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Roughster
Sport climber
Vacaville, CA
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Didn't read the whole thread, but I just want to share my opinion. As a quick note, I don't care about the using dogs issues. I honestly don't think it has really made much difference in the numbers of bears harvested.
Hunting and Fishing are both in severe decline. There are a number of reasons for this:
 Cost My 2014 fishing license plus stamps/cards for fisheries I will use was nearly $100. My 2013 hunting license plus stamps/cards/tags was over $100. This is on top of the ~$100 I paid to get recertified since they wouldn't accept my Washington License that I got in the 80's. This isn't much for me, but it is for a lot of the people who hunt for a primary source of food for their families. My guess is a rising number of poachers and under reporting true harvest #s due to cost.
Public Land Hunting Sucks! You would not believe how little public hunting is available. It is often unclear where it is, what the special regulations for that area are etc.. It is not impossible to find good public hunting area, but it usually takes a 3-4 hour drive with another 2-3 hour hike to clear the beaten down areas. Too boot, you have to leave your car / truck vulnerable to tweakers who will break your window to see if you have quarters in your center console. I have had my truck broke into probably 10 times over the last 20 years between fishing, hunting, and climbing. It gets old :(
No Baiting in CA Think of this not from an ethical issue but a competition issue. Hunter in middle of nowhere = no bait. House ='s all the bait the bear wants. Our bears are trained to co-habitat with people for the free food. I truly believe there are less and less "wild bears" every year. This is backed up anecdotally by the higher number of bears killed by DFG as nuisances. If a bear is near a house, it is almost assured to be a hunting restricted area.
Meat Fewer people see bears as "food". I have eaten bear all my life coming from eastern Washington. My wife and kids wouldn't touch bear if I covered it Prime Rib.
I don't think a decline in hunting and fishing is a good thing to be honest. It is one more step to the complete dependency of the general population on an unsustainable consumerism model.
I grew up fishing and hunting in and out of season because literally that's how poor my family was. If we didn't get a deer or other harvested animal, it meant the family went without meat until we did. The majority of people making decision and posting on internet forums are so disconnected from the realities of people who don't live in an urban area. It is rather frightening to be honest. Urban California is not reality, it is a consumerism at its finest and it is slowly sucking the soul out of us as a people.
You don't have to be a redneck to hunt and fish. You don't have to be unethical or "mean" to harvest an animal. It certainly doesn't make you any less compassionate because you hunt. What hunting does teach you is a very upfront and personal lesson in the emotional and physical cost of a taking a life and justifying it against your need. In today's day and age we need to encourage activities that get the general population, particularly kids, out of their cities and into the wilderness. The less people who identify with activities in the outdoors, the more we are at risk of losing those places entirely.
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Salamanizer
Trad climber
The land of Fruits & Nuts!
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So much ignorance on both ends of this subject.
Running dogs in Cali is mostly done by guide services. It increases the success rate for those who don't have time or ability to hunt bear themselves. However, it's almost astronomically expensive and you will pay for your convenience, which ironically like it or not pumps tens of millions of dollars into the economy annually.
Now reguardless of my opinion on hunting with dogs, if you think that it's an easy affair, like shooting monkeys in a cage, you're obviously ignorant of the whole thing and just talking out your ass. But if you think the dramatically decreased numbers of bears taken annually as a result is a good thing, you're just blissfully ignorant, which is no surprise coming from the typical California populous.
It shows you know nothing of wildlife management and the absolute nightmare environmental impacts that it will have on the bear population in Cali. And you think shooting them in a tree is cruel? Not to mention taking away a big chunk of the revenue currently used to fund conservation and wildlife management and replacing it (yet again) with the almighty fleeting taxpayer dollar. Typical dumbass Californians, feelings before common sense and judgment before information.
And if you must know, I think running dogs on bears is a retarded game reserved for the rich and those with way too much time on their hands.
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thebravecowboy
Social climber
Colorado Plateau
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It ain't free solo hunting if you don't use only a knife Salamanizer, Ss Conglomerate. You folks missed the nature of the mano a mano discussion. It's aid.
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Toker Villain
Big Wall climber
Toquerville, Utah
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If people hunt for bear they should eat the whole animal and use the pelt.
I have no interest in bear meat, but if people hunt legally with dogs then I don't object, although I don't consider it good style.
The way I see it, with hunters contributing more $ towards conservation than all the left wing bleeding hearts, I'll overlook poor style. Hunting regs overall have been a success story. In many cases endangered species have made comebacks as a result.
I will however agree with donini that redneck season might be fun. Sure wish we also had "tourist season" in the spring so we could thin the herd before they overgraze.
I can't believe that Dingus is so out of touch as to believe feral hogs aren't a problem. THEY ARE A HUGE PROBLEM!
Hunting them on the ground solo is SCARY sporty even with a powerful weapon. You don't get much time before you become the prey.
