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HighDesertDJ
Trad climber
Arid-zona
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Oct 12, 2008 - 01:03am PT
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LEB it's a precise parallel. You saw a blog post, literally an opinion, and it "felt right" to you and you decided it was true. Game over, case closed and all contrary information is readily ignored. I really couldn't think of a better parallel if I tried.
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MisterE
Trad climber
My Inner Nut
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Oct 12, 2008 - 01:12am PT
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I gotta say Greg has shown a pretty good and sensible explanation of the irritating part of Lois!
Thanks for your reasonable..ness...
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HighDesertDJ
Trad climber
Arid-zona
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Oct 12, 2008 - 01:25am PT
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"It is just this simple. I read facts and if they appear to come from reliable sources, I accept them. If I feel the source is shakey, I question it."
Seems pretty clear to me LEB.
The bottom line is that you do exactly that which you claim that you don't: you have made up your mind ahead of time what you believe and simply choose to believe it regardless of facts or information. I haven't been trying to convince you to vote for Obama, I'm just trying to get you to actually call facts facts and opinions opinions. I have made the facts regarding ACORN and Obama clear and have backed them up with objective journalism. You have stated your opinion and backed it up with another's opinion. That's the bottom line.
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Karl Baba
Trad climber
Yosemite, Ca
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Oct 12, 2008 - 01:28am PT
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"In both of his own books he describes his socialist/colectivist philosophy and its origins in great detail. "
I'm tired of GOP apologists bringing up socialism as an issue when GOP administrations have ratcheted up the debt and spent more than DEM administrations.
Is spending money on human socialism so much better than corporate and military socialism? Have you read McCain's mortgage bailout proposal. Isn't Bush's medicare perscription plan just corporate socialism disguised as human socialism?
This "socialist" tag is just a buzzword so small minds can latch onto a fear about liberals
peace
karl
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dirtineye
Trad climber
the south
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Oct 12, 2008 - 01:42am PT
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LOL, the LEB claims she needs facts, but she NEVER makes any use of them.
Nuff said.
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HighDesertDJ
Trad climber
Arid-zona
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Oct 12, 2008 - 01:51am PT
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LEB when you once again become open to objectively verifiable information feel free to give a holler. Please cease spreading rumors as if they are facts, and acting incredulous when people don't believe you in the meantime.
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MisterE
Trad climber
My Inner Nut
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Oct 12, 2008 - 01:52am PT
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Jaybro
Social climber
wuz real!
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Oct 12, 2008 - 01:54am PT
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Can anyone finish this sentence?
'The problem with cradle to grave health care is '
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HighDesertDJ
Trad climber
Arid-zona
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Oct 12, 2008 - 02:05am PT
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It was totally fact. Except that it wasn't. It was in fact "fact" that was easily disproven with fact.
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HighDesertDJ
Trad climber
Arid-zona
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Oct 12, 2008 - 02:19am PT
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Really? Consulting whom exactly? The only things I consult are information sources when I actually need to verify facts (not "facts"). I'm always happy to link my sources, and if they are dubious I'm happy to find others.
All of the "facts" in that blog are regarding ACORN. They may or may not be true. The one line that mentions Obama is this: "ACORN attracted Barack Obama in his youthful community organizing days. Madeline Talbott hired him to train her staff -- the very people who would later descend on Chicago's banks as CRA shakedown artists. "
That's it. That's all. She fails to mention that Obama "trained" these people for 2 hours and they might or might not have been the same people involved in the alleged scandal. It's a simple hack job and one that you have fallen for head over heels.
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Jaybro
Social climber
wuz real!
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Oct 12, 2008 - 02:20am PT
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And how, exactly, does that differ from what you get it you have insurance?
¿Someone (an investor) doesn't makes as big a profit?
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HighDesertDJ
Trad climber
Arid-zona
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Oct 12, 2008 - 02:25am PT
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More people actually get covered so you have to "share" your providers with smelly, gross people basically.
There is actually pretty good evidence that we have too MANY providers instead of too few and that providers simply do more stuff to the fewer patients they have if there is a shortage of patients. This results in unnecessary procedures being done and all around waste plus an increased number of injuries and death due to the higher number of procedures being done.
"Overtreated" by Shannon Brownlee is a great synopsis of the work done by the Dartmouth Atlas over the past 30 years. It's a pretty eye-opening read.
