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survival
Big Wall climber
Terrapin Station
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This isn't even close to the longest siege in history.
If Largo is correct about 800 days, it's getting pretty damn siegeful up there.
I still admire the hell out of them.
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Lorenzo
Trad climber
Oregon
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If Largo is correct about 800 days, it's getting pretty damn siegeful up there.
I still admire the hell out of them.
Me too. The whole thing boggles.
I think people are measuring siege days differently.
Did Largo say how many days he spent on the One Day ascent of the Nose? ;)
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Jaybro
Social climber
Wolf City, Wyoming
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I recognize that freeing the thing is infinitely more difficult than aiding it, I dont. different skill sets. is there one person who can do both modes?
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survival
Big Wall climber
Terrapin Station
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is there one person who can do both modes?
Of course. Surely you know that. I have lead some 11s and 12s, but I've been best suited to starting out on the ground with a good partner and grinding our way up wall routes, aid included.
What about guys like Steve Schneider? Surely you consider him skilled in both modes. Bridwell etc etc etc etc....
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Jaybro
Social climber
Wolf City, Wyoming
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I don't see the Bird, iconclast that he is, freeing this...
im just saying, dont be belittleing aid climbing. it's not just any one, even if they climb 5.14 all day, who could walk up to the base of something like this and figure out how to aid up it, as a first ascent.
Shipoopi, may be as close as it gets, in bridging these two worlds at that level. Free climbing is more in vogue right now, but saying its "infinitly harder" to free climb this, than to consider having the Chutzpah, to pick out the line, with the gear of the time,and considering rescue potential, etc, is disingenuous.
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Andy Fielding
Trad climber
UK
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It's even been reported in the British press. Oh hang on it appears the big stone has changed shape over night!!
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survival
Big Wall climber
Terrapin Station
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Disingenuous? Not at all.
Disingenuous: not candid or sincere, typically by pretending that one knows less about something than one really does.
The aid climb was a first ascent. The free climb is not. But there are deviations from the line that Harding wouldn't/couldn't have dreamed of.
So they're really two completely separate things.
Exhibit A: I can aid climb damn near anything.
Exhibit B: I cannot even come close to free climbing damn near anything.
Disingenuous? No. Number one, I did not pretend that I know less about the topic than I actually do. Number two, I was absolutely sincere.
How is that disingenuous?
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Oplopanax
Mountain climber
The Deep Woods
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Personally I suspect it ain't never going to go as an uninterrupted redpoint flow from bottom to top.
The wonder kid redpointed a 400 m 5.14b on granite on his second day on it after taking two falls the previous day, did another 700m 14b route nearby, and he's onsighted 14d and redpointed 15c since then on granite. Climbing the Dawn Wall in a single-push redpoint is well within his abilities. I expect he'll send it in the next few years and you'll have egg on your face then.
http://www.planetmountain.com/english/News/shownews1.lasso?keyid=37647
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Don Paul
Big Wall climber
Denver, Colorado
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^ that's just it. There's no indication that any limits have been reached, like the comparison to running the mile, particularly because new tricks and techniques are constantly being invented. Maybe someday there will be 5.14s all over el Cap, with all the holds marked by chalk and no attempt ever to place gear on lead. That's ok, it just doesn't capture my imagination. I think the Fitz traverse in Patagonia is a far more interesting project. Also, and this may annoy some people, I think their style is more like sport climbing, despite the runouts and apparently taking whippers onto birdbeaks and other aid gear. If it was that dangerous, one or both would already be dead. I'll bet it will be repeated, however hard it is, and that people will try to beat their style. That's the nature of the game.
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Jaybro
Social climber
Wolf City, Wyoming
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So they're really two completely separate things.
My point exactly!
And, as far as my use of the word "disingenuous", i probably should have said disrespectful, but disingenuous works, by the definition you posted, Survival, or the more widely used used colloquial definition meaning more, say, "condescending."
When you say, " I could get up anything on aid" and
"the free climbing is infinitly harder than aid climbing the route" -paraphrase-
Your'e lumping all aid climbing, whether its climbing a bolt ladder, hanging on pieces of a free climb, or delicate hooking, beaking etc, into the same basket. As you know, with all the walls you've done, there are different levels of aid climbing. At its extreme end it is a fine craft with dire consequences for failure. The statement you made implies the same assumption that Royal Robbins made about this very route, when he assumed it was a trivial bolt-up worthy of chopping. As we all know, when he got up there, he changed his mind.
When I said disingenuous, I meant it in the sense, that you were dissing the difficulty in aid climbing, when you knew better. I assume this was out of carelessness, rather than intentional avarice, but again, i think that, you knowing more about aid climbing than your statement lets on, you did, indeed, make a statement that can be defined as disingenuous.
Then, also, there is the fact that the aid route and the free route don't cover exactly the same ground, so it's impossible to declare one, harder or easier, than the other.
Cheers'n sh#t, and lets go climbing!
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Sula
Trad climber
Pennsylvania
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From Rhodo-Router:
Automated Comment Form For The Layman:
1. If you're not curing cancer, [insert endeavor] is obviously purely selfish and ego-driven.
2. My taxpayer dollars better not be going towards this nonsense??!!
3. Totally insane/obvious death wish/[your armchair DSM diagnosis].
4. Irresponsible!! What about the children?!
5. I can't even see the climbers from the meadow, but what's the deal with all those bolts??
6. If they have a smartphone up there, all possible motivations other than craven greed/attention-seeking are automatically invalidated. Excellent. You could add:
7. Anyone not using the Park exactly as I do is obviously irresponsible and possibly crazy.
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Lorenzo
Trad climber
Oregon
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Btw, who was up there doing the Porch Swing naked? Dude is genius.
I figured it was Eric.
Dude hasn't denied it.
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MisterE
Gym climber
Bishop, CA
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have you guys heard Tommy Caldwell is climbing the DAWN WALL
Isn't there another guy up there with him? Kurt or Kevin?
;-)
Beasts!
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