I've considered going to Texas and hunting them with a Rock River from a helicopter. Looks like great fun (and they have ground crews that finish off wounded animals so it is relatively humane).
This is a case of doing great benefit to the public.
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jonnyrig
Trad climber
formerly known as hillrat
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Actually, hunting pigs with a knife is specifically illegal in Cali. Sorry TBC.
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Chaz
Trad climber
greater Boss Angeles area
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A lot more Californians hunt than you may think.
Shoot-Shovel-&-Shut-Up is practiced around here, with no limits and no tags to fill.
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this just in
climber
north fork
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DMT probably knows they are a problem, but when compared to humans they don't tear up anything which was his point. Pig hunting is my favorite and you definitely are vulnerable on the ground. I'm eating pig burger tonight.
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thebravecowboy
Social climber
Colorado Plateau
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Jonnyrig, I know, it is such a bummer that more states do not permit trad-hunting. I mean, I think that an atlatl or other primitive weapon would be way cooler. For some reason though (humane kills, easyness) it is not in style or legal. And, for the record, I think machine guns aginst hogs is actually fairly legit. I think the primitive weapons are more suitable for native prey.
I might just have to go out and poach me some little critters to get on level ground with you folks, huh?
This dude loves hunting hogs with the full auto. You guys could go together, TV.
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Toker Villain
Big Wall climber
Toquerville, Utah
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Well that guy has a good reason for full auto. How are you going to run away with your pants around your thighs?
Dingus, you come hunt the "little piggies" in the thick tamarisk forests along the Virgin by Bunkerville, and then tell me how there is no danger.
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jonnyrig
Trad climber
formerly known as hillrat
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Yeah. Thats it. Go for the sarcasm.
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thebravecowboy
Social climber
Colorado Plateau
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you don't wear your pants like that when you go shooting TV?
It is very interesting DMT that for all the pig-shooting bloodthirsty culture I hear about in this country, I have yet to encounter a man-mauled by pig story.
Awright, enough of this yargle-bargle. It is sunny. Let's go climbing.
EDIT: Ron A, deep down, you would dig it if I were into the c*#k, you know it. I think I might just have to buy you a Pink Pistols membership, so you can embrace the gun-loving big bear that you have locked up inside.
The proof is in the pudding, Ron A: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed?cmd=Retrieve&dopt=AbstractPlus&list_uids=8772014 Homophobia is apparently associated with homosexual arousal that the homophobic individual is either unaware of or denies
http://www.scientificamerican.com/article.cfm?id=single-angry-straight-male
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this just in
climber
north fork
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Have either of you ever been pig hunting?
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thebravecowboy
Social climber
Colorado Plateau
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Yo, N. Fk, I spoke to this a bit above:
I might just have to go out and poach me some little critters to get on level ground with you folks, huh?
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mouse from merced
Trad climber
The finger of fate, my friends, is fickle.
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Whadda herd of pigs in the woods, including the Pig of the Woods, diggin' up last year's crop of mouldy acorns.
Buncha pork-eaters.
Hey, I'm smiling. I got me some popcorn. :0)
And Wayne called. He's bringin' donuts.[Click to View YouTube Video]
http://www.whiteoak.org/historical-library/fur-trade/voyageurs/
Headin' oujt for brunch first. And some serious football.
In the Trophy Room!
Which is Dingus, which is Ron, and who et Al?Yeehaw and I'm off to the rodeo!
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donini
Trad climber
Ouray, Colorado
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Some Californian's can hunt....Nancy Pelosi, allegedly, bags her limit every time she goes quail hunting.
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Salamanizer
Trad climber
The land of Fruits & Nuts!
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Then we DO agree as I said they were retards.
On many things... of course we do!
But no offence, listening to you talk about hunting is like listening to a tourist tell you all about those climbers up there while sitting at El Cap bridge. To those with the same knowledge base I'm sure it sounds interesting, but to those in the know, it's almost embarrassing.
I'm with Toker on this one as usual. It's unsporting, but the alternatives are worse than looking the other way.
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this just in
climber
north fork
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DMT, that makes me respect your view more, even though I disagree. I have two friends who have had to jump outta the way of a charging boar. They are tough, crazy, and unpredictable.
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mouse from merced
Trad climber
The finger of fate, my friends, is fickle.
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Please, look both ways at deer crossings, Sara Palin may be laying in abush.
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Salamanizer
Trad climber
The land of Fruits & Nuts!
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That's absolutely true Ron.
I'm a NEWB myself. I'm running like 0-15 or something like that on deer. But I made my own bow, I make my own arrows, string, mocs and it takes me like 15 hours to get close enough to make a shot.
Edited to add: F-this, you BEWBS argue amongst yourselves... I'm going climbing!
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this just in
climber
north fork
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In the scenario you describe they're scared to death, cornered and fighting for their lives. Blaming the pigs for being hunted or thinking they are crazy for defending themselves is a sad misconception.
I agree. I hunt them for the meat and wouldn't hold it against the animal for that reaction.
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