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HighDesertDJ
Trad climber
Arid-zona
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Oct 12, 2008 - 02:38am PT
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You're acting like losing you is a difficult task, LEB. Why so surprised?
Also LEB the gov't already pays the majority of your salary LEB. They are the biggest payer in town by leaps and bounds. In fact, the reason that health care is a good living at ALL is because of Medicare.
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Mick Ryan
Trad climber
Kendal, English Lake District
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Oct 12, 2008 - 02:52am PT
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> The Europeans are not necessarily stupid people.
Why thanks LEB.
> I very much favor capitalism so there is no way I am going to support anyone who is even remotely socialistic in his thinking. I will add that I favor a version of capitalism which I will call ethical capitalism.
I think you will find that most of Europe favors capitalism to and practices it.
Problem with health care in the USA is that there are too many middle men taking a cut - bit like the banking/financial system.
Mick
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HighDesertDJ
Trad climber
Arid-zona
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Oct 12, 2008 - 02:52am PT
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LEB if you knew your history you'd know that most doctors made little more than skilled laborers before Medicare came along. You can't look at your current situation as a snapshot and pretend everything leading up to it didn't exist.
Also for someone who decides the facts of other's lives based on blogs you sure are defensive.
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John Moosie
climber
Beautiful California
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Oct 12, 2008 - 03:03am PT
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"Between 80 to 90 percent of my patients are charity care or Medicaid with Medicare and Insurance making up the other 10-20%"
Is this true or sarcasm?
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dirtineye
Trad climber
the south
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Oct 12, 2008 - 03:04am PT
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Claiming that medicare makes doctors rich is just stupid.
Most good docs will not see medicaid or medicare patients if they can help it.
The gov pays VERY LITTLE.
My dad used to complain that the gov would pay LESS than the cost of buying and giving an immunization. So how does that make medical professionals rich?
The only medical people getting rich off medicare and medicaid are the ones defrauding the gov.
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HighDesertDJ
Trad climber
Arid-zona
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Oct 12, 2008 - 03:04am PT
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Hey LEB I'm just quoting facts. I realize that you don't want them to come to light, but there they are.
Also I'm pretty sure I found a video of LEB at a recent McCain rally (Friday).
http://the-uptake.groups.theuptake.org/en/videogalleryView/id/933/
"Quinnel says she obtained the information on Obama being an Arab at "her local library" and from a pamphlet obtained at a local McCain campaign office (provided by a fellow volunteer not the campaign itself). She has taken it upon herself to redistribute the information as widely as possible by making copies of the pamphlet and sending it to random names in the phone book."
Partial transcript:
"Noah: You called him an Arab terrorist? Is that correct? Why do you think he is an Arab?
Quinnell Because his dad is. If you… I’ll send you the paper.
Female reporter: His dad is Muslim His dad was Muslim. Barack Obama has never been a Muslim.
Quinnell No but he’s….
Dana Bash of CNN :he’s a Christian.
Quinnell He’s not an Arab either, he’s a
Bush: His father was Muslim, and he’s a Christian.
Quinnell Yeah , but he’s still got Muslim in him. So that’s still part of him. I got all the stuff from the library and I could send you all kinds of stuff on him. In fact….
Bush: What did you think about McCain said. He said he’s a decent person.
Quinnell Well he did have didn’t have (unintelligible) I think McCain wanted to (unintelligible) I don’t think he wanted to say anything against him. You know he didn’t want to cut him down. That was my way of thinking. I don’t think he wanted to cut him down. So he just kind of brushed me off. "
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Karl Baba
Trad climber
Yosemite, Ca
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Oct 12, 2008 - 10:39am PT
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"Between 80 to 90 percent of my patients are charity care or Medicaid with Medicare and Insurance making up the other 10-20%. "
Sounds like your job depends on "socialism" What do you think your patients would do if Medicare and Medicaid were eliminated? Just get better jobs?
PEace
Karl
On-off topic edit: GOP is looking at not only losing the top job but also many senate seats. When the criminals in charge seem to be losing their protection from being investigated and prosecuted for their many crimes, the time between now and november may be one of the most dangerous times in the history of America. I don't think they will take this lying down, (the question is if patriots in the government and military will foil any funny business)
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