and pull on some plastic while you pull your pudd chump.
Can't help but add a few things about ROB TREFOLDS mentoring of kids at USA Climbing. Here is a guy that obviously thinks we should hide the truth from developing minds when of course the truth shall set them free. Bastardized history should be used for birdcage liner not the propaganda tool for christo-fascist bigots like you. In the words of Bob Marley "Tell the children the truth". If you were worthy mentor you would a better understanding of history. So what if this book gets published, Rick has already stated he has no plans on exposing names (scroll up) so I don't know what you are worried about. Maybe you want all youth to be singing Onward Christian Soldiers along with you cause it makes you feel good??
|
|
chainsaw
Trad climber
CA
|
|
Dear Ballorama,
Alright I give up. I'm sick of dealing with you. The forum was supposed to be for discussing ideas and opinions. Not for hunting down and harrassing people. Calling me at home was a very bad idea as is lickys book. Do not ever contact me again or I will take legal action against you. I have nothing to do with what happened at the lake, but it continues to haunt the entire climbing community. A dark specter to be erased, not glorified.
And yes I am a USA Climbing coach. At USAC we discourage drug use and the self destructive mentality that goes with it. You are the one with bad judgement, not me. I have stood up and spoken out against drug use by climbers and against glorifying the stupid things people did in the seventies. My strongest climber and gymnast just washed up because she got sucked into her mother's crank and coke world. Tragic. It is easy to say that diluting the temptation out of their world doesnt help. Perhaps you are right. But when you loose your loved ones to jails institutions and death it leaves one pretty upset and wanting to do something about it.
And you can call it co-dependance if you like. All that idealistic crap about letting go sucks. It is easy to say but impossible to live. Yea maybe my mind is messed up from all the suffering that sh#t has caused me and others. I lost my mother and a sister to drugs. My mother is a hardcore valium addict. My oldest sister died recently of a heroin overdose in Canada. Her husband was a dealer. Another personal friend of mine was likely killed in Humbolt last year over a deal gone bad. No-one knows what happened to him but the FBI would like to know. This is not a f*#king game people.
Stop what you are doing and think about the consequences. Of the thousands of young people who will read this book if even one chooses to "try this at home" then it was not worth it. Take responsibility for your actions. And I can see your rhetoric coming; "well why dont you take responsibility for your own sh#t, chainsaw, and stop blaming others?" The fact is I was the helpless unwilling child who had no choice but to live with that sh#t for ten awful years. And yes it f*#ked me up bad. Maybe I am crazy. I would do anything to take it back but I cant. I would do anything to save even one child from the suffering I have known at the hands of addiction. And I do not have any children of my own because of it. I am the looser with no family because drugs destroyed it. And then I chose to follow in the footsteps of my heros at the time. Unfortunately they were pop culture icons and musicians. Their influence led me down the path to destruction. Since then I have earned two degrees, I have a masters and I work as a biology professor. I have pulled myself up out of the dark and taken responsibility. I am the one in nine who makes it back from where I went. The other eight are dead and gone.
I coach a climbing team of kids who need my help to stay straight. I help other peoples kids deal with alot of problems their parents cant even begin to understand. I have learned that the Davis junior highs now have heroin and cocaine sold there. My kids tell me the things their parents couldnt hear. I know what they are dealing with and I shudder everytime another one goes down the tube.
Its funny how people have so much hatred and anger towards me just for my opinion. Can it be that in your heart you know that what I say is true? Furthermore, if you dont care what I think then why did you violate the privacy of my handle and call me at home? That kind of action is taking things too far. If you dont like what I have to say then dont read it. Calling me at home and threatening me is outrageoous. And you say "I have not done recreational drugs in ten years" If you have actually cleaned up your act then why do you support the glorification of something you yourself have finally accepted as wrong. I know my delivery is pretty confrontational. Just remember this famous quote; The truth is first disregarded as nonsense, then violently opposed and finally accepted as self evident. In my mind what I have said is very self evident. All the deaths and problems associated with the lake incident make it pretty clear. If you want to continue to violently oppose what I have said then go ahead but I will not be listening. As of right now I am dropping out of the forum and discontinuing my supertopo membership. I am not interested in associating with people like licky and balloramma and so far that is what I have found on that site.
I do know of one climber from Davis who would hopefully support what I have said. She was smart enough to stay out of drugs, unlike many of her cohorts at that little gym. Where are you Beth?
|
|
Ballaroama
Trad climber
so.cal
|
|
Fair enough Rob, and my condolences about your family members and others you know that have died due to drugs. I will not call you again as well, no worries but I couldn't help it knowing all along who you were. You stepped into the forum and look what happened, you got called on your BS. Don't imply threats have been offered by me, not so. Unless you consider wishing to talk it over a threat.
|
|
can't say
Social climber
Pasadena CA
|
|
Licky...put me down for two copies of the book.
|
|
chainsaw
Trad climber
CA
|
|
Alright ballaroama. I apologize. You have a right to your opinion. But publishing my name while you remain annonymous is cowardly and disrespects the spirit of the forum. People may wish to be annonymous so they can speak honestly. Now I am afraid to speak honestly about anything because you had the nerve to call me at home. And trust me, you do not want to meet me in person. Incidentally, Bob Marley whom you quote died untimely of lung cancer related to his overuse of pot. Didnt you know that? If I am to tell the children the truth as I see it, then I say the truth is :dont do drugs. they destroy people. that is the dark side. If you do drugs your life will be affected in ways you cannot understand until it is too late. And as far as barging into the forum, that is what it is for. And everything in it is pretty much venting and BS. calling me at home means that you obviously take it too seriously. Now i am taking it very seriously because you threatened me. And why do you hate Christians so much? My opinion has nothing to do with it. I dont believe in churches and all their dogma. seventeen years ago I would have actually argued in favor of your point of view. but life lessons, not dogma are what I base my opinions on.
Anyway, truce okay? I will gladly listen to what you have to say as you have done for me and I respect that. Sorry if my emotions got away from me. But when your loved ones die, it changes you forever. I will never recover from what happened to me. All I can do now is try to help others avoid that. And as far as the gym rat stuff goes, you are way off. My kids are becoming trad leaders like me. I was a professional arborist for a long time and I've had my share of close calls. If I were stoned when those things happened I would have gotten killed many times over. Climbing at the level I do outdoors requires 100 percent of my focus and I cannot afford to be high. It might not even be me who dies as a result of my own stupidity if I were to climb stoned. Guiding children in the outdoors is not something for stoned people to do. And what would their parents think? They have a right to know that their kids are safe. I am their protector. Why do you think I reacted the way i did? i see this book as a threat to their welfare.
I guess I will stay in the forum a bit longer to see if we can resolve at least not to do anything stupid. OKAY?
|
|
|
SuperTopo on the Web
|
I remember the US Customs finally going up to the lake and using helicopters and divers to do a lot of the recovery (of what was left!). I just had to pimp these guys a bit and talked to some of them in El Cap Meadow (where the choppers landed). The Customs guys told me they were doing "training" up in the mountains.
Let us